karimwassef
Active member
Yes. I had dry rock too.
It's a key ingredient IMO.
It's a key ingredient IMO.
Dinoflagellates.
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Fish Keeper82
New member
Not that i can remember but i just mentioned it because of the previous post about water transfusion suggestion low biodiversity.
I agree its likely a contributing factor.
I agree its likely a contributing factor.
Billybatz9
New member
Does anyone know if bacteria fuels dinos? Thinking about dosing a few strains of bacteria to help water quality. What do you guys think?
Fish Keeper82
New member
Only real connection I can remember is pristine water low phosphate and nitrate levels.
Several reported: when green algae stops growing on glass Dinos rises. That happened in my case i have not had algae growing on my glass now for about 2 months. Only a bit of Dinos on glass thats sticking to cerith snail eggs and such.
Several reported: when green algae stops growing on glass Dinos rises. That happened in my case i have not had algae growing on my glass now for about 2 months. Only a bit of Dinos on glass thats sticking to cerith snail eggs and such.
Fish Keeper82
New member
I've wondered that myself. My Dinos did not get out of balance till i used red slime remover to get rid of Cyano bacteria.
I started with live Fiji rock. I had a GHA outbreak and set up an ATS to try and combat it. The ATS worked great at getting rid of the breakout in the DT. Within a month all of the algae on the ATS died off and what I believe happened was a low bio load and light feeding combined with the ATS created a ULN situation that caused the initial dinoflagellate outbreak.
I have had the same problem as far as water changes go. When I think I have a handle on the situation and the Dinos seem to disappear for a while, I've done water changes and it seems to come back worse than before.
karimwassef
Active member
It's either poor biodiversity to start (dead rock) or an extinction event (ULNS, chemical algicide)... And dinos take over.
DNA
New member
.
My tank is 98% dinoflagellate free now.
No corals or fish got harmed in the process and most of the Cyanobacteria is gone as well.
Next steps are to see if it improves even further and if it's permanent or not.
If it's not I'll at least get an opportunity to repeat the process and prove my case.
This time I'd like to present something that really works and it will take time to get there.
What a way to start 2016, with white sands and a hope.
My tank is 98% dinoflagellate free now.
No corals or fish got harmed in the process and most of the Cyanobacteria is gone as well.
Next steps are to see if it improves even further and if it's permanent or not.
If it's not I'll at least get an opportunity to repeat the process and prove my case.
This time I'd like to present something that really works and it will take time to get there.
What a way to start 2016, with white sands and a hope.
Maybe it's time for an experiment
Maybe it's time for an experiment
I have an established 50 gal with "dry" rock (sat in bin for maybe a year, not pristine conditions!) that has cyano/dino taking over. Can't grow SPS or corals to despite never seeing nitrates or PO4 at detectable levels. Ceasing water changes seems to have helped greatly and allowing tank to get "dirty"
I also have a 155 that recently started with TBS rock in early November. I DO have nitrates and PO4 already in that system. I'd say it has maybe 40% dry rock (that is the same as the 50 gal above) and 60% TBS rock with no dinos.
What's curious: I took a couple of TBS rocks and put in my 50 gal. No cyano/dinos on those rocks at all. I've also seen cyano resurgence just a bit on the other rocks with NONE on the TBS rock. They have been present since @11/20 with zip, zero ugly stuff on them. None.
I've never been able to detect neither nitrate nor PO4 in my 50 gal. I also have 0 corals that utilize dkh, only a small clam, zoas, and an anemone yet to keep dkh at @8 I have to fully saturate kalk with vinegar in the ATO (using @1 gal/day).
I've been tempted to change water from my 155 to "dose" nitrates in my 50 gal and/or take skimmate and drop into 50 gal. Other option I think would be to initiate carbon dosing regimen (I've started that on the 155 already).
My current theory is that the bacterial balance in the 50 is all hosed up. I'd say it's had a dino/cyano problem for @9 months or so. Frequent water changes only made it worse (I did that for 2-3 months in hopes of being patient and persistent). What's helped the most is letting it run dirty for maybe @4-6 weeks (no water changes). I've added pods and dosing phyto regularly to hopefully change the tank, but after 3 weeks it's gotten better, but certainly not where it should be.
