Kessil Club

[madweazl]

Is there a thread where we can see others lighting schedules for the ap700?

Dana Riddle did some testing and stated Setting 2 had the best PUR and PAR with the light mounted 9" above the surface.

 

[Seaweed Brain]

Hello all. I just recently set up a new light combo and I'm wondering if I'm overdoing it a bit. I have an older Kessil 150w tuna blue over a 20gallon mixed reef. I added a reefbrite to give extra blue, coverage, and to add more of a dawn/dusk feel to the tank. the reefbrites come on first and are on the longest, about 10 hours total, then the kessil comes on about an hour and a half after and is on for about 7hours total. Kessil goes off first, then reefbrites.. My corals are doing ok, but not spectacular and I've been wondering if its just a little too much. Any input will be helpful and appreciated, Thanks

 

[dtapke]

Feel free to get mad at me, but I just got a Kessil a160we tuna for my 24g nanocube and I'm wondering the age old "how bright" question. As well as the color setting.

I didn't buy the 100 controller to get better control of the light, but currently running it on a new tank, 4-5 shrooms and a kenya tree is all thats in there. Don't want to over light them, or under light them.

I played around with how high off the tank to suspend it and am currently about 3-4" distance from water to the light, and that seems to be the closest i can run it and get a good pattern across the whole tank.

Should i invest in the light controller? I've been running it blue for an hour at 30% brightness or so in the morning while i make coffee etc, then before i leave for work turn it to about 80-90% of the white end of the color spectrum and about 60-70% brightness. then an hour before lights off i turn it back full blue and dim (adjusting a bit at a time).

probably 12-13 hours of light time.

 

[dtapke]

hm can't edit posts, i should note the shrooms are at the bottom, and the kenya is halfway up

 

[slief]

Feel free to get mad at me, but I just got a Kessil a160we tuna for my 24g nanocube and I'm wondering the age old "how bright" question. As well as the color setting.

I didn't buy the 100 controller to get better control of the light, but currently running it on a new tank, 4-5 shrooms and a kenya tree is all thats in there. Don't want to over light them, or under light them.

I played around with how high off the tank to suspend it and am currently about 3-4" distance from water to the light, and that seems to be the closest i can run it and get a good pattern across the whole tank.

Should i invest in the light controller? I've been running it blue for an hour at 30% brightness or so in the morning while i make coffee etc, then before i leave for work turn it to about 80-90% of the white end of the color spectrum and about 60-70% brightness. then an hour before lights off i turn it back full blue and dim (adjusting a bit at a time).

probably 12-13 hours of light time.

You'd be doing yourself a huge service by spending some time reading this thread as you would get an actual perspective of what others are using and how far they have them from the water. That said, 3-4" from the water is RIDICULOUSLY close to the water IMO. You should never run any light that close to the water. At least not if you want them to last. I personally wouldn't run them any closer than 8".

That said, again, reading would help you out and would have given you a good idea of what others are running but I would start with about 60% color and about 50% power. Since you don't have the controller which is certainly helpful, I would just use the dials and run it that way for about 8 hours a day. Watch your corals and see how they do.

 

[dtapke]

[MENTION=225253]slief[/MENTION], just reading back a few posts I find information stating that 5" is pretty good, and realistically stating that the close the lamp to the light, the more light can be provided to the tank. I see no benefit to keeping the light further from the water? It's far enough that no splashing will get to it which i would imagine being the main risk.

As far as reading the whole thread. this thing is like 3000 posts long, i went back a few pages and there was a bunch of folks just getting in ****ing matches with each other about stuff and very little actual discussion of ideal lighting conditions etc. It'd be nice if Kessil would provide some more info on their recommendations for things, but I understand lighting is a complex thing to work with.

Depends on what you're trying to grow under it but at 11" off the water, you've reduced it's PAR potential by a huge margin. My A360s are 5" off the water and still cover a huge area (two provide overlapping coverage on a 48"x18" 75g tank). On an SPS dominant tank, I have intensity maxing out at 75% and that only produces 170 PAR eight inches below the surface, directly under the light. At 11 inches, you can expect that number to be cut in half. At 100% intensity and mounted 5" above the water, max PAR is 205. Again, double the distance from the tank and you're roughly cutting the max PAR in half.

Take advantage of the Kessil's far superior reflector and color blending and move it closer to the water surface.

 

[slief]

[MENTION=225253]slief[/MENTION], just reading back a few posts I find information stating that 5" is pretty good, and realistically stating that the close the lamp to the light, the more light can be provided to the tank. I see no benefit to keeping the light further from the water? It's far enough that no splashing will get to it which i would imagine being the main risk.

As far as reading the whole thread. this thing is like 3000 posts long, i went back a few pages and there was a bunch of folks just getting in ****ing matches with each other about stuff and very little actual discussion of ideal lighting conditions etc. It'd be nice if Kessil would provide some more info on their recommendations for things, but I understand lighting is a complex thing to work with.

