Long term success with a harem of bartlett anthias?
- Thread starter SDguy
- Start date
One interesting note, and this has been consistent since they were added. The established male is much more aggressive to the new ones later in the evening. I thought it was because of feeding time usually being later in the day (after work), but I've been feeding them periodically all day today. Hmmm...
zemuron114
In Memoriam
did the bigger female have the pink stripe on her head before or after you put them in the tank? IME the pink means either male or changing male. Looks like she has a while to go to become a male but the pink stripe (vivid pink and solid line) means possible male later on... nice females though 
They both have pink on the front of the dorsal fin (you just can't see it in the pic of the smaller one). The larger female has a bit more, which would explain, coupled with size, why she gets more attention/aggressive behavior from the male. The small one only gets attention, never aggression.
This has already revealed something interesting. If a specimen with tha much yellow is already "on its way" to being a male, good luck finding completely yellow females to buy.
This has already revealed something interesting. If a specimen with tha much yellow is already "on its way" to being a male, good luck finding completely yellow females to buy.
I was at a store this weekend. First time there. The owner has a incredible reef display. The 180G tank has a few tangs, a couple Centropyge and 8 bartletts. The bartletts were all males. I asked him his opinion on why they all turned males and he had no idea but said he got tired of removing males and adding females because they never stayed female. The oldest males in the tank have been in there for two years. The tank has been running for three years.
Carl
Carl
King-Kong
New member
Wow carl -- that's actually really sad to hear, lol. Doesnt make me hold out for the future.
SDGuy: I did what you did a while ago and so far everything is fine. Added 2 extremely small bartletts to my LARGE male. The male is CONSTANTLY whipping the smaller ones in the face, so we'll see.
SDGuy: I did what you did a while ago and so far everything is fine. Added 2 extremely small bartletts to my LARGE male. The male is CONSTANTLY whipping the smaller ones in the face, so we'll see.
eaglesrx
New member
Interesting that the females kept on turning male in that 180g setup. Possibly the exception to the rule??? I would have expected the males to beat on the new females to try to keep them female or at least a couple of males suppressing the remaining females who haven't converted yet.
Well, at least the males are beautiful fish. Would love to see some tank shots!
Well, at least the males are beautiful fish. Would love to see some tank shots!
zemuron114
In Memoriam
this makes me think that the more bartletts you have the better chance some will stay females. In a 180, now my thought is 15 or more to keep a harem.... this is odd. and quite annoying
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10166087#post10166087 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zemuron114
this makes me think that the more bartletts you have the better chance some will stay females. In a 180, now my thought is 15 or more to keep a harem.... this is odd. and quite annoying
I was thinking that too, but then I start thinking....well, more females = less time the male spends per female = more likely the female is to change since she isn't constantly harassed because the male has to harass so many other females. Hmmm.....
Gary Majchrzak
Team RC
FWIW I introduced 3 small (read:female) Bartlett's into my (uncovered) 225 gallon reef aquarium and they went carpet surfing.
Prior to this experience, none of the Anthias I've ever kept were jumpers.
Prior to this experience, none of the Anthias I've ever kept were jumpers.
King-Kong
New member
This is a really interesting idea..
I know that my male will race over if my two smaller females/juve's are fighting. He does not let them dominate each other. Now imagine if he had 12 other barlett's to keep in line. It may be overwhelming.
SDGuy; you may be onto something!
eaglesrx
New member
alright, you guys with the experience, I need clarification here.
I thought that low density of your total number of anthias would lead to higher chance of turning male b/c the females have more space to escape the aggression. I'm assuming this applies to larger tanks, i.e. 2 females/1 male in a 180g.
Now, it also makes sense that if you put a ton of females, such as 8 females/1 male in a 180g, the 1 male has less time to suppress the females b/c there's too many of them.
However, I would think that in this scenario, you would eventually reach a saturation point of males being able to suppress females. For example, you start with 8 females/1 male in a 180g, then let's say 2 females convert, resulting in a total of 3 males/6 females. Eventually, the 3 males should be able to suppress the remaining females.
Let me know if my theory on the higher density makes sense. Of course, it's anyone's guess. Let's hear it guys!
I thought that low density of your total number of anthias would lead to higher chance of turning male b/c the females have more space to escape the aggression. I'm assuming this applies to larger tanks, i.e. 2 females/1 male in a 180g.
Now, it also makes sense that if you put a ton of females, such as 8 females/1 male in a 180g, the 1 male has less time to suppress the females b/c there's too many of them.
However, I would think that in this scenario, you would eventually reach a saturation point of males being able to suppress females. For example, you start with 8 females/1 male in a 180g, then let's say 2 females convert, resulting in a total of 3 males/6 females. Eventually, the 3 males should be able to suppress the remaining females.
Let me know if my theory on the higher density makes sense. Of course, it's anyone's guess. Let's hear it guys!
Scuba Dog
New member
So the hypothsis is that gender ratio vr population density? I am still new to anthias. So I have some stupid questions to ask. Can two males coexist in a 180? Would say a large number of bartletts for example 12, stay one herum or split into two rival harums?
I am still bewildered that when I added a barttlet male to three females the male was attacked and basicly starved himself in hidding even after I moved the fish out of that particular tank.
I am still bewildered that when I added a barttlet male to three females the male was attacked and basicly starved himself in hidding even after I moved the fish out of that particular tank.
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10172127#post10172127 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by King-Kong
This is a really interesting idea..
I know that my male will race over if my two smaller females/juve's are fighting. He does not let them dominate each other. Now imagine if he had 12 other barlett's to keep in line. It may be overwhelming.
SDGuy; you may be onto something!
Yes, honestly, my male spends probably 80% of his time interacting/displaying, etc one way or another with one or the other female, so I can't imagine him spread so thin with more. We'll see how the experiment pans out.
