Have ICH looky here!!!!!
- Thread starter WaterKeeper
- Start date
The four week quarantine is usually figured for a tank kept at 82°F. It figures the cysts emerge in 3 weeks while the other stages, free swimming and feeding, take about a week for completion I like to increase that just a bit to stay on the side of caution.
pclausen
New member
Setup a 480g system (180g reef, 150g fowlr, 150g sump) 2 weeks ago. I dropped 200# of LR from my previous system (all fish had died due to ich and having my hardwood floors redone) that had been cocking for 6 weeks into the 180g, and 200# of Marco base rock into the 150g.
I never did detect a cycle, so last weekend I picked up a pair of clowns and a snowflake. I dropped the eel into a 55g QT tank (filled with water from the main system) with a single LR also from the main system and a canister of LR rubble that had been running on the main system for 48 hours.
The clowns were dropped directly into the 180g DT. Then last night I noticed the clowns were developing white spots all over, so it looks like I never got rid of the ich from 8 weeks ago despite being fallow for all that time.
Being that the eel is in a tank filled with water from the main system, and the fact that I dropped a LR in there for him to hide in, I suspect he's now a carrier.
I moved the clowns into a 5g IO bucket last night and will be moving them into a 10g QT tank that I picked up today.
The eel will be moved into a 45g QT I will be setting up tonight, so that I can tear the 55g and move the LR back into the main system which will now have to be fallow for 6-8 weeks. I'll also dismantle the canister and ditch the LR rubble.
While the eel shows no signs of ich, I don't want to take any chances, so I was thinking of doing the tank to tank method with him for the next 12 days between the 45g and 55g tanks. Having nothing but PVC pipes and a HOB in each QT.
I was going to pick up a 2nd 10g for the clowns and do the TTM method for them as well. Does this sounds like a good approach being that I have the tanks and space? I know copper is out of the question for the eel and figured the TTM would be less stressful.
One other questions. I take it it is fine to do the initial fill from the main system, but that with each water change or fill of the other QT tank, should be carried out with freshly mixed water, and that as a result, for the TTM method, I should acclimate for 2 hours during each transition?
Btw, the eel is eating like a hog since the day I picked him up and he's about 1 foot long right now.
Thanks!
I never did detect a cycle, so last weekend I picked up a pair of clowns and a snowflake. I dropped the eel into a 55g QT tank (filled with water from the main system) with a single LR also from the main system and a canister of LR rubble that had been running on the main system for 48 hours.
The clowns were dropped directly into the 180g DT. Then last night I noticed the clowns were developing white spots all over, so it looks like I never got rid of the ich from 8 weeks ago despite being fallow for all that time.
Being that the eel is in a tank filled with water from the main system, and the fact that I dropped a LR in there for him to hide in, I suspect he's now a carrier.
I moved the clowns into a 5g IO bucket last night and will be moving them into a 10g QT tank that I picked up today.
The eel will be moved into a 45g QT I will be setting up tonight, so that I can tear the 55g and move the LR back into the main system which will now have to be fallow for 6-8 weeks. I'll also dismantle the canister and ditch the LR rubble.
While the eel shows no signs of ich, I don't want to take any chances, so I was thinking of doing the tank to tank method with him for the next 12 days between the 45g and 55g tanks. Having nothing but PVC pipes and a HOB in each QT.
I was going to pick up a 2nd 10g for the clowns and do the TTM method for them as well. Does this sounds like a good approach being that I have the tanks and space? I know copper is out of the question for the eel and figured the TTM would be less stressful.
One other questions. I take it it is fine to do the initial fill from the main system, but that with each water change or fill of the other QT tank, should be carried out with freshly mixed water, and that as a result, for the TTM method, I should acclimate for 2 hours during each transition?
Btw, the eel is eating like a hog since the day I picked him up and he's about 1 foot long right now.
Thanks!
pclausen
New member
I suppose there is the possiblity that the clowns had ich from the LFS? In that case, the eel might be fine since that QT was filled from the main system 2 days prior to his arrival.