Kessil really can’t give that kind of advice. Every tank is different and what works in for tank won’t work for the next. in the next. For example, low nutrient tanks typically do better with less intensity. High nutrient tanks seem to do better with higher intensity. Clearer water tends to have an impact on PAR just as a sand bed vs bare bottom. Height above the tank, depth of tank, height of aquascape, surface agitation, types of coral, frags grown under LED vs wild colonies, vs frags grown under halide vs T5 etc. If you’re following what I am saying, there are a lot of unknowns with each tank and it’s a liability for a manufacturer to make suggestions like that because every tank is different. If you use their suggestions and kill your coral, who are you going to blame? These lights are MUCH more powerful than most new to them realize and recognizing corals response when you’ve gone too far or not far enough is critical.

Then there is the fact that everybody talks about PAR yet where corals get their needed photosynthetic radiation happens to be a spectrum that most par meters don’t read well and actually looks dim to the human eye. At the end of the day, it’s been my experience with these lights, that you are better off having them further from the water and gaining the additional spread and really has an insignificant impact on the corals due to any PAR losses from having them higher. The benefits outweigh the negatives by having the lights higher. The Kessils do just fine for growing corals and very few of us ever needed to exceed 75% intensity. As for color, they will grow coral under any range from 0-100. The whiter you go, the more algae you will grow. Yea it will look brighter but that’s not going to improve corals growth. Just algae growth.

 

[makers marc]

Kessil really can't give that kind of advice. Every tank is different and what works in for tank won't work for the next. in the next. For example, low nutrient tanks typically do better with less intensity. High nutrient tanks seem to do better with higher intensity. Clearer water tends to have an impact on PAR just as a sand bed vs bare bottom. Height above the tank, depth of tank, height of aquascape, surface agitation, types of coral, frags grown under LED vs wild colonies, vs frags grown under halide vs T5 etc. If you're following what I am saying, there are a lot of unknowns with each tank and it's a liability for a manufacturer to make suggestions like that because every tank is different. If you use their suggestions and kill your coral, who are you going to blame? These lights are MUCH more powerful than most new to them realize and recognizing corals response when you've gone too far or not far enough is critical.

Then there is the fact that everybody talks about PAR yet where corals get their needed photosynthetic radiation happens to be a spectrum that most par meters don't read well and actually looks dim to the human eye. At the end of the day, it's been my experience with these lights, that you are better off having them further from the water and gaining the additional spread and really has an insignificant impact on the corals due to any PAR losses from having them higher. The benefits outweigh the negatives by having the lights higher. The Kessils do just fine for growing corals and very few of us ever needed to exceed 75% intensity. As for color, they will grow coral under any range from 0-100. The whiter you go, the more algae you will grow. Yea it will look brighter but that's not going to improve corals growth. Just algae growth.

Slief,

So ive had my 2 x Ap700 mounted 12 inches above the water line for 5 months on my 180g, which makes it a total of 22 inches from my highest placed acro frag. It maxes out at 80% for 3 hrs midday, total run time is 14 hrs daily.

I mounted it higher for more spread and less shading initially. Just read Dana Riddle's review on the unit https://www.advancedaquarist.com/2018/3/aafeature.

Using the sample par/pur map attached he provides, he mentions that only the areas with 100+ par/pur will be strong enough to grow sps corals. So that would be the blue, green, and purple areas.

Does his argument fall under the "par can't be truly measured for LEDs?" If so, is his argument valid?

Im trying again, to decide whether I lower my unit or not. Thanks.

 

[slief]

Slief,

So ive had my 2 x Ap700 mounted 12 inches above the water line for 5 months on my 180g, which makes it a total of 22 inches from my highest placed acro frag. It maxes out at 80% for 3 hrs midday, total run time is 14 hrs daily.

I mounted it higher for more spread and less shading initially. Just read Dana Riddle's review on the unit https://www.advancedaquarist.com/2018/3/aafeature.

Using the sample par/pur map attached he provides, he mentions that only the areas with 100+ par/pur will be strong enough to grow sps corals. So that would be the blue, green, and purple areas.

Does his argument fall under the "par can't be truly measured for LEDs?" If so, is his argument valid?

Im trying again, to decide whether I lower my unit or not. Thanks.

I think that article was very well written. I have both a Seneye meter and an Apogee. Both meters have a calculation for PAR under the bluer spectrum because they can't accurately read it. Instead, they calculate based on whatever formulas they have determined work best when compared to mucj higher quality professional grade meters. How accurate that is is anybodies guess but I've been told it's fairly accurate but there are many of the factors that come into play as I noted above. Surface agitation, height from the water, types of corals and types of SPS as well as the spectrum.

Much is made about PAR but as noted in the article, PUR is very important since that relates to the spectrum that corals get their usable photosynthetic radiation from. This is an area that Kessil has done very well in. They are powerful lights with the right mix of diodes to meet the PR demands of almost any coral. Its interesting that the article notes 100 par minimum for SPS. Some will grow in less than that if the spectrum is right but obviously the greater the intensity, the better the growth (to a point since too much intensity can burn and kill coral). I have a huge birdsnest on the bottom of my 24" deep tank that is growing just fine. Granted, it's growing slower than it did when it was up high in my tank. It got too big so I had to move it. Again, this is where coral placement comes into play. I won't place nicer SPS near the bottom.

