Landlords Log - Breeding Tomato Clowns

[Bud's Reef]

I would be a little suspect of the water differences over a 10 day period. If it was me, I'd syphon enough water with the larva to fill the larval tank, leave them in it overnight, then begin filtering the rotifers from the rotifer tank the next day and add them to the larval tank along with the algae you use for the green water. Their yolk sacs should maintain them for a couple of days so the rotifers don't need to be in there that first night.

 

[landlord]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14947845#post14947845 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Bud's Reef
I would be a little suspect of the water differences over a 10 day period. If it was me, I'd syphon enough water with the larva to fill the larval tank, leave them in it overnight, then begin filtering the rotifers from the rotifer tank the next day and add them to the larval tank along with the algae you use for the green water. Their yolk sacs should maintain them for a couple of days so the rotifers don't need to be in there that first night.

Sounds like a possible experiment is in my future??? Water quality could very well be the problem, 10 days of growing rotifers in a tank with just an airstone probably isn't top notch.

Most likely I would do something like this:

1. Grow the rotifers (for x days) in the 5.5 gallon to the desired density.

2. Hatch night (prior to hatch) strain the rotifers and set aside.

3. Quickly clean up the rotifer tank so it can become the larval tank.

4. Harvest the fry from the DT with 5 gallons water directly into the larval tank (no time in the bucket <-- Makes Fry Happy )

5. Add back in the rotifers

6. Apply rotifer diet

7. Kiss wife for helping and hit the sack!

Keeping the fry in a bucket all night doesn't sound like fun, I would have to add heat and air, right??? I might give this a try next batch around.

I like this idea! Thanks

Kurt

 

[rkelman]

"However it was siphoned about 10 days ago"

This is a problem. Ideally you should take the water from the display on hatch night. I just put the Rotifers in the tank water the morning after they hatch usually.

 

[Bud's Reef]

No, you wouldn't want to keep the fry in a bucket overnight. If you only have the one tank to use, move the rotifers to a bucket overnight and put the fry straight in the larval tank with the water from the display with a heater and airstone. You could throw another airstone in the rotifer bucket but depending on air temperature you might not need to put in a heater.

 

[landlord]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14952133#post14952133 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Bud's Reef
No, you wouldn't want to keep the fry in a bucket overnight. If you only have the one tank to use, move the rotifers to a bucket overnight and put the fry straight in the larval tank with the water from the display with a heater and airstone. You could throw another airstone in the rotifer bucket but depending on air temperature you might not need to put in a heater.

I have plenty of buckets to store the rotifers in, no worries there. I will be trying out this method next hatch, and will update if I get a better survival rate.

The more I think about 10 day old rotifer water the more I bring up my breakfast into my throat :lol:

Thanks Guys

 

[landlord]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14950993#post14950993 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by rkelman
"However it was siphoned about 10 days ago"

This is a problem. Ideally you should take the water from the display on hatch night. I just put the Rotifers in the tank water the morning after they hatch usually.

Do you get any die-off between hatch night and the morning? Curious if you have a light running all night over the larval tank after hatch as well?

 

[Bud's Reef]

I have done limited hatches, but in mine I had no die off between hatching and the next morning. I collected the hatch using a collector and at the same time I syphoned out enough water for the larval tank. I filled the larval tank, which already had all four sides covered, with the display water and added a heater and two airstones, one at each end. Then I took the hatch from the display and put it into the larval tank. Turned all the lights off and was finished for the night. In the morning, I strained the rotifers from their culture, put them in the larval tank and added green water which was from a purchased bottle of concentrated algae.

My larval tank is in the basement fish room so I only turn on the overhead lights and never bothered with a specific light for the tank. The lights would be left on all day and turned off at night. There would still be some light in the room from the refugium light but not drectly above the larva tank.

 

[landlord]

Good to know. I've been blaming my die offs on not having a light over the tank the first night. If it's a water quality issue I'll be most happy.

Kurt

 

[rkelman]

"Do you get any die-off between hatch night and the morning? Curious if you have a light running all night over the larval tank after hatch as well?"

I do get some dieoff. Likely from being beaten to death with bubbles while aerating the eggs. Not alot though. No I don't run a light. Mine are on a regular lighting schedule with all the other tanks.

 

[dazed]

Have you checked what the water parameters are after 10 days of creating this rotifer soup? I am sure you are aware of this already but as that culture grows in density so does the waste that they are producing.

 

[landlord]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14964131#post14964131 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by dazed
Have you checked what the water parameters are after 10 days of creating this rotifer soup? I am sure you are aware of this already but as that culture grows in density so does the waste that they are producing.

Honestly, I have been trusting the ammonia badge. No color change after 10 days. In fact it is just starting to shift towards the green now and it's been 16 days, 10 for the soup and Batch V for another 6.

I'm gonna give Bud's idea (couple posts back) a shot for the next round.

Kurt

 

[dazed]

Cool sounds like a plan & (bud's suggestion) is similar to what i do as well, although i do have some die-off after hatching, and i don't use my snagger anymore as she went back to the tile. If you look back at my thread before the split there are pictures of the snagger i built/stole the idea from agsansoo's thread.

It did work well and was cheap & easy to make. Keep up the good work.

 

[landlord]

Time for a quick update

Batch III / IV - Day 31 / 20 - Combined group

Everybody has made it through meta at this point. All the little fellas have their color and their stripe(s). Doing 2-3 feedings of Otohime A daily. The sponge filter has been up and running for some time.

