Euro-Reef Eheim NW Thread
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- Start date
cerreta
Premium Member
The results are in. Brown came early today, so I got the pump around 11:30. About midway through testing several impeller mods, the USPS arrived with the Kill-a-watt meter, so I was able to measure two pump variables to compare performance.
The first thing I did was compare physical features between all four pumps. These are the four pumps tested:
1. ER Mod Eheim 1262, with new ER Pinwheel (PW)
2. No Mod Eheim 1262, water pump version (WPV)
3. H&S Mod Eheim 1260, with H&S PW
4. Cerreta’s Mod Eheim 1260, WPV with many impeller mods (described later)
5. ER Mod Gen-X 4100, with old-style ER PW
When comparing body size, OD of output, OD diameter of intake, impellers, impeller housing, and interchangablity of volutes and impellers, their was no difference. The diameters were all checked with a metric micrometer.
There was one major difference between the 1262 WPV and 1260 WPV, the ID of the intake which is integrated within a part called a volute. The ID of the 1262 was much, much larger. As speculated, this accounts for the 40% difference in flow output between the two pumps. While I lack a method and did not test flow output between the two pumps, I do not thing there is any difference in the motor assemblies. I believe these two pumps are internally the same and the volute diameters are the sole difference between these two pumps.
Proof of this claim can be validated by interchanging the volute assemblies and testing the air intake draw and wattage / amps used by the pump in the same operating conditions.
ER Eheim 1262
ER Eheim 1262 label
ER Eheim 1260 label
Volute ER 1262 (left) vs. 1260 WPV (right)
Housing ER 1262 vs. 1260 WPV
ER PW new-style vs. SW
ER PW new-style has 8 holes instead of 4 holes in the old-style
EW PW side view
ER Old style vs. ER New-style PW
The first thing I did was compare physical features between all four pumps. These are the four pumps tested:
1. ER Mod Eheim 1262, with new ER Pinwheel (PW)
2. No Mod Eheim 1262, water pump version (WPV)
3. H&S Mod Eheim 1260, with H&S PW
4. Cerreta’s Mod Eheim 1260, WPV with many impeller mods (described later)
5. ER Mod Gen-X 4100, with old-style ER PW
When comparing body size, OD of output, OD diameter of intake, impellers, impeller housing, and interchangablity of volutes and impellers, their was no difference. The diameters were all checked with a metric micrometer.
There was one major difference between the 1262 WPV and 1260 WPV, the ID of the intake which is integrated within a part called a volute. The ID of the 1262 was much, much larger. As speculated, this accounts for the 40% difference in flow output between the two pumps. While I lack a method and did not test flow output between the two pumps, I do not thing there is any difference in the motor assemblies. I believe these two pumps are internally the same and the volute diameters are the sole difference between these two pumps.
Proof of this claim can be validated by interchanging the volute assemblies and testing the air intake draw and wattage / amps used by the pump in the same operating conditions.
ER Eheim 1262
ER Eheim 1262 label
ER Eheim 1260 label
Volute ER 1262 (left) vs. 1260 WPV (right)
Housing ER 1262 vs. 1260 WPV
ER PW new-style vs. SW
ER PW new-style has 8 holes instead of 4 holes in the old-style
EW PW side view
ER Old style vs. ER New-style PW
cerreta
Premium Member
So here are the testing methods: Pump 1 and Pump 4 were fitted to the ER RC180 skimmer body while using same ER new style PW impeller. Both pumps used the ER volute assembly. The air draw was measured with a Dwyer RMA-22-SSV air flow meter fitted with ¼†nipple to connect to the standard ER silicone air line hose. Wattage and amperage were tested with a P3 model P4400 Kill-a-Watt electricity usage monitor .
