Finally!!! Our 150 gal Build begins!!!

Hey folks...I have our new 150g Tall in our possession thx to the awesome folks at ABC Aquarium!!!! :dance:

So this will primarily be a softy and LPS tank, with minimal rock in the DT. I'm trying to figure out my equipment list, more specifically my powerheads.

Thoughts and opinions on what I should run in the DT?
 
This is a peninsula right? Softies and LPS, I gotta say one or two mp40s or one mp60 plus your returns should be plenty.
 
Basement sump? Or under tank? Refugium built into sump? Skimmer planned?

You could have the overflow dump into the sump and exit the sump at the same end. I built one for ABCs peninsula tank with a divider that ran up the middle. Water emptied into the tank, Rand down one side of the sump, emptied into a refugium, then ran back down the otherside into a long narrow return section. Not sure it makes sense. They had an. External skimmer though.

Not saying you should do that, but a non traditional solution might be your answer.
 
If you're doing basement sump, sky's the limit. I ran an additional 20 gallon tank as a refugium with that sump. That's what the extra bulkhead up high in the return section is for. The refugium water spilled back in at that point.

I also ran an additionally 20 that was covered. It caught the water that came crashing down from the upstairs. I tried it without and there was just too much spray and salt creep. Wish I'd known, I'm pretty sure I trashed those 20s when we moved. Ive got a 29 that's drilled that I was going to toss, which you are more than welcome to.
 
Gotcha...I have a several tanks laying around and I really like the idea of the "splash-down" tank and will incorporate that!

Thx!
 
So I have a rough design and locations figured out for a tiered basement sump room. These are approx numbers but I came up with 7' of vertical, a 10' horizontal run and 4x 90's.

I need to figure out a return pump that would handle that and possibly tee off to an external skimmer as well as feed a refugium.

Suggestions?

I'm accustomed to cute wee li'l Leprechaun systems lol...I'm excited but diving into the realm of bigger tanks is out of my comfort zone ;)
 
How much flow do you really need/want through the sump system?

Gen-X mak4 is a good choice in terms of upfront cost, power consumption, and ability to handle a big head but it might not be enough water. If you need something bigger the pressure-biased reeflo pumps are my favorites.

If you build your refugium into the "normal" flow path you don't need to spend extra capacity pumping water to it separately. But you DO need to account for your target flow in the 'fuge matching the rest of the system, though you can get around that by playing games with widths since it's really velocity that is the concern in a 'fuge and not flow in the volume per unit time sense. You can do the same with the skimmer but that introduces some variability you might not be happy with.

Do you have a drain system planned yet? I'd definitely go herbie or beananimal style, it's dead quiet and will really help reduce bubbles/splashing in the sump with your big head height vs. a traditional open channel drain where the air and water are mixing all the time through the whole line.

What's the environment in the basement like? Is it finished and heated? If it's cool down there you might want to plan for minimal surface area and/or insulate the sump or else you may find you're dumping a bunch of electricity into the tank to heat it. Especially if you have a low-ish intensity LED rig on it for lighting and low-wattage pumps in the DT for water movement.
 
Justin, another concern I had, and I don't know the answer to this, is the length of the overflow plumbing to the sump. With a run that long, I don't know if a Herbie/Beananimal will hold siphon that far, or at least be quiet while it does. Second, the volume of water needed to fill at full siphon, that distance of plumbing, depending on diameter, could be appreciable. In the event of a power outage, you'd need quite a bit of extra space in your proposed sump system.

Just spitballing, but things to consider yo.
 
This is where the tank will rest. You can see on the counter top on the right side, a hole morticed out for plumbing. It's 4"x6".
2011-12-28_10-41-21_127.jpg



I was originally planning on drilling the tank for one drain and one return but have since changed my mind. I had hoped a herb/bean styled overflow would work but now Mark has me worried.

I could also drill on the tank on the living room side of the end panel and just have to build a soffit to hide the plumbing that would drop dwn into the basement.

The basement: It's Thorosealed (sp) block foundation. Concrete floor...low ceilings. Uninsulated except around the band and in the joist. My plan is to frame in as small a room as I can that would meet my needs. Insulate it. There's a heat run that I planned on ducting into the fish room. There's also an old, obsolete dryer vent that I want to hook an exhaust fan to, that would run 24/7 and keep air flowing. Both of these are located conveniently near the house sump crock and a sewer drain too.
 
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If you're planning LPS and softies, you don't really need that much turnover between the sump and the main display. For an SPS display, I'm running about 5x in the sump for 230 gallons, maybe less. So your plumbing doesn't have to be that large. It also doesn't have to be pretty, it just has to fit through that 4x6 hole at that point. What happens above or below that point is up to you.

As for the siphon holding, I just don't know the answer to that. Unfortunately Bean's thread is like 100 pages long, literally. Finding the answer that way, may be time consuming, and possibly futile.

As for overflow allowance, if your plumbing is a smaller guage, the volume of excess water will be that much less. Not trying to start trouble, just trying to help prevent it :thumbsup:
 
There should be no issue pulling a siphon over that distance. I just built a 420 gallon dual system for a friend with a full siphon over 20 feet. I'm doing the same at my house at the moment at greater lengths :)

Cully has a good point on water flowing back to the sump. If you look at my V2 upgrade thread I calculated the volume of water in the full siphon lines, and it adds up!

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2109690

If you go full siphon make sure to use gate valves.