Batch V - Day 9

Best survival rate to date, I would say that maybe 75 fry, could be more, are swimming around chowing down on rotifers. I am still using the greenwater method to keep the rotifers reproducing but their consumption is forcing me to add them every other day (which is a good thing). Guessing that meta will begin in a couple days or so for the fast growing ones and maybe a couple days after that for the slow developers. My first hatch entered meta sooo early that I was thrown off on my successive batches as to when they would enter into it. It seems that on average they begin in the day 11 - 14 range and seem to complete it about 4 - 6 days.

New News
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

With the hatch of Batch VI coming up I have made the decision to skip this hatch and any successive hatches of my A. Frenatus pair. Several reasons for this:

1. I simply cannot slip another larval tank into the living room without causing my wife to blow.

2. I will be going on a 2 week vacation in the middle of June and am trying to find ways to simplify things for the tank sitter. I have a 1.5 year old SPS reef which is headache enough for my sitters and I do not want to stress them out feeding fry / rotifers. My sitters are a pair of 19 year old girls, so the importance of fish is diminished by the importance of boys, summer, iPhones, etc... Gotta keep it simple

3. With what I have now I figure close to 150+ tomato clowns in various developmental states, I have plenty to feel out the local markets. If for some reason these things become hot commodities (doubtful) I can ramp back up in July with them.

I have also come to the conclusion that the more batches I try to raise the it "Saps the Fun out of it". I am doing this primarily for fun and to take a break from the SPS tank. I am coming up on some serious growout tank space so no matter what I will need a bigger tank soon. I believe that if I spend some time putting together a single water source system for the broodstock and growout tanks I can ease the maintenance pain I am currently suffering through with 6 separate systems I also want to spend more time getting my GSM's and Onyx's in shape. Hopefully the GSM's will resume laying by the end of my vacation and I can begin giving them a go.

That's all for now!

I got a chance to meet rEd86 this weeked. It was a great visit. Super nice guy. Has a big arse tank to boot. Got some really nice pictures of the babies and my display tank that I need to get posted up. Ed definitely has his hands full. Good to meet you and look forward to future meetings and to see that display of yours

Have a Great Week

--Kurt

 

[Bud's Reef]

Kurt, that sounds like an even better plan. You probably have more Tomato Clowns than all the LFSs in your area sell all year. I only have two grow out tanks at the moment and that is more work than I really need as well so I've not been collecting any more either. I'm waiting for my Black and White Ocellaris to start laying before I try to raise anything else.

 

[landlord]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14989545#post14989545 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Bud's Reef
Kurt, that sounds like an even better plan. You probably have more Tomato Clowns than all the LFSs in your area sell all year.

Exactly

It would be an ultra let down to not be able to give these guys good homes, or even homes for that matter. If I get any bigger the wife would want the setup in the basement and that would take the enjoyment out of it as well. Nothing like trying to get your houseguests to take a trip into the dank dark basement behind the water heater to look at your baby fish

Gonna keep my focus on setting up an easily maintained eye appealing setup in my great room. Probably gonna get my father in law to make yet another piece of oak furniture for it. I am going to need to bone up on acrylic fabrication for sure.

Kurt

 

[landlord]

Going to be starting some more rotifer experiments shortly as well.

Exp 1. How long will a mason jar of rotifers survive in the fridge?
Exp 2. How viable is the gunk in the bottom of the bucket after spending 2 weeks in the fridge?

Basically, I am going to start preparing for my vacation. Hopefully I'll be able to revive some rotifers upon my return. The results should help in that arena.

 

[rEd86]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14989281#post14989281 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by landlord
I got a chance to meet rEd86 this weeked. It was a great visit. Super nice guy. Has a big arse tank to boot. Got some really nice pictures of the babies and my display tank that I need to get posted up. Ed definitely has his hands full. Good to meet you and look forward to future meetings and to see that display of yours

Great meeting you as well Kurt. I'll work on figuring out the settings of the new camera so we can take some more pictures that we can use next time. (especially some shots of those little mosquitoes)

Loved your setup. I can feel your pain on how to continue growing your breeding setup out and keep it looking nice. (He's got a VERY nice 90g tank set up right by the breeding stations that looks incredible as well.)

Let's plan on hooking up again after you get back from vacation.

--Ed

 

[landlord]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14989619#post14989619 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by rEd86
Let's plan on hooking up again after you get back from vacation.

--Ed

Most definitely!

 

[landlord]

Update time

Batch II - These guys are well on their way. Several are at least 5/8 to 3/4 of an inch in length. Looking for a btter food to enhance colors... Still researching for ideas???

Batches III and IV - All of these guys are well through meta and have that clown look. Taking Oto A 3 times a day. Should be ready for a growout tank (If I had another one) :lol:

Batch V - Day 12

Again my best hatch in terms of numbers, these guys are all entering into meta. Some have progressed further than others. They are now being fed Oto A twice a day and sieved rotifers (no greenwater) once daily for the late bloomers. Need to get these guys to "babysitter" size in a month. That is the size where the tank sitter can give them Oto B2 and not have to worry about a half dozen food sources spread scross 6 tanks.



I am also open for any ideas or if anyone can point me to a nice (oak) broodstock / breeding setup. Something quality enough to display in a living room. I am thinking about 4 broodstock tanks 10 or 15 gallons, at least 2 possibly 3 larval tanks, and then maybe 1 or 2 large segmented growout tanks, with room for rotifer bucket (hidden). Oh Yeah, centrally plumbed (except larval) for ease of maintainance. Kind of a tall order, I know. I am trying to avoid the "petstore" look.

Take Care -- Kurt

BTW - Sad news, I had to let Batch VI slip on by. Still feeling a little guilt over it. I'll recover.

 

[rkelman]

Can you build a basic wood stand and trim it with Oak and buy pre made doors? I would love to see a nice oak breeding setup.