Results of Pump 1 ER Mod Eheim 1262, with new ER PW = 15lpm air draw, 40watts, 0.69amps
Results of Pump 4 Cerreta’s Mod Eheim 1260 = 15lpm air draw, 40watts, 0.71amps
Results of Pump 1 ER Mod Eheim 1262, with new ER PW = 15lpm air draw, 40watts, 0.69amps
Results of Pump 4 Cerreta’s Mod Eheim 1260 = 15lpm air draw, 40watts, 0.71amps
cerreta
Premium Member
Conclusion:
There is no significant difference in performance tested between the Eheim 1260 and 1262 pumps when both are fitted with the ER volute assembly. IMO, these pumps are identical. The difference between the two pumps is the volute intake diameters and this change is responsible for the difference in flow output, current rating, and wattage rating listed on the label of these two pumps. In other words, what makes an Eheim 1262 is the large diameter volute.
There were some notable differences in volute assemblies. The Eheim 1260 WPV has a small restricting orifice, whereas the H&S 1260 and Eheim 1262 WPV both had much larger orifices. So the question many people have asked is: Why does Euro-Reef have to use an Eheim 1262 pump to get the same performance statistics that H&S and Deltec get out of the Eheim 1260? Well, I believe this question has been answered.
The Eheim 1260 used by H&S does not come with a standard volute. They changed it. There were appreciable differences in volutes between the WPV 1262 and the H&S 1260. The WPV has ¾†FPT intake just like the Eheim 1260 WPV but with a large diameter orifice. The H&S has a non-threaded intake with an orifice that appears to have the same diameter opening as the 1262 WPV. So this explains why the Eheim 1260 WPV with a standard volute does not work as a skimmer pump. The orifice is too restrictive and the pump cavitates. I tried this and posted results in another thread. The pump failed to work.
So the next question one may ask is: Why does ER resort to using the Eheim 1262 instead of using the same volute as the H&S? I think this is where ER took a simplistic approach to finding a pump that can be modified without elaborate changes. Another way to ask the same question is: Why doesn’t H&S just use the Eheim 1262 WPV? I believe the answer is simple, Location, Location, Location. H&S and Eheim are German companies. I think it would not be unreasonable for H&S to communicate with Eheim (in German which ER probably can not do) and special order a part that meets there specific needs. Another possible answer may be even closer to the truth. Germans use the metric system. If you recall the Eheim 1262 is fitted with ¾†FPT threads. This appears to be a US version water pump. In fact the H&S Eheim 1260 does have a non-threaded volute that appears to be metric.
I tried fitting ¾ and 1†pipe into the intake and neither fit. So, I think ER found a simple solution to using one of the best made skimmer pumps. They purchase the US version Eheim 1262 and stick a ER PW in it. I also noticed that the ER 1262 uses an output pipe that is glued into place, not threaded into the standard ¾†FPT. This would allow for increased water flow over the smaller connector. However, the pipe they use to fit this is nonstandard. It is either a metric pipe, or they mill a 1†Schedule 80 pipe to meet there specific needs. By looking at it, appears to be a metric pipe.
The final results do not indicate a significant difference between the ER Mod Eheim 1262 or the H&S Mod 1260. In fact both pumps outperform the listings on the labels. The 1262 is rated for 80 watts and the 1260 is rated at 65watts. Both pumps, modified and used as a skimmer pump, consume only 40watts of power. This is great.
I think it is fair to dispel the notion that Euro-Reef has to use a stronger water pump to get the same results as Deltec and H&S. As indicated in my testing, the pumps perform the same.
Here are some other test results. All were tested with ER volute:
Test 3. Eheim 1260 Cerreta’s Mod with Large Spike Wheel (SW) 7lpm.
Test 4. Eheim 1260 Cerreta’s Mod with Small Spike Wheel (SW) = 7lpm, 24watts, 0.69amps.
Test 5. Eheim 1260 Cerreta’s Mod with 3ply Gutter Gaurd (GG) on Needle Wheel (NW) = 8lpm 25watts, 0.62 amps.
There is no significant difference in performance tested between the Eheim 1260 and 1262 pumps when both are fitted with the ER volute assembly. IMO, these pumps are identical. The difference between the two pumps is the volute intake diameters and this change is responsible for the difference in flow output, current rating, and wattage rating listed on the label of these two pumps. In other words, what makes an Eheim 1262 is the large diameter volute.
