My LED sps experience shared!

[chrisv]

Those are some beautiful pics. do you have nay time course growth shots of single frags under the LED lighting?

I do agree that it seems there was an overall tank crash situation that happened that may have influenced the outcome of this thread...

Do you have any objective observations about the differences you see since you have started using LEDs? It seems that everyone is either SUPER defensive of their LED setups--they spent lots of money and are sick of hearing people saying LEDs are not going to work--or they are MH users till death, and would never say LEDs are good enough. THere must be advantages and disadvantages to both technologies.

I am very open minded about using LEDs but the truth is that my MH system works SO well. Its hard to jump to a new technology when I'm so satisfied with the results of MH. I am NOT satisfied with my electric bill.

Im shocked that nobody that has a multi-tank system that is all plumbed together has tried LEDs on one tank and MH on the other to show a comparison series between the two technologies. I would love to see side by side frag grow out in two tanks with a shared water supply (so that it would be a controlled experiment).

 

[roberto_lopes]

Well Chrisv

As you, i think that the crash was the major cause of failure on this topic.

I can say that, in terms of growth, today I have about 1-2 cm/month on the hard growth species like echinatas and tables. On easy growth species like younguei, stylo about 3 - 4cm /month. MOntiporas like superman are on this case too.

Two years ago I was using 250W MH + T5. As you, the colors and growth was great but my energy bill was not. OK, I love to test new technologies (i have PLASMA fixtures too - stored) and I have no regret on LEDs until now.

I can say to you for sure. Not a single coral have loose his colors or even get worse.

The growth was in fact improved (of course that lightning is only one of the factors) due to the higher PAR .

Unfortunately I don't have a mix (MH+T5 and LED) tank ... I would love to see one too.

 

[poolkeeper1]

Electric Bill

Electric Bill

Those are some beautiful pics. do you have nay time course growth shots of single frags under the LED lighting?

I do agree that it seems there was an overall tank crash situation that happened that may have influenced the outcome of this thread...

Do you have any objective observations about the differences you see since you have started using LEDs? It seems that everyone is either SUPER defensive of their LED setups--they spent lots of money and are sick of hearing people saying LEDs are not going to work--or they are MH users till death, and would never say LEDs are good enough. THere must be advantages and disadvantages to both technologies.

I am very open minded about using LEDs but the truth is that my MH system works SO well. Its hard to jump to a new technology when I'm so satisfied with the results of MH. I am NOT satisfied with my