Where I'd like some help from the community here would be a positive ID on the critters present in my 50 gal (uscopes aren't easily had around here). I'd be happy to conduct one of the three options and share results with you all in a controlled procedure.
Maybe it's time for an experiment
I have an established 50 gal with "dry" rock (sat in bin for maybe a year, not pristine conditions!) that has cyano/dino taking over. Can't grow SPS or corals to despite never seeing nitrates or PO4 at detectable levels. Ceasing water changes seems to have helped greatly and allowing tank to get "dirty"
I also have a 155 that recently started with TBS rock in early November. I DO have nitrates and PO4 already in that system. I'd say it has maybe 40% dry rock (that is the same as the 50 gal above) and 60% TBS rock with no dinos.
What's curious: I took a couple of TBS rocks and put in my 50 gal. No cyano/dinos on those rocks at all. I've also seen cyano resurgence just a bit on the other rocks with NONE on the TBS rock. They have been present since @11/20 with zip, zero ugly stuff on them. None.
I've never been able to detect neither nitrate nor PO4 in my 50 gal. I also have 0 corals that utilize dkh, only a small clam, zoas, and an anemone yet to keep dkh at @8 I have to fully saturate kalk with vinegar in the ATO (using @1 gal/day).
I've been tempted to change water from my 155 to "dose" nitrates in my 50 gal and/or take skimmate and drop into 50 gal. Other option I think would be to initiate carbon dosing regimen (I've started that on the 155 already).
My current theory is that the bacterial balance in the 50 is all hosed up. I'd say it's had a dino/cyano problem for @9 months or so. Frequent water changes only made it worse (I did that for 2-3 months in hopes of being patient and persistent). What's helped the most is letting it run dirty for maybe @4-6 weeks (no water changes). I've added pods and dosing phyto regularly to hopefully change the tank, but after 3 weeks it's gotten better, but certainly not where it should be.
Where I'd like some help from the community here would be a positive ID on the critters present in my 50 gal (uscopes aren't easily had around here). I'd be happy to conduct one of the three options and share results with you all in a controlled procedure.
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Billybatz9
New member
seamonster124
New member
Dinoflagellates.
I had a major increase in microscopic creatures, and an immediate decrease in Dino's, 24 hours after adding SeaChem's Stability. Although that could have been due to increasing feeding dramatically
I had a major increase in microscopic creatures, and an immediate decrease in Dino's, 24 hours after adding SeaChem's Stability. Although that could have been due to increasing feeding dramatically
karimwassef
Active member
The problem is that we use generic terms like dinos, bacteria, pods (myself included).
We need a more discerning view but most of us don't have the tools, education or experience.
When I went to my LFS, they advised that I add bacteria in a jug. I support this stuff but I had no idea what works and how much.
We need to know the strain or at least the brand name that works. We'd need five or six infected test tanks and then add different bacteria and measure what happens over a period of time.
Same with the transfusions and other ideas. We need a commercial ally to pay for this.
We need a more discerning view but most of us don't have the tools, education or experience.
When I went to my LFS, they advised that I add bacteria in a jug. I support this stuff but I had no idea what works and how much.
We need to know the strain or at least the brand name that works. We'd need five or six infected test tanks and then add different bacteria and measure what happens over a period of time.
Same with the transfusions and other ideas. We need a commercial ally to pay for this.
seamonster124
New member
I think there's potential for some cooperation here.
In the algae scrubber basics thread there are people pulling hunks of GHA harvest and sad about throwing away so much life and looking for some use.
In the dinoflagellates thread there are people looking for ways to add algae/bacteria/pods and general biodiversity to outcompete dinos.
Messed up quoting with link but oh well.
"I'm torn. The export is so full of life - pods, worms, starfish, serpent stars, snails.. Even the green water I get from squeezing it is full of life jumping and flicking.
My Chaeto export goes to the fish store or friends, but no one will take GHA export. I couldn't toss it, so I made one of my quarantines into a GHA holding tank while I think about it.
Any ideas on saving life in the GHA?"
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karimwassef
Active member
LOL!!! YES!
I have noone locally who's struggling with dinos or I'd give them my ATS export!
logistics are the obstacle now.
I have noone locally who's struggling with dinos or I'd give them my ATS export!
logistics are the obstacle now.
