clown spawn

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9147754#post9147754 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fizhstiks
thanks

if the brine shrimp develop spines after 24 hours, what happens if some of the brine shrimp make it past 24 hours in the larvae tank?
Click to expand...

Good question. I don't remember that being a problem, but if you suspect that there are too many brine shrimp you can strain the water through whatever plankton collector you're using to strain rotifers.

A larvae who has over eaten, gotten too big a brine shrimp, or gotten a brine shrimp shell will drop to the bottom and spin in circles. Sometimes you can see a little bloody spot by their gut. If you see that going on, you can shut off the lights to stop them from eating while you strain out excess food/shrimp.

You should be getting close to metamorphosis. What day are you at with this hatch?

When they start kind of holding still for a second and curling their tail funny, it is a sign that they're getting close. Metamorphis is the next dangerous time when it is easy to lose some. Watch your ammonia carefully and do small water changes and keep the bottom siphoned now. Once they start curling their tail, you need to NOT do water changes till they make it through metamorphosis.

Metamorphis is just amazing. They change practically overnight.

Here are some pics of one of my batches:

Day 8 - starting to get close:

33483Baby3.jpg



33483almostafish.jpg



33483Batch2Day11.jpg


See how much change in only 3 days?
 
wow the change is awesome, i hope i can get a couple through metamorphosis.

They are 7 days old today. I only have 4 left now and i dont know why they are dying. i did the rotifer thing with the hydrometer and i counted 17-18 rotifers in the 3/8" circle. Ive been doing small water changes everyday, i siphon all the junk off the bottom and replace the water i took out with water from the main tank. The last few that died were swimming really fast and in circles with their mouth wide open. Maybe they choked on a rotifer or something?
 
Have you started brine shrimp? It can be overeating or choking. It is very common to lose some larvae when you first introduce brine shrimp.

Check their tummies. They should start to turn pink, but shouldn't look like they're going to pop or have red spots.

When you hatch your brine shrimp, be meticulous about culling the brine shrimp from the shells.

Or to be really safe, you can decapsulate the shrimp eggs before you hatch them.

Here is the recipe:

up to 1/2 teaspoon dry brine shrimp cysts in 2 oz freshwater and wait 60 to 90 minutes.

add 1 ounce of bleach. stir continuously and watch the cysts change from dark brown to gray to white and finally to orange. This usually takes about 5 - 10 minutes.

Rinse the eggs under freshwater using a plankton collector. Neutralize the bleach by adding dechlorinator

Then put in the hatcher and hatch as normal. They'll hatch more quickly .. sometimes as short as 8 hours.

When they hatch, there won't be any shells to choke the babies.

Sounds like you're doing right. It's just really hard to get them through this stage and everybody loses some. Wilkerson even talks about losing entire batches between brine shrimp introduction and metamorphosis.

But they need the brine shrimp to store the energy to get through metamorphosis.

Hang in there and keep us posted.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9136979#post9136979 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Kmiec123
The more variety the better...have read keeping lower than 40% shrimp based is a good idea. Couple times a week is great. one feeding per day to saturation, till they wont take anymore food is also a good idea...Hope this help...Carl
Click to expand...

I think the saturation feeding worked!! After i posted on tuesday, i read about feeding them til the wont eat anymore and i started doing that tuesday. Ive been doing it since tuesday and they just laid their eggs today. I cant see the whole nest but from what i can see, there must be about around 200-300 eggs!!!

I only have 3 larvae left, one just died. Maybe im giving them too much light and theyre using too much energy? I turn the light on at 6:00am and turn it off at 10:00pm. What kind of lighting schedule should i have for the larvae tank?
 
Its day 8 and I still have two that are hanging in there. Ive stopped doing water changes since theyre probably getting close to metamorphosis right? One of them is swimming at the surface at a 45 degree angle. Is this normal or is something wrong with it? He still seems to strike at food but for some reason he swims like that most of the time. The other one just likes to hang out in the corner and does not move alot. Both have full stomachs.

What are some signs that metamorphosis is going to happen soon? Does it happen at night or does it happen throughout the day?

thanks for all of your help
 
The surest sign is a funny curl to their tail. It's kinda hard to describe, but you'll know it when you see it.

Their entire way of swimming changes during metamorphosis and they'll look kind of clumsy and confused. They'll change from the tail propelled zip of larvae to the waggle swim of a clown.

Do you have some Ammo-lock or something like that in case your ammonia climbs while you can't do water changes? You don't want to use it if you can help it, but it's better than losing them to ammonia stress.

If your pH in the larvae tank is above 7.8, you can get away with up to 10% water changes throughout metamorphosis. Stability is more important than quality right now though.

As far as the larvae swimming at a 45 degree angle ... is he staying that way? They do that some, but shouldn't stay that way.

Now that the larvae are stronger, you can increase the air a little through the airstone.

I don't know about the change day to night. It's probably got to be both as fast as it happens. I really hope these guys make it!
 
He swims really fast at the surface at a 45 degree angle. Then he'll stop sometimes, go down and swim normally, and lunge at some food, then he'll shoot back to the surface and swim really fast again.

I have amquel plus, i was going to start using that to keep the ammonia down through metamorphosis.
 
Sounds good.

Only use the Amquel if you HAVE to. Test the ammonia a couple times a day and just watch it. Amquel is suspected to stunt their growth if over used. IME the small batch of 4 that I raised didn't create enough ammonia to need much, if any Amquel and those babies were all normal sized. When I raised a batch of 100, the ammonia got out of hand and I had to use quite a bit of Amquel. Although most of the babies attained a normal size, I did have a significant number of runts that never grew up.

Maybe just odds ... with so many more babies there was more of a chance of deformities. But I've always suspected the Amquel.

Use it if you need it, but use only what you need if you have to.
 
I just looked at them and the one that's swimming weird looks like he has an orange brown tint to him. The other one looks dark.
 
Cross your fingers.

If you make it through the next 3 days, you've made it through the hardest part.
 
He looks healthy and strong to me.

Just hunting for food and trying out that new tail action.

They'll really slow down after metamorphosis, so don't worry.
 
Oh No!

He must have gotten food too big or eaten too much. It's always the biggest and best one that over eats.

Turn off the lights so he settles down and stops eating and you might be able to head it off.
 
THat's what they do when they're overstuffed or blocked up.

Chances are you're going to lose him. But just keep the light off and leave him be. He might be able to digest it out and be okay.

Please keep us posted.

Good luck
 
This is awsome! I enjoy your enthusiasm, fizkstiks.
Hang in there, you'll get it down soon enough.

CRPECK, great job in explaining things in simple terms for fizhstiks.

keep us posted, this is a good one.
 
Thanks D-Rod

When I was trying to raise babies, Steven at Coral Dynamics was my lifeline. Even though I had read up and was ready ... I could have never done it without him walking me through and talking me through the crises.

I hope it is helping Fizkstiks. I too am impressed with the tenacity and determination here. It's not easy and the trial and error is really frustrating.

I'd love it if someone who does this all the time would chime in if there is more we could do to help.

Hopefully these last two babies are going to make it.
 
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