dino experiment

[Kieth71]

I have all live rock in my tank..so i guess i am in the minority of those who have had dino problems.On a good note the algae x seems to have worked for me.I have dosed 8 times for a total of 16 days.The patches of hair algae dont seem any better but i will live with that since the dinos are gone.I will know better once i do a water change-Kieth

 

[Skynyrd Fish]

About 65% of my rock is live rock, the rest is base.

 

[sniper2be]

no dino's here all live rock, if i do get it it's nice to know we are researching possible cures

 

[JustinGr]

I have all live rock in my tank..so i guess i am in the minority of those who have had dino problems.On a good note the algae x seems to have worked for me.I have dosed 8 times for a total of 16 days.The patches of hair algae dont seem any better but i will live with that since the dinos are gone.I will know better once i do a water change-Kieth

Keith,
I assume you are running your lights during this whole AlgaeX program? I started my AlgaeX on Saturday when I started my 5 days of lights out. Tonight I turn them back on so Friday will be a normal light day, and I have dosed AlgaeX on Saturday, Monday, and Wednesday. I will dose again on Friday and Sunday with the lights back on normal schedule. Just wondered it leaving the lights on hinders the process.

Thanks

 

[Kieth71]

After my 5 day lights off period i turned back the lighting to 6 hours for whites and 8 hours for blues.I also had siphoned off any remaining dinos after my lights off period and always dosed after lights went off. HTH-Kieth

 

[adamk22]

I used BRS reef saver dry rock and am on my second dino battle. Just finished a 3 day blackout, no sign of dinos, just some tufts of hair algae.

 

[JustinGr]

After my 5 day lights off period i turned back the lighting to 6 hours for whites and 8 hours for blues.I also had siphoned off any remaining dinos after my lights off period and always dosed after lights went off. HTH-Kieth

Awesome. Im on the same path.. Thanks!

 

[drummereef]

Current stats. There's a couple exceptions to the list below but so far the Dinos are favoring dry rock users. Keep the stats coming guys.


Dry Rock - 5
Live Rock - 2
Mixed Dry/Live -1

 

[tmz]

Dry rock may hold dried organics . Personally, I cure dry rock just as I do new damp shipped stinky live rock.

 

[drummereef]

Dry rock may hold dried organics . Personally, I cure dry rock just as I do new damp shipped stinky live rock.

Absolutely. But do the Dinos only feed on excess organics or do they thrive in bacterially unbalanced environments? I presume both, since the combination is such a volatile environment.

 

[JustinGr]

Last night I remove the blackout drape from the tank, it was about 9:30pm, and I saw with a flashlight that the places that the dino was thickest was just a bunch of dusty junk on the bottom of the tank, so I siphoned it out into a filter sock in a bucket and re-added the water to the tank. Today the tank is with lights on for the first time in 5 days.

There are no dino signs anywhere, I lost a frogspawn, and a Hammerhead in the blackout, but everything else looks good. I will continue to dose AlgaeX for another week.

Justin

 

[tmz]

Brett,
I don't know but it seems changes in organics and levels may play a role. Perhaps when they break down they release a trace element , minor element , heavy metal , that gives dinos an edge or maybe it's the localized acidic conditions brought on by decay . Maybe it has nothing to do with organics at all ;but I suspect it might in some cases anyway.
.
I've used dry rock : a substantial amount is flourishing in my system ;never got dinos from it. Wouldn't hesitate to use it again after curing. Many tanks without that type of rock do get them. The "dead"/dry rock will shortly develop ammonia oxidzing bacteria,ie nitrifiers and then denitrifiers. I doubt any other bacteria are playing a significant role in a reef tank but I suppose they might but I can't imagine what that would be..

 

[drummereef]

Brett,
I don't know but it seems changes in organics and levels may play a role. Perhaps when they break down they release a trace element , minor element , heavy metal , that gives dinos an edge or maybe it's the localized acidic conditions brought on by decay . Maybe it has nothing to do with organics at all ;but I suspect it might in some cases anyway.
.
I've used dry rock : a substantial amount is flourishing in my system ;never got dinos from it. Wouldn't hesitate to use it again after curing. Many tanks without that type of rock do get them. The "dead"/dry rock will shortly develop ammonia oxidzing bacteria,ie nitrifiers and then denitrifiers. I doubt any other bacteria are playing a significant role in a reef tank but I suppose they might but I can't imagine what that would be..