There were some notable differences in volute assemblies. The Eheim 1260 WPV has a small restricting orifice, whereas the H&S 1260 and Eheim 1262 WPV both had much larger orifices. So the question many people have asked is: Why does Euro-Reef have to use an Eheim 1262 pump to get the same performance statistics that H&S and Deltec get out of the Eheim 1260? Well, I believe this question has been answered.
The Eheim 1260 used by H&S does not come with a standard volute. They changed it. There were appreciable differences in volutes between the WPV 1262 and the H&S 1260. The WPV has ¾†FPT intake just like the Eheim 1260 WPV but with a large diameter orifice. The H&S has a non-threaded intake with an orifice that appears to have the same diameter opening as the 1262 WPV. So this explains why the Eheim 1260 WPV with a standard volute does not work as a skimmer pump. The orifice is too restrictive and the pump cavitates. I tried this and posted results in another thread. The pump failed to work.
So the next question one may ask is: Why does ER resort to using the Eheim 1262 instead of using the same volute as the H&S? I think this is where ER took a simplistic approach to finding a pump that can be modified without elaborate changes. Another way to ask the same question is: Why doesn’t H&S just use the Eheim 1262 WPV? I believe the answer is simple, Location, Location, Location. H&S and Eheim are German companies. I think it would not be unreasonable for H&S to communicate with Eheim (in German which ER probably can not do) and special order a part that meets there specific needs. Another possible answer may be even closer to the truth. Germans use the metric system. If you recall the Eheim 1262 is fitted with ¾†FPT threads. This appears to be a US version water pump. In fact the H&S Eheim 1260 does have a non-threaded volute that appears to be metric.
I tried fitting ¾ and 1†pipe into the intake and neither fit. So, I think ER found a simple solution to using one of the best made skimmer pumps. They purchase the US version Eheim 1262 and stick a ER PW in it. I also noticed that the ER 1262 uses an output pipe that is glued into place, not threaded into the standard ¾†FPT. This would allow for increased water flow over the smaller connector. However, the pipe they use to fit this is nonstandard. It is either a metric pipe, or they mill a 1†Schedule 80 pipe to meet there specific needs. By looking at it, appears to be a metric pipe.
The final results do not indicate a significant difference between the ER Mod Eheim 1262 or the H&S Mod 1260. In fact both pumps outperform the listings on the labels. The 1262 is rated for 80 watts and the 1260 is rated at 65watts. Both pumps, modified and used as a skimmer pump, consume only 40watts of power. This is great.
I think it is fair to dispel the notion that Euro-Reef has to use a stronger water pump to get the same results as Deltec and H&S. As indicated in my testing, the pumps perform the same.
Here are some other test results. All were tested with ER volute:
Test 3. Eheim 1260 Cerreta’s Mod with Large Spike Wheel (SW) 7lpm.
Test 4. Eheim 1260 Cerreta’s Mod with Small Spike Wheel (SW) = 7lpm, 24watts, 0.69amps.
Test 5. Eheim 1260 Cerreta’s Mod with 3ply Gutter Gaurd (GG) on Needle Wheel (NW) = 8lpm 25watts, 0.62 amps.
cerreta
Premium Member
Test 6. Eheim 1260 Cerreta’s Mod with 3ply Mesh Wheel (MW) on NW = 10lpm, 26watts, 0.68 amps.
Test 7. Eheim 1260 Cerreta’s Mod with 4 ply MW on SW = Failed to work. It cavitated and made horrible noise. I think the material was too thick.
Thoughts About Value
While I have not tested the GenX4100 for amp and wattage consumption, I did test it for air draw and it too produced 15lpm with an old-style ER PW impeller. It is possible that the ER Eheim 1262 will break in and produce a higher value. I will report back in a few days. However, at this point I did not observe any significant difference between the GenX and new Eheim in terms of performance. At this point I would not recommend an upgrade for $305 to anyone that expects to gain a performance increase. Furthermore, the modified GG, MW, and SW are all inferior to the ER and H&S PW designs. Impeller mods are worthwhile for those who own NW skimmers, but I would not go cutting the pins off a PW impeller to try and improve the performance. My tests do not support any improvement at all.