I have most of my SPS up higher in my tank. Most being 12" below the waters surface but some are higher and they all grow upwards. in the end, we need to be selective about coral placement regardless of the lights but what i can tell you from years of running Kessils is that they will grow any coral just fine. You just need to be selective about placement and careful with intensity because they are much more powerful than meets the eye. in the end, I think that article provides a pretty good guideline for people looking at these LED's.

 

[slief]

Slief,

So ive had my 2 x Ap700 mounted 12 inches above the water line for 5 months on my 180g, which makes it a total of 22 inches from my highest placed acro frag. It maxes out at 80% for 3 hrs midday, total run time is 14 hrs daily.

I mounted it higher for more spread and less shading initially. Just read Dana Riddle's review on the unit https://www.advancedaquarist.com/2018/3/aafeature.

Using the sample par/pur map attached he provides, he mentions that only the areas with 100+ par/pur will be strong enough to grow sps corals. So that would be the blue, green, and purple areas.

Does his argument fall under the "par can't be truly measured for LEDs?" If so, is his argument valid?

Im trying again, to decide whether I lower my unit or not. Thanks.

I might lower it a couple inches but I wouldn't run them closer than 8" to the water. You could always increase the intensity as well. I suggest no more than 2% a week and doing it once or twice a week so you can easily go back 4% if the corals respond adversely. That or just leave it alone and see how your corals do. Maybe see if you can borrow a PAR meter if you don't already have one. Shut the flow off or at least reduce surface agitation when using the meter if you go that path.

 

[tank o tang]

Running 3 ap700's over 180gal at 10" above water at 45% intensity and corals, nems, and rock are doing great. Spa, lps, and zoas. Loving these lights.

 

[Thor2j]

Running 3 ap700's over 180gal at 10" above water at 45% intensity and corals, nems, and rock are doing great. Spa, lps, and zoas. Loving these lights.

I imagine your PAR isn't very high , but hey if it's working, it's working.

 

[madweazl]

LEDs arent any different that any other type of light in regard to PAR readings, the only issue is sensor's ability to read specific spectrum properly. For the Apogee "full spectrum" sensor, response starts to fall off below 450nm so your PAR readings may be read lower than actual values for anything below that (same goes for spectrum above ~680nm).

This is true of all light sources, not just LED. Dana's results are factual and you can certainly use them to work out a plan of attack.

 

[captain.nero]

Why a Kessil Club? because Kessil is probably one of the most underrated, least spoken of lights on the market that are considered one of the big names. I would like to start a thread for all kessil owners. I myself own 4 a360w.

please share your tanks, your lights, your livestock, progress etc. Hopefully if there are any issues with the lights we can stand together and help each other out

Kessil Blue Tuna owner here. Love this light!

 

[smatter]

Kessil Blue Tuna owner here. Love this light!

Welcome to Reef Central :celeb3::celeb1:

 

[ComforablyNumb]

Converted my 65gal planted from ho tubes to a Kessil Sun a160. Freshwater shimmer

 

[tletourneau]

Apex controlled Kessil 360's on my freshwater and saltwater aquariums, love them!

 

[GreenbriarManor]

I'm getting ready to build my first 150g 60x24x24 reef - would like to be able to dabble in all the basic livestock but SPS.

I'm in the early stages of planning my lighting, and after reading hundreds of reviews for Maxspect, AI, and Ecotech, I'm leaning toward Kessil. Specifically leaning toward A360EW.

Looking at the spec I think 3 should be enough for my needs and tank size, but wanted to bounce it off the expertise in this thread.

Thanks in advance,
J

 

[madweazl]

I'm getting ready to build my first 150g 60x24x24 reef - would like to be able to dabble in all the basic livestock but SPS.

I'm in the early stages of planning my lighting, and after reading hundreds of reviews for Maxspect, AI, and Ecotech, I'm leaning toward Kessil. Specifically leaning toward A360EW.

Looking at the spec I think 3 should be enough for my needs and tank size, but wanted to bounce it off the expertise in this thread.

Thanks in advance,
J

Three will work well and a predominantly LPS/Softie tank and even with well placed SPS. With that said, I have a 48" AquaticLife hybrid for our 150g running four A360WEs along with four T5s (an acropora dominant build).

I used two A360WEs on our 75g when it was a mixed reef and it worked well (added a LET T5 retrofit as I transitioned into SPS).

 

[Djbeasley05]

I use 2 a80s on my 28g nano cube and 2 a160we's on my 60 gallon cube. Kessil customer service is amazing! I bought the a160's used and a couple of the led's were burnt out. Contacted kessil and they sent me two brand new a160's at no charge. You don't see that very often.


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