How this Geezer thinks the hobby will evolve

[Spyderturbo007]

I like the way you think!!!!! I would like to see all the idea's that are half thrown together in your workshop

I'm trying to send you a PM Noob, but it keeps saying you turned them off or you're not allowed to receive them.

Sorry for cluttering up your thread with that Paul B, but I had no other way of getting a hold of Noob.

 

[Paul B]

Maybe you could start with one of those towel dispenser things...

Yes, something like that. I have so many ideas and projects started that I don't have room right now, but I will get to it.

 

[mistacheese]

At my local Canadian Tire we sell whole home humidifiers that are a large rotating screen that dips into water at the bottom and a fan blows the screen that isn't in the water. I bet one could modify one of these easily to do just as you explain. Simply adjusting the speed it rotates and removing the fan and I think you would have what you describe.

Thanks Paul, another interesting topic to digest.

 

[Paul B]

That would be fine.
My only problem now is that I have to go to canada, buy a humidifier, throw it away and keep the mechanism that rotates the screen. :lol2:

But, yes, that is what I need. I will try to design a simple, cheap one.:wavehand:

 

[gone fishin]

Paul you strike me as a guy that is always up for a road trip to somewhere. Maybe you should look into a government grant for the research this is just crazy enough to get a million or two LOL

 

[Paul B]

I deal with the Government as little as I need to. Have you ever tried to contact the Dept. of Veteran Affairs? or the Dept of Envirnmental Conservation? Medicare? Social Security? It is a joke to try to get anything from the Govt. especially if you are a tax paying citicen or a Veteran.
You will get dizzy from the run around.

 

[CocaColaza]

Paul is the algae wheel idea not simmilar to an algae scrubber? Instead of the algae surface going in and out of the water , water slowly runs over the surface via a small pump.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2

 

[palmer373]

Paul is the algae wheel idea not simmilar to an algae scrubber? Instead of the algae surface going in and out of the water , water slowly runs over the surface via a small pump.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2

I was thinking the same thing but I think what Paul is getting at is the algae in his tank seems to be growing better where it's not submerged all the time, like on the tops of his exposed rocks where water periodically splashes on it and on the water line where undulating water only temporally submerges the algae. With an ATS, the algae is constantly submerged by a thin layer of water. I believe Paul's theory is algae grows best when it is only periodically submerged, thus the conveyor-belt-style scrubber where part of the conveyor belt is exposed to air instead of a vertical scrubber where all of the screen is submerged.

Paul, I'm curious if the algae would grow best if the light (I'm assuming we're using a light like on an ATS, not ambient light to grow the algae) is placed over the algae while it's submerged or when it's exposed. I guess you could circumnavigate that "problem" by having the conveyor belt tilted, so one side of the top is submerged 2" while the other end is lifted out of the water 2" or so. That way the algae would be slowly transferred from submerged to exposed then submerged again, etc. The amount of RPMs the conveyor belt makes would be a good thing to test, to determine if more or less RPMs would provide a better growing area. Not too slow so the screen doesn't dry out but not too fast that the algae doesn't have a sufficient photoperiod, if that makes sense.

You're not the only one that rambles.

 

[Paul B]

is the algae wheel idea not simmilar to an algae scrubber? Instead of the algae surface going in and out of the water , water slowly runs over the surface via a small pump.

That is what I have in my reef now and it grows OK but I still get much more algae just at the line at the surface of the water.

but I think what Paul is getting at is the algae in his tank seems to be growing better where it's not submerged all the time,

Exactly. I want to force the algae to grow even if it doesn't want to.
I think the lighting will be when the algae is mostly out of the water. In the tropics there is abundant algae growth on damp rocks in bright sun almost totally out of the water but where it will stay wet.
Here in New York where I did most of my diving the algae grows much more on rocks that are out of the water at low tide and much less where it is constantly submerged. This is just an observation and I base everything Iknow on personal observation. Growing algae in this fashion is not something I have ever heard about inthe aquarium field, but that doesn't mean it won't work. It wil be a test like everything else I do.
Lately I have been very busy and barely have time to put gas in my car, but I will get to it.
I was drawing some sketches 4:00 this morning. Unfortunately, these things keep me up at night. :fun5:

You're not the only one that rambles

THank God

 

[JHawlz9989]

Paul,

What if the flow in your scrubber were reduced? Wouldn't we be able to reduce the flow to a point where it is essentially mimics the environment you're looking for?