The clowns are now doing fine in their 10g QT, they actually look better and are eating well.
The clowns are now doing fine in their 10g QT, they actually look better and are eating well.
Aquarist007
New member
it is very likely the clowns had the ich from the LFS--when you put them directly into the tank did you also add the water from the lfs that was in the bag?
MotherFish
New member
I'm glad to hear they are doing better.
Now you can start tank transfers on them every 3 days and they should be safe from reinfection while in QT.
Unfortunately, since they were introduced into the display tank, they have most likely infected the tank with fresh cysts which means another long fallow period to clear the DT again. Sorry.
Now you can start tank transfers on them every 3 days and they should be safe from reinfection while in QT.
Unfortunately, since they were introduced into the display tank, they have most likely infected the tank with fresh cysts which means another long fallow period to clear the DT again. Sorry.
Aquarist007
New member
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14922992#post14922992 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by MotherFish
I'm glad to hear they are doing better.
Now you can start tank transfers on them every 3 days and they should be safe from reinfection while in QT.
Unfortunately, since they were introduced into the display tank, they have most likely infected the tank with fresh cysts which means another long fallow period to clear the DT again. Sorry.
+ 1---again sorry but you have no choice in leaving the dt fishless
I agree, the tank should have been ich free by the time the new fish were added. They had to be infected when introduced. That is one of the problems with detecting ich on fish at the LFS. Often the proprietors will have high turnovers of fish and place them in a tank that contains ich cysts. The newly introduced fish acquire ich but it has not been hosting on them long enough to be readily apparent. The spots do not appear as soon as the parasite burrows into the fish. Only when they are brought home for a few days has the infection progressed to the point where the aquarist can visually see the spots.
pclausen
New member
The clowns are doing very well this morning. No spots at all and very active/hungry. I'll do the tank swap regimen over the next 12 days.
So the good news I suppose is that the eel is likely not infected since I setup his QT tank 2 days before introducing the clowns to the display.
Waterkeeper, that makes a lot of sense about the LFS tanks having ich cysts and new arrivals showing no outwards signs. Goes to underscore the importance of using QT tanks for sure.
I increased the temp in the main system to 82 degrees. The only thing in there right now other than the LR and base rock are 12 peppermints that are doing a good job on the aiptasia. Drs Foster and Smith had those on sale for $4.99 last week, so I went ahead and picked up a dozen. They should be ok at this temp for 6-8 weeks, right?
Thanks everyone.
p.s. I wasn't really planning on dropping the clowns directly in the main system, but the wife was with me at the LFS and she absolutely wanted us to pick up both the eel and clowns and of course putting all of them in the one QT that was up and running at the time would have not have turned out well (the clowns are tiny).
So the good news I suppose is that the eel is likely not infected since I setup his QT tank 2 days before introducing the clowns to the display.
Waterkeeper, that makes a lot of sense about the LFS tanks having ich cysts and new arrivals showing no outwards signs. Goes to underscore the importance of using QT tanks for sure.
I increased the temp in the main system to 82 degrees. The only thing in there right now other than the LR and base rock are 12 peppermints that are doing a good job on the aiptasia. Drs Foster and Smith had those on sale for $4.99 last week, so I went ahead and picked up a dozen. They should be ok at this temp for 6-8 weeks, right?
Thanks everyone.
p.s. I wasn't really planning on dropping the clowns directly in the main system, but the wife was with me at the LFS and she absolutely wanted us to pick up both the eel and clowns and of course putting all of them in the one QT that was up and running at the time would have not have turned out well (the clowns are tiny).
Aquarist007
New member
glad things are doing better
In the above senerio---a piece of plexglass with holes in it for flow would have worked well in the qt as a divider or separator
Aquarist007
New member
WK--is quarantining live rock for ich really necessary. These guys do and they have been add it alot longer then me
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1631060
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1631060
Hmm, I guess fish hitchhike (gobies?), but at least we can narrow down the stage that any potential crypto is at.