Excellent points tmz. :thumbsup: Just like the human body, my presumption is the reef structure (rock) has to maintain an alkaline balance to minimize the promotion of acidic elements which cause general malaise and bacterial imbalances. Calcium carbonate is generally alkaline, that's pretty straight forward. So when organics start breaking down and releasing toxins, this could possibly create small acidic pockets in the rock that fuel Dinos or really any other undesirable algae, bacteria or generally other parasitic organisms. Interesting how raising pH, or otherwise hyper-alkalizing the water column, can help eliminate them in some cases.

There's nothing particularly scientific in my theory I might add. Just some thoughts I have.

 

[bertoni]

But do the Dinos only feed on excess organics or do they thrive in bacterially unbalanced environments? I presume both, since the combination is such a volatile environment.

I don't know of any useful definition of "bacterially imbalanced". Dinoflagellates live off nutrients in the water column. In some tanks, they seem to be very effective at competing for food, which make eradication difficult. I don't think anyone knows why they can be so hard to kill. I've never seen any specific explanation.

 

[drummereef]

I don't know of any useful definition of "bacterially imbalanced". Dinoflagellates live off nutrients in the water column. In some tanks, they seem to be very effective at competing for food, which make eradication difficult. I don't think anyone knows why they can be so hard to kill. I've never seen any specific explanation.

I know at least in my case the only thing that seemed to work was constant bacteria supplementation. Raising pH didn't do much and they came back even after multiple 3 day lights out periods. So the only thing I could put my finger on was that I finally had enough bacteria to perhaps outcompete their food source. Perhaps it was purely coincidental, I'm not sure.

 

[tmz]

Jacking up the bacterial populations with supplements might create more short term competition and may help ; I don't know, but it wont get at the underlying cause as the tank will develop enough bacteria on it's own to handle nitrifiction.

 

[nynick]

I think you have to make the distinction between algae that is in your tank simply because it was introduced and algae that is in every system and will take over when you are slacking on husbandry.

I am currently batteling Calothrix and it is a royal pita! (just to figure out what it was took forever.... Looks just like thousands of other Cyano's and /or Dinos) Peroxide will drive it down but not eradicate it so I am upping the oxidizing power to chemiclean as soon as I am confident there isn't too much of it to oxidize in my system (god knows what this will release in my water as it dies.....) I must say that Peroxide is doing a great job though and I see no ill effects what so ever at 1.5ml/10g daily. My water is so clean that is totally invisible with readings that would make the coast lines of Antarctica look filthy...unfortunately Calothrix is somewhat fine with this It might have stopped doing the conga line all over my tank but it is still giving me the finger and is doing juuuuuust fine.

One of the more annoying aspects of batteling this stuff is that when ever you mention it or ask for advice you will get a lecture on good tank maintenance and questions about your phosphate levels (or worse a lecture on nitrate levels for what is technically a cyano outbreak.....yes, this happened twice.)

So, to stop with my frustrated rant and finally make my point..... When you see someone asking for help to battle for example Bryopsis or Dinos, don't rub salt on a wound and give generic advise on good husbandry. The problem didn't start with bad husbandry and won't go away with good.

 

[lewk]

One particular example of a material that doesn't go well with peroxide of particular interest to us aquarists is ferric oxide which can act as a catalyst for the decomposition of peroxide. In its dilute forms it just goes away without a sound. At higher concentrations the decomposition CAN be explosive.

Question on this and sorry if I missed the answer somewhere. Does this mean we should pull GFO when dosing the 3% solution? I'm on my second bout with these things and peroxide *seemed* to get rid of them the first time.

 

[JustinGr]

Well, I have had lights on since Friday and ZERO sign of Dino after 8 months of battles. I did put in a 1/2 cup of GFO today, but just because....

I am on my 4th treatment of AlgaeX and it seems to have blasted it out. I will dose for another 3 treatments at a minimum. But so far, best 29$ I ever spent so far!

 

[Mike S]

I've been slowly ramping up my lights for a week after blacking out the tank for 6 days. No sign of them so far... Fingers crossed.