Fish in shock, can't swim

[CStrickland]

Even if I didn't acclimate he probably wouldn't have made it anyway. Rip poor fish
I think the shipping is too much stress for any fish.

Sorry for your loss.
It can be a crapshoot wherever you buy fish. Just like how some stores are better than others, some online sellers are more reliable too. But sometimes they just die. It's kinda amazing that any fish survive if you think about what they go through - swimming happy in the ocean, caught, packaged, shipped around the world to a distributor, then to a shop, maybe sold and returned again, before we get them in our tanks. If you've had better luck with your local store, you're lucky to have a good one. I've only ever bought fish online, and I've had pretty good luck but def not perfect.

Have you tried to get a credit from the seller? The better ones guarantee the fish will survive for some time after you get it, and often if it arrives dead they'll replace it.

 

[10GalReef]

The seller is sending me a replacement. (yay)
I don't like my lfs, not worth the hour drive and not much variety.
I don't think Liveaquaria ships to Canada :c

 

[Sk8r]

Well, good for that. THey want a return customer. But they're also doing right.

BTW, when you do get a replacement, be sure to put an anti-jump screen of some sort on that tank. Firefish are notorious jumpers when startled.

 

[Nina51]

Not always possible.
Some people live in areas where an LFS is nonexistant.

this ^. my lfs is an hour away. it might as well be nonexistent because all of their tanks have ich.

Even if I didn't acclimate he probably wouldn't have made it anyway. Rip poor fish
I think the shipping is too much stress for any fish.

sorry he didn't make it but i agree with the no acclimation method. other than to match temp and salinity, there is nothing more you need to do. hope you have a better experience with your replacement fish!

 

[johnike]

And don't give up on shipped fish, how do you think they got to the LFS?
They didn't swim there.

 

[10GalReef]

The lid went on the tank when I caught my toddler "petting" the fish and corals lol
Funny thing is the seller recommended me to drip acclimate the fish.
Do any of you think the temperature swings could have traumatized him? It was really cold the day he arrived and no heat pads in the box.

 

[davidsb]

My LFS has always said to drip acclimation method. Why would they promote drip ?

 

[jayball]

My LFS has always said to drip acclimation method. Why would they promote drip ?

Up to a couple hours in the bag is no problem. When they have been in the same little bag all night excreting ammonia it is deadly when the ph swing causes it to become toxic.

I match my qt to the bag salinity and drop them in.

 

[Sk8r]

THe problem arises with shipping, wherein excretions and respiratory chemicals pile up as ammonium. The bag opens. C02 escapes, which drops the PH, and the PH shift converts harmless ammonium to lethal ammonia within 30 minutes---THAT's WHY the 'no longer than 30 min' warning. Prime can offset this, but there's an easier way: prepare a qt at the incoming salinity and just put the fellow right on in.

The drip method pre-dates overnight shipping. A lot of stores echo the advice but it's antiquated and not the best way to do it. Acclimation of marine fish is 99.9999999% about salinity, and bad procedure has killed a lot of fish. If it matches within .002, you're good. You can raise it .002 every few minutes, but sometimes it comes in wildly 'out'. If you'd known they were going to ship at 1.009, you'd have had a qt tank set to that, rather than trying to ratchet up the salinity to 1.24, which is a long, long, and dangerous climb to be done in 30 minutes. Use the phone. Talk to the shipper. Ask about the salinity. They'll probably still talk about acclimation, but that's in their instructions; just ignore that, and have that pre-set qt, then bring the salinity up to dt level over a matter of days and weeks. No stress, no fuss, no death from kidney damage.

 

[Reef Frog]

The lid went on the tank when I caught my toddler "petting" the fish and corals lol
Funny thing is the seller recommended me to drip acclimate the fish.
Do any of you think the temperature swings could have traumatized him? It was really cold the day he arrived and no heat pads in the box.

I don't understand why the dangers of fish drip acclimation have not spread far and wide in the hobby. In the beginning I followed the drip method doctrine because some prominent book authors supported the idea. And I lost some fish that had seemed happy & healthy in a LFS tank just hours before. It seemed inexplicable at the time.

Since I learned of salinity matching, I haven't lost a fish. It's easy & cheap to do this in a QT. You can get the job done with Petco components for under $30. The QT not only allows you to raise the salinity to reef levels at the pace that's convenient to you, you get a good measure of disease prevention, an opportunity to fatten them up on your food without competition and get used to you as the source of food. All for 30 bucks.....what a deal!

Yes, temperature swings can certainly be hard on fish. And if a poor little fish is drip acclimated, not only is he subject to osmotic shock, but chances are temperature changes of 10 degrees F are likely in the average home. A double whammy.

 

[Reef Frog]

Just curious. What's the recommended way of "acclimating" fresh water fish these days? Way back when, the recommended procedure was to empty the bag in a container, & slowly replace about 10% of the water every few minutes for 30-45 minutes or so with display tank water, if my recollection is correct.

Are the hard core FW folks also doing QT, fluke/worm treatment, TTM and all of that?

 

[hkgar]

I use salinity acclimation (match) but always temp acclimate the incoming bag for at least 20 minutes

 

[Nina51]

The drip method pre-dates overnight shipping.

this ^. i suppose most people live within an hour or so of their LFS. that being the case, drip acclimation is ok since there won't be a big build up of ammonia in the bag. still, that method is time consuming and the quicker you get a new fish into qt (or dt for those who don't quarantine), the quicker it will adjust.

 

[10GalReef]

Update on new fish.
He's in a "qt" doing great! What a relief.
I don't exactly have a qt. It's a small bucket with a powerhead and heater. He seems happy and active.
Their salinity is 1.020 so I matched to qt to that and will slowly bring it up to my dt sg of 1.025. Even if it takes me all day I'm in no rush

 

[10GalReef]

Thanks Sk8tr and everyone for all the help!

 

[Sk8r]

Topping off with salt water is the best way to raise sg over a period of days. Recommended is a TTM qt, wherein your keep switching tanks for the fish so that if he is carrying ich, it will detach and get caught in the filters---the whole method is discussed in the stickies here and in Reef Discussion [I think] and Fish Disease. If you can master and practice that technique and keep your water quality up in the dt, you should have a long and happy fishkeeping experience.

 

[hkgar]

Since you are just getting started in reefing,let's get started the right way. If Ick ever gets in your tank it is a blank-blanking nightmare.

Use TTM - Tank transfer method for Ick. Treat during TTM PraziPro then A regular QT for 2-4 weeks.
Here is a link to TTM instructions
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2507836

Remember In reefing there are NO shortcuts. You want to raise Alk - slowly, Lower Phosphates - Slowly. Chang salinity - you guessed it - slowly.

 

[Zoregon]

Wondering who you ordered the fish through? I'm in Ontario and just setting up my tank. The nearest LFS of any kind to me is 1.5 hours away.....would love to be able to mail order.

 

[lespaul339]

Not always possible.
Some people live in areas where an LFS is nonexistant.

That's me. It's a two hour drive if I want to go to a fish store that sells saltwater fish and corals. Online is convenient. Gets shipped right to my door.