I also aim for 5x turn over from the return pump, though you can go to 3, aim for 5. this should be coupled with good powerheads so you get a good turnover within the tank of at least 20x for SPS

The plumbing size - yes, size matters. it has to do with the friction on the edge of the pipe, the smaller the pipe, the harder it is to get the water through. If you size properly you get more flow which could mean a smaller pump for the same effect (lower recurring electric cost). you can somewhat cover this with a pressure biased pump, but that usually means more electricity :(

your tank is a 150 so we will aim for a flow rate of 750GPH
7 vertical and 10 horizontal with (4) 90 degree bend
using RC calculator: http://reefcentral.com/index.php/head-loss-calculator

Note:
(1) I pulled the prices from dr foster and smith, there are cheaper places
(2) I personally am moving away from Mag pumps, I used the example to show the significance of proper plumbing

to get 705GPH on 3/4" pipe you need a MAG24 ($242)
you can get 675GPH with a Mag 12 if you use 1" piping ($171)
you can get 797GPH with a Mag 12 if you use 1 1/4" piping ($171)

so you can get 92GPH more from a pump that draws less power and costs $70 less by using 1 1/4" instead of 3/4"

If you need to go through a tight area for the siphon or return, reduce it and bump back up, yes it will affect the turnover, however it is MUCH better than running a smaller diameter throughout.

In your case I would look at a 1 1/4" for the return, 1" for full siphon (forgot the number, believe it is over 1500GPH on full siphon on a 1" line), and a 1 1/2" for the regular drain.

for an external pump I would consider (in no order) - Nate knows his pumps, he can weigh in on which are better than others. I put a * next to what I would look at
785GPH - blue line HD 40x
700GPH - Iwaki 40RT-2
* 993GPH - Iwaki 40-RXT-2
728GPH - little giant 4 MDQ
* 936GPH - MDQX
* 955GPH - Gen-X Mak4
Reeflo Dart (not in the calculator - should be around 700GPH)

internal:
quiteone 4000 High Head (haven't used this specific one, but I have been enjoying my quite one pumps, very easy to service)
(I left the Mag off, because I'm just not impressed anymore)
 
Blurry said:
There should be no issue pulling a siphon over that distance. I just built a 420 gallon dual system for a friend with a full siphon over 20 feet. I'm doing the same at my house at the moment at greater lengths :)

Cully has a good point on water flowing back to the sump. If you look at my V2 upgrade thread I calculated the volume of water in the full siphon lines, and it adds up!

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2109690

If you go full siphon make sure to use gate valves.


I also aim for 5x turn over from the return pump, though you can go to 3, aim for 5. this should be coupled with good powerheads so you get a good turnover within the tank of at least 20x for SPS

The plumbing size - yes, size matters. it has to do with the friction on the edge of the pipe, the smaller the pipe, the harder it is to get the water through. If you size properly you get more flow which could mean a smaller pump for the same effect (lower recurring electric cost). you can somewhat cover this with a pressure biased pump, but that usually means more electricity :(

your tank is a 150 so we will aim for a flow rate of 750GPH
7 vertical and 10 horizontal with (4) 90 degree bend
using RC calculator: http://reefcentral.com/index.php/head-loss-calculator

Note:
(1) I pulled the prices from dr foster and smith, there are cheaper places
(2) I personally am moving away from Mag pumps, I used the example to show the significance of proper plumbing

to get 705GPH on 3/4" pipe you need a MAG24 ($242)
you can get 675GPH with a Mag 12 if you use 1" piping ($171)
you can get 797GPH with a Mag 12 if you use 1 1/4" piping ($171)

so you can get 92GPH more from a pump that draws less power and costs $70 less by using 1 1/4" instead of 3/4"

If you need to go through a tight area for the siphon or return, reduce it and bump back up, yes it will affect the turnover, however it is MUCH better than running a smaller diameter throughout.

In your case I would look at a 1 1/4" for the return, 1" for full siphon (forgot the number, believe it is over 1500GPH on full siphon on a 1" line), and a 1 1/2" for the regular drain.

for an external pump I would consider (in no order) - Nate knows his pumps, he can weigh in on which are better than others. I put a * next to what I would look at
785GPH - blue line HD 40x
700GPH - Iwaki 40RT-2
* 993GPH - Iwaki 40-RXT-2
728GPH - little giant 4 MDQ
* 936GPH - MDQX
* 955GPH - Gen-X Mak4
Reeflo Dart (not in the calculator - should be around 700GPH)

internal:
quiteone 4000 High Head (haven't used this specific one, but I have been enjoying my quite one pumps, very easy to service)
(I left the Mag off, because I'm just not impressed anymore)
Click to expand...


GREAT POST Pascal!

Gate valves are a MUST IMO and make adjustability a snap. I used one gate on my main siphon line and ball valves on the 2 emergency back ups as they don't need to be fine tuned so much as they just need to be present. Main reason was a 1.5" gate is like $25. Ball valves, significantly less.

I was AMAZED at the number of trips I took and the costs I incurred just from PVC piping and, more so, PVC fittings. Design well. Measure twice cut once. Do a dry run before gluing!! :spin2::headwallblue:
 
Lots has happened since this last post and I'll be sure to update soon.

For now here's a teaser pic of the small island!
2012-07-02_10-48-04_422.jpg



*Small being about 18" tall and about 20lbs! ;)
 
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