large tank on main floor...engineering advice wanted please

[lastlight]

Hello,

Let me begin by saying that any advice I get here won't be taken for absolute truth. I intend to consult with an engineer anyways. My dilemna is as follows:

We're building a new home and I intend to have a 400 - 500 gallon tank on the main floor. It will be something like 6L x 4W x 2.5H and one 4 foot side will be about 1.5 feet from the outer foundation.

My question is this:

Should I bother the sales manager with details about the tank? It might be troublesome to have the builder add additional footings/ piles under the tank area. The market is crazy here and there's no garantee the builer would even allow the modifications.

Or should I let them build the house and make it safe later? I'm thinking a large 6" re-enforced slab on the existing slab with teleposts and beams under the tank would be perfectly safe. I'd consult with an engineer when I did all of this and I'd not have to rely on the builder and hope my slab etc was done right.

Advice guys/gals? I'm looking for professional advice to guide me in the right initial direction. Re-assurance that by not mentioning it to the builder I'm not going to be screwed later or unable to make this happen.

Thanks

Brett

 

[tkeracer619]

I would tell the builder now.

 

[tom obrecht]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9836115#post9836115 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tkeracer619
I would tell the builder now.

I agree. In the case of my last tank (tank was on the main floor) I told the builder up front and not only did he have a sincere interest in the project, but he also came up with some great ideas that really added to the overall look of the project.

 

[lastlight]

New dimensions are 6L x 3.5W x 2.25H = ~350 gallons.

Please keep the thoughts coming. What I'm really worried about is anything I'd HAVE to do now in construction phase. Are extra piles in the ground better than the extra slab on top later?

Thanks,

Brett

 

[RocketEngineer]

If you tell the builder early on, then the design considerations required for the tank can be incorporated in the paper stage rather then the concrete and wood stage. Most of the concerns will involve the foundations and because of this, early planning will save a lot of later problems. Giving the folks building the house more information will be much better then springing it on them later. I should know, I get that all the time and it drives me up the walls.

Good Luck

 

[nyvp]

I agree early and its not a big deal for them.

 

[steve the plumb]

remember you are paying for this house and you can do whatever you like.Thats why the make 15% off the home.All contractors are there to help you.You are the customer.I would even get someone to help you design the system so that you can maybe have a dran there for water changes aswell as maybe access to water to have an ro/di unit close buy.I would look into using a steel beam underneath the tank.They have to reinforce the floor so you won't have any problems long term.Look like a very nice project.

 

[bbrantley]

I spent about $25,000 to retrofit my second-floor room to hold my 800g tank. If it had been done at the time of building, the supplies and work would probably have amounted to 1/4 of that.

Your prices may be different, but I bet the ratio will be close. I think it's worth some hassle to have it overbuilt to begin with.

Ben

 

[swimboy123]

I'm in Real Estate and trust me, get the builder on board now. It will be much cheaper in the long run, even though it might not seem like when you're incurring the rest of the cost for the house. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

 

[humuhumu]

I agree 100% with nailing it down and incorporating all the necessary building elements for it as early as possible. You can always make the changes after the fact but costs are considerably cheaper and quality control is much easier to maintain when things are open and accessible. Structurally, the weight of the tank isn't all that much if it can be transferred directly to the foundation. Depending on what level the tank will be located, it could be as simple as pouring a separate or integrated foundation with additional posts/beams in the crawl space OR, if located above habitable space, installing steel beams with additional posts/foundations in the walls. Still, not a big deal. Hope this helps.

 

[poppin_fresh]

what you are proposing doesn't necessarily need additional footings or a thicker slab. A reinforced subfloor or some extra lally (sp)? columns will support the weight of that tank. In either case it should only be a couple hundred $$ proposition.

If you were building a 1000gal tank, now that would be a different story! No pun intended...or was it??? Heheheheheheh (insert Peter Griffin laugh here)

 

[bbrantley]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9856863#post9856863 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by poppin_fresh
what you are proposing doesn't necessarily need additional footings or a thicker slab. A reinforced subfloor or some extra lally (sp)? columns will support the weight of that tank. In either case it should only be a couple hundred $$ proposition.

I'm not sure there's enough data here to say one way or the other. The position of the tank, the joists used and the joist span, the load transfer mechanism to the ground, the soil composition, etc., all could play in. You're also right that they may not... but it may be too situational to generalize.

(In my case, I had to replace a footing with a bigger one, add more joists, and add headers to support the stuff above as well.)

Ben

 

[CSMReef]

As an engineer, I would definitely bring it to their attention before they start the build. If I understand your wants correctly, a simple beam structure into the foundation would probably be your best bet with the other end supported by another beam/telepost.

To build on Ben's comment, you definitely want to figure out the composition of the soil in the area. If it has high clay content it will swell when moisture is present and then dehydrate. If this occurs your foundation will easily crack; possibly leading to a potential disaster.

I hope this helps with your needs/wants.

CSMReef

 

[humuhumu]

Adding to my earlier post... a lot of times, strength really isn't the overriding issue. A lot of framing configurations should be able to support large loads on the order of a semi-large tank. The biggest concern should be deflections of the floor framing which could lead to problems in the long run and a constant perception of something is about to fail. Perceived failure is just as bad as an actual failure.