So am I happy with the ER 1262. Hell Yeah!!! It’s an Eheim pump I just put on there. While I do not gain any performance, I do gain comfort. The Eheim is damn near silent, a great improvement over the GenX. Plus, the GenX impeller was worn and due for a replacement. So this was a perfect time to upgrade. You also gain comfort in knowing that you will have a dependable pump that is very energy conservative. The power draw is 40watts with 0.71 amps of current draw. I will try to post results of the GenX power consumption in a few days.
Test 7. Eheim 1260 Cerreta’s Mod with 4 ply MW on SW = Failed to work. It cavitated and made horrible noise. I think the material was too thick.
Thoughts About Value
While I have not tested the GenX4100 for amp and wattage consumption, I did test it for air draw and it too produced 15lpm with an old-style ER PW impeller. It is possible that the ER Eheim 1262 will break in and produce a higher value. I will report back in a few days. However, at this point I did not observe any significant difference between the GenX and new Eheim in terms of performance. At this point I would not recommend an upgrade for $305 to anyone that expects to gain a performance increase. Furthermore, the modified GG, MW, and SW are all inferior to the ER and H&S PW designs. Impeller mods are worthwhile for those who own NW skimmers, but I would not go cutting the pins off a PW impeller to try and improve the performance. My tests do not support any improvement at all.
So am I happy with the ER 1262. Hell Yeah!!! It’s an Eheim pump I just put on there. While I do not gain any performance, I do gain comfort. The Eheim is damn near silent, a great improvement over the GenX. Plus, the GenX impeller was worn and due for a replacement. So this was a perfect time to upgrade. You also gain comfort in knowing that you will have a dependable pump that is very energy conservative. The power draw is 40watts with 0.71 amps of current draw. I will try to post results of the GenX power consumption in a few days.
Jim_S
Timo Boll
No, I run mine wide open and it has been silent.
As far as no performance gain, I absolutely agree. In fact, I was told this by Jeff before I made the decision to switch. I was however, looking for something quieter. Because my equipment is under my stand, silence is a priority.
I wonder why yours is cavitating and mine is not?
Jim
As far as no performance gain, I absolutely agree. In fact, I was told this by Jeff before I made the decision to switch. I was however, looking for something quieter. Because my equipment is under my stand, silence is a priority.
I wonder why yours is cavitating and mine is not?
Jim
Jim_S
Timo Boll
I thought cavitation is when a pump sucks in too much air and stops working.
When I first ran mine, it made an odd noise for a bit, but then stopped and it hasn't returned.
Maybe there was an air bubble stuck in mine, I'm not sure.
Let your's run all night and see if it does it tomorrow. The noise may go away.
Jim
When I first ran mine, it made an odd noise for a bit, but then stopped and it hasn't returned.
Maybe there was an air bubble stuck in mine, I'm not sure.
Let your's run all night and see if it does it tomorrow. The noise may go away.
Jim
arconom
Premium Member
Jim Great Pics
Is there a way you can use the new NW in the Sendra pump and compare it to the old NW in the same pump?
I would like to see numbers if in fact the new NW was a big improvement.
I know you mentioned the bubbles seem to be smaller, but I would love to see some numbers.
Is there a way you can use the new NW in the Sendra pump and compare it to the old NW in the same pump?
I would like to see numbers if in fact the new NW was a big improvement.
I know you mentioned the bubbles seem to be smaller, but I would love to see some numbers.
Reefer90210
In Memoriam
hmm...i think I might need to get the ER needlewheel for my new skimmer
hahnmeister
In Memoriam
jimdogg187, cavitation is the result of the pressure drop of the trailing edge of an object moving through water. You know how a propeller can move so fast underwater that little bubbles form from its output? Its because the pressure drop after the blade passes through the water is so much that water vaporizes into gas right there. So if you have a pump with too high of an impeller speed, you can get bubbles from nowhere. Cavitation often happens on a regular pump if the intake is restricted too much.
When you feed too much water into a pump for it to work, I would call that choking. Im not 100% sure thats the right term, but its a whole lot better than cavitate.
When you feed too much water into a pump for it to work, I would call that choking. Im not 100% sure thats the right term, but its a whole lot better than cavitate.
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