If this is possible, it seems that horizontal turf scrubbers may be better, since the vertical ones need a certain amount of flow to prevent algae growing into the pipes. Or, what if the flow rate that others have discovered with vertical scrubbers actually reflect the environment you're looking for?

Just a thought,

Josh

 

[Paul B]

I can't control the flow on mine because my skimmer feeds it. All the water that comes out of my skimmer runs along my trough. It works well but I am always looking for better.

 

[Paul B]

I do think that in the near future all marine animals will have to be cultured as well as rock. This could be a good thing and fairly easy as long as there is a billionaire someplace that wants to do it. If you have ever flown to the South Pacific you will fly over dozens of un inhabited Islands. They are un inhabited because they have no fresh water. No fresh water normally means no people but plenty of marine life. On just one of these atolls all the fish and corals we want could be aquacultured in large screened enclosures.
Those Islands are made of reef rock which could be put in the sea to become live.
The local people on surrounding Islands could work these Islands as unimployment is huge in these places and many people are subsistance fisherman anyway.
Every month or so a small ship could be used to take the harvest to an airport or a landing strip could be built on the island itself. We used to build landing strips in Viet Nam all the time in a few days.
The project would be a huge expense to begin with but eventually will pay itself back and will also help to preserve the existing reefs where livestock is now collected.
If I was 30 years younger I myself would look into leasing or buying one of those Islands.
The problem is that when you are young enough, you are interested in other things and when you have the time, you don't have the energy to live on a South Pacific Island.
But I would love to do something like that. That has always been my dream but unfortunately, life has it's obligations.
I know a guy on the Island of Jamaica that owns 3 dive shops and a nice sailboat. He sails around the Island with two of the most beautiful girls I have ever seen and you can sail with him and dive. The girls are dive masters and SCUBA guides.
The guy has one of the best lives I could imagine, all you need is a little money and a dream.

 

[Paul B]

How about food. There are so many posts about diseases and ich but I think they will disappear in the future. Saltwater fish in good shape rarely if ever get sick. I have thought for many years that it is just nutrition that will prevent that. Many people feed a variety of foods but fish don't need a variety, they need what they were built to eat.
Most fish are carnivores and most of their prey is smaller fish. There are very few fish that won't eat a fish small enough to easily fit in their mouth.
That is the most perfect food for a fish because everything a fish needs is in a fish meal.
I feel that the food for sale today is woefully lacking in many things fish need to stay healthy and ward off diseases through their immune system.
I get my theory on this because my fish don't seem to ever get sick and I do not have to quarantine.
So I think the food of the future will be some type of pellet but not like the traditional ones, more like what an astronaut could eat. Not a dry pellet but something that will have a tasty shell outside but the inside will be nutrients that could not be incorporated in fish food like fish oil and calcium, two important nutrients that our fish need but almost never get enough of. If they could design a food like this I believe diseases will be a thing of the past. A fishes diet should be about 1/4 oil but it never is because fish oil goes bad in the presence of oxygen. This alone, I feel will keep fish in breeding condition and free of most diseases.
Don't believe me? Start your own thread about diseases :worried:
I also believe tiny frozen fish will also be offered commercially which will have everything in it and there will be no need to feed anything else.
I spoke to "Ocean Nutrition" about that but they never got back to me.
Frozen food is not as easy to feed as dry foods but I am sure someone will introduce a frozen food dispenser soon. It is not that big deal to build, but refrigeration at the present time is expensive. I am sure that a tiny compressor in a tiny insulated vending container is not insurmountable.
I could build one myself if I had time.:smokin:
So that is my theory on food.