I'd like to add to your question with the thought that we might be able to use aggressive QT techniques with rock and ask whether there's a way to kill crypto instantly that won't hurt the rock.
I'd like to add to your question with the thought that we might be able to use aggressive QT techniques with rock and ask whether there's a way to kill crypto instantly that won't hurt the rock.
Good questions; to be perfectly safe the answer is yes, QT anything added to the tank from another location. As was pointed out in that link, LR from the LFS may have been exposed to fish and can therefore be carrying the parasite. Wild harvested LR is usually somewhat safer as it was not near fish during transport. If cured in the display, the curing period will serve as a quarantine period as it usually takes almost a month before the rock is fully cured. However, adding a few pieces of cured rock to a tank could possibly harbor ich if it was exposed to fish recently.
Sorry to say Joel there is no treatment that will specifically kill ich without also harming the rock. The only sure way to avoid problems is to give things at least a month of isolation before adding them to the tank.
Sorry to say Joel there is no treatment that will specifically kill ich without also harming the rock. The only sure way to avoid problems is to give things at least a month of isolation before adding them to the tank.
Aquarist007
New member
Thanks WK
I guess in light of your answer the most suitable way to deal with live rock is cure it individually ourselves in a separate vat or container, then add it to the display tank.
That's by far the best method. Cure water is really nasty stuff and contains all sorts of nutrients that your display could do well without. Curing it in vats lets one throw all that crummy water down the drain when the cure is complete. It also pretty much eliminates many pathogens that could be harbored on the LR.
KDDG
New member
Maybe this has been covered- I tried reading the whole thread. About tangs & treatment- How bad is it to treat a tang with copper and what are the possible side effects of doing so? I don't know if I feel comfortable with lowering the salinity. If you think this is the only way, then help me feel more confident some how "Tangs don't do well" is not really discriptive enough. What's the real deal? Has anyone successfully treated tangs with copper?
"Tangs don't do well" is not really discriptive enough. What's the real deal? Has anyone successfully treated tangs with copper?hi , sorry if my question is answered before , but i can't find any thing !!
so my question is ( hope someone will make it clear for me!):
my thank is 150 g
water parameter are near ferfect !
2 tomato c.
dottyback
goby
copperband
cleaner shrimp
yellow tail blue damsel
powder black tang
the tang is the only fish having ich
in the morning he is clean and afternoon to evening he is covered with ich
i have him since more than one month
why he is clean morning and .... ?
why other fish are parasite free ?
if the parasite is having his cycle, why it attaks just the tang and not all the fish in the tank ?
i had the same issue before with domino damsel , but in other tank , and it was the stronger fish in the tank and again other fish never been infected !!!!!!!!!!!!!
so my question is ( hope someone will make it clear for me!):
my thank is 150 g
water parameter are near ferfect !
2 tomato c.
dottyback
goby
copperband
cleaner shrimp
yellow tail blue damsel
powder black tang
the tang is the only fish having ich
in the morning he is clean and afternoon to evening he is covered with ich
i have him since more than one month
why he is clean morning and .... ?
why other fish are parasite free ?
if the parasite is having his cycle, why it attaks just the tang and not all the fish in the tank ?
i had the same issue before with domino damsel , but in other tank , and it was the stronger fish in the tank and again other fish never been infected !!!!!!!!!!!!!
That does sound strange. How long has the tang shown the spots? Since you first got him?
Ich spots do go away when the parasite leaves the fish but not in a 12 hour period. It is possible they are bubbles but I tend to doubt that as the other fish would also have them. Another thing is I'm not sure of what fish a powder black clown is. Could it be you meant the powder brown, Acanthurus japonicus? It may be just a coloration change as he wakes up in the morning.
Ich spots do go away when the parasite leaves the fish but not in a 12 hour period. It is possible they are bubbles but I tend to doubt that as the other fish would also have them. Another thing is I'm not sure of what fish a powder black clown is. Could it be you meant the powder brown, Acanthurus japonicus? It may be just a coloration change as he wakes up in the morning.
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