If you think your fish has velvet - it is not too late.

[alprazo]

I just wanted to comment on velvet. It has an ability to infect like no other, the lethality is extremely high and the course is surprisingly fast. It probably has caused more people to leave the hobby than any other disease with total wipe outs within days of exposure. Often it is too late once you even think your fish may have it. That said, with practice and experimentation, I have learned how to save many fish from even late stages of it disease.

Velvet kills like ich, another other single celled parasite, by causing inflammation and eventually edema (swelling) of gills. The thickened gill inhibits oxygen exchange. The fish breathes faster and harder in an attempt to increase the exchange, but in doing so, metabolism increases as fish demands more oxygen. This viscous cycle ends by the fish fatiguing and finally suffocating or having a heart attack due to lack of oxygen and tremendous cardiac strain.

Several steps can be taken to break this cycle and salvage the fish.

First it is important to decrease metabolic demand and this can be done by:

- Decreasing the temperature - I shoot for 70 or lower over several hours.
- Decreasing the Specific Gravity to 1.015 (can be done immediately)

Next you want to increase the oxygen saturation in the water. This will promote better exchange. I aim for a 200% dissolved oxygen level with my YSI DO meter. (Measurement is not 100% necessary).

- Pure oxygen is easily bought from either a welding supply store or a medical supply house. Oxygen is cheap and useful for several applications like power outages and transporting. You also want an airstone that produces a superfine bubble. They are typically made for pure gas and have warnings about using air.
- Temperature reduction - This not only reduces metabolism in the fish, but it will also increase the waters capacity to carry dissolved oxygen.


Edema reduction: Steroids


Just like giving a shot in the knee - it helps to reduce the swelling.


- Intramuscular dexamethasone with an estimated dose of 1-2 mg/kg into the muscle on the side of the dorsal ridge. (impossible to be precise in small fish)

I sounds difficult but it is not. A tuberculin syringe with a 27 gauge needle to draw up the solution and a 30 gauge needle to inject.


Following the above protocol, I have witnessed more than a couple of fish recover from assured demise.

I also recommend treating with chloroquine. Formalin unfortunately is an irritant and theoretically could worsen the gill edema.

BTW - the same protocol can be use with ICH.

 

[Dmorty217]

I just wanted to comment on velvet. It has an ability to infect like no other, the lethality is extremely high and the course is surprisingly fast. It probably has caused more people to leave the hobby than any other disease with total wipe outs within days of exposure. Often it is too late once you even think your fish may have it. That said, with practice and experimentation, I have learned how to save many fish from even late stages of it disease.

Velvet kills like ich, another other single celled parasite, by causing inflammation and eventually edema (swelling) of gills. The thickened gill inhibits oxygen exchange. The fish breathes faster and harder in an attempt to increase the exchange, but in doing so, metabolism increases as fish demands more oxygen. This viscous cycle ends by the fish fatiguing and finally suffocating or having a heart attack due to lack of oxygen and tremendous cardiac strain.

Several steps can be taken to break this cycle and salvage the fish.

First it is important to decrease metabolic demand and this can be done by:

- Decreasing the temperature - I shoot for 70 or lower over several hours.
- Decreasing the Specific Gravity to 1.015 (can be done immediately)

Next you want to increase the oxygen saturation in the water. This will promote better exchange. I aim for a 200% dissolved oxygen level with my YSI DO meter. (Measurement is not 100% necessary).

- Pure oxygen is easily bought from either a welding supply store or a medical supply house. Oxygen is cheap and useful for several applications like power outages and transporting. You also want an airstone that produces a superfine bubble. They are typically made for pure gas and have warnings about using air.
- Temperature reduction - This not only reduces metabolism in the fish, but it will also increase the waters capacity to carry dissolved oxygen.


Edema reduction: Steroids


Just like giving a shot in the knee - it helps to reduce the swelling.


- Intramuscular dexamethasone with an estimated dose of 1-2 mg/kg into the muscle on the side of the dorsal ridge. (impossible to be precise in small fish)

I sounds difficult but it is not. A tuberculin syringe with a 27 gauge needle to draw up the solution and a 30 gauge needle to inject.


Following the above protocol, I have witnessed more than a couple of fish recover from assured demise.

I also recommend treating with chloroquine. Formalin unfortunately is an irritant and theoretically could worsen the gill edema.

BTW - the same protocol can be use with ICH.

Where can I find steroid easily? I agree that formalin may ultimately kill the already weakened fish. Do you start treatment immediately for new arrivals or what is your protocol? I have spoke a lot with you on force feeding but not much on your QT protocol. Seems that velvet seems to be the new "ich" in people tanks lately

 

[ThRoewer]

Thanks for sharing!

Formalin is best for prevention before there are any symptoms. This method is more for curing already sick fish (I try hard never to get to that point).

I would think this method works best for larger fish. Giving tiny fish an injection may be deadly to them by it self, especially if carried out by someone untrained.

Also there are limitations on the fish that can be treated with CP. If you have seahorses, pipefish or certain wrasses you can't use it and formalin is your only chance.

 

[alprazo]

This method is more for curing already sick fish (I try hard never to get to that point).

Exactly! The goal is prevention, but if TTM is your method of QT, you are destined to run into this scenario. I developed this protocol pre-CP. it's a long story, that I will post when I have time, but for a while I was trying to immunize my fish for velvet and developed this protocol when they receive too large of an infective dose or It went bad.

My QT protocol. Formalin dip in pH matched freshwater. Then 30 days of CP and prazi. Dimilin is also given but continued for 60 days. Another long story there. Elasmobranchs do no get dipped. I've never had a seahorse. Wrasse get cp too all but hoevens have made it for me though I tend to shy away from jumping fish. If the fish isn't doing well in QT, it dies in QT.

 

[alprazo]

As for the Dex, let me put some thought into it. I use my local veterinary pharmacy but I have come to learn that it isn't that easy for most. If you have a friend with a MD or a DVM/VMD that would probably be a good solution.

As for smaller fish, I definitely use it. I learned the technique from an owner of a LFS who would give it to fish that were in shock from temp changes or shipping stress and knew about it because they use it in the transport of sharks. I first saw him give it to a quarter sized semilarvatus butterfly lying on its side in total shock and watched it rebound over the next hour. There also isn't much harm in over dosing a doomed fish anyway.

 

[alprazo]

Looks like Dex can be ordered from Canada for about $11 a bottle.

 

[ThRoewer]

Looks like Dex can be ordered from Canada for about $11 a bottle.

You got a link? Might be worth having at hand.

BTW are there any antidepressant suitable for fish? I think I have a depressed Red Sea regal that needs something to raise its spirit so it starts eating again. According to DD it was eating before they shipped it to me, but now it just swims slowly and listless through the tank and doesn't look at any foods.
I know that some farms give Xanax and Prozac to chicken and pigs, so fish may work too.

 

[alprazo]

That is actually an interesting question. It is a shame THC is not water soluble. There are other products out there to stimulate the appetite. Dexamethasone is one. of them. That is something worth looking into.