 

[Paul B]

Lighting is a no brainer and the only lighting of the future will be LEDs. LEDs are the only lighting that doesn't rely on electricity heating an element to either produce light directly from the heated filiment or using the heated element to excite gasses as in flourescent and MH lighting. That heat is wasted energy. LEDs produce light directly from excited electrons without first going through that heat stage so almost no power is wasted making heat. They are cheap to build and are getting cheaper all the time.
Already most street lights are LEDs as are low voltage light bulbs on trucks, cars and busses. You can now buy LED lamps that fit in regular flourescent fixtures but so far they are expensive. No one really knows how long LEDs will last because they have not been in widespread use for very long except as pilot and warning lights.
I personally have never seen one burn out but I have no idea if their spectrum changes over time. I know my LED flashlights heva never burned out and the batteries last much longer than traditional flashlights. Regular incandescent bulbs will soon be a thing of the past. They have been around for just about 100 years and served a purpose but it is time to move on.
I know my corals have been growing great since I changed from MH.

(From The Net
Light emitting diodes, commonly called LEDs, are real unsung heroes in the electronics world. They do dozens of different jobs and are found in all kinds of devices. Among other things, they form numbers on digital clocks, transmit information from remote controls, light up watches and tell you when your appliances are turned on. Collected together, they can form images on a jumbo television screen or illuminate a traffic light.

Basically, LEDs are just tiny light bulbs that fit easily into an electrical circuit. But unlike ordinary incandescent bulbs, they don't have a filament that will burn out, and they don't get especially hot. They are illuminated solely by the movement of electrons in a semiconductor material, and they last just as long as a standard transistor. The lifespan of an LED surpasses the short life of an incandescent bulb by thousands of hours. Tiny LEDs are already replacing the tubes that light up LCD HDTVs to make dramatically thinner televisions.

 

[Zach Vs Ponies]

I do think that in the near future all marine animals will have to be cultured as well as rock. This could be a good thing and fairly easy as long as there is a billionaire someplace that wants to do it. If you have ever flown to the South Pacific you will fly over dozens of un inhabited Islands. They are un inhabited because they have no fresh water. No fresh water normally means no people but plenty of marine life. On just one of these atolls all the fish and corals we want could be aquacultured in large screened enclosures.
Those Islands are made of reef rock which could be put in the sea to become live.
The local people on surrounding Islands could work these Islands as unimployment is huge in these places and many people are subsistance fisherman anyway.
Every month or so a small ship could be used to take the harvest to an airport or a landing strip could be built on the island itself. We used to build landing strips in Viet Nam all the time in a few days.
The project would be a huge expense to begin with but eventually will pay itself back and will also help to preserve the existing reefs where livestock is now collected.
If I was 30 years younger I myself would look into leasing or buying one of those Islands.
The problem is that when you are young enough, you are interested in other things and when you have the time, you don't have the energy to live on a South Pacific Island.
But I would love to do something like that. That has always been my dream but unfortunately, life has it's obligations.
I know a guy on the Island of Jamaica that owns 3 dive shops and a nice sailboat. He sails around the Island with two of the most beautiful girls I have ever seen and you can sail with him and dive. The girls are dive masters and SCUBA guides.
The guy has one of the best lives I could imagine, all you need is a little money and a dream.

Me to my dad, "Hey dad, I need a couple million to go save the fish!" Seriously though, I didn't know this kind of place existed. Pretty cool. We need someone to do this!!:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

[Paul B]

I didn't know this kind of place existed. Pretty cool. We need someone to do this!!

There are hundreds of uninhabited Islands and Atolls especially in the South Pacific. I have been to a few of them in Tahiti. No people, just palm trees, turtles and fish.
They are all over the place. The Governments who own them, I am sure would gladly welcome someone to use them for something so they can make some revenue.
A barge would have to be towed there with fresh water, supplies and to be used for housing. People would not have to live there full time, just supervise the place and collect the fish and corals that would be aquacultured. It's a no brainer.
About 8 years ago I got a call from some people in Greece. Then read an article of mine that had a picture of some baby octopus I hatched and they wanted me to go to Greece and start an octopus "farm" to raise octopus for the sea food market because they are so overfished in the waters around Greece and Italy.
I was thinking about going but then I thought I was still working here and if the thing fell through, I would be out of a job and my pension.

But getting back to an Island, there are still uninhabited Islands in the Caribbean but not as many and I think they are all owned by someone and most of them that have any possabilities are already planned to be resorts. The South Pacific is much better but the Caribbean could easily be used to farm rock. Many of the people on those Islands are starving. I have been to most of the Caribbean and I am sure they would welcome the work. Farming fish for hobbiests is much more lucrative than catching fish for food. On St Lucia I saw a fisherman selling lookdowns, moray eels, baracuda, flying fish, jacks, and tangs for food for fifty cents a pound. He just draged his net up on the beach and tried to sell them. I didn't see him sell any and the fish just rotted on the sand.

 

[Zach Vs Ponies]

There are hundreds of uninhabited Islands and Atolls especially in the South Pacific. I have been to a few of them in Tahiti. No people, just palm trees, turtles and fish.
They are all over the place. The Governments who own them, I am sure would gladly welcome someone to use them for something so they can make some revenue.
A barge would have to be towed there with fresh water, supplies and to be used for housing. People would not have to live there full time, just supervise the place and collect the fish and corals that would be aquacultured. It's a no brainer.
About 8 years ago I got a call from some people in Greece. Then read an article of mine that had a picture of some baby octopus I hatched and they wanted me to go to Greece and start an octopus "farm" to raise octopus for the sea food market because they are so overfished in the waters around Greece and Italy.
I was thinking about going but then I thought I was still working here and if the thing fell through, I would be out of a job and my pension.

But getting back to an Island, there are still uninhabited Islands in the Caribbean but not as many and I think they are all owned by someone and most of them that have any possabilities are already planned to be resorts. The South Pacific is much better but the Caribbean could easily be used to farm rock. Many of the people on those Islands are starving. I have been to most of the Caribbean and I am sure they would welcome the work. Farming fish for hobbiests is much more lucrative than catching fish for food. On St Lucia I saw a fisherman selling lookdowns, moray eels, baracuda, flying fish, jacks, and tangs for food for fifty cents a pound. He just draged his net up on the beach and tried to sell them. I didn't see him sell any and the fish just rotted on the sand.

That's really interesting. I've looked through many of your posts, and I can definitely tell that you have been able to raise and keep some pretty cool things. About the octopuses, how old did your babies get?

You are so knowledgeable about fish. I have read that you have pretty much been raising fish all of your life, but have you ever taken some kind of college course or class on fish keeping or ocean biology? You probably know more than some biologists I've met.:bounce1:

 

[Paul B]

I was not able to raise those octopus for more than a couple of weeks. I got that pregnant octopus for free because the store didn't want it and it gave birth in a couple of days, all I had was brine shrimp. If it was summertime I would have probably collected food for them and may have had better luck.
I never took a college course in fish. I am kind of self taught with that. There is no course for a hobby. Marine biology is mostly for mammals and food fish. Oceanology also has nothing to do with fish per say.
I have been studying marine life all my life and have been diving all of my adult life.
There is plenty that I don't know and I am trying to figure out as much as I can before I croak.

 

[Dante_JoseCuerv]

I do think that in the near future all marine animals will have to be cultured as well as rock.

It's funny that I found this now because a couple days ago my sister was telling me that I should start my own aquaculture facility. I reminded her that while I am quite fascinated and obsessed with marine life, and that I'm a biologist, that my specialty right now is filamentous fungi.

Great thread as usual though.

 

[Paul B]

An aquaculture farm sounds great, I think thwe only problem is that it takes a huge investment with not much income unless you already own an island someplace where you can collect rock.

specialty right now is filamentous fungi.

I don't know if there is much calling for that. But I don't even know what it is so what do I know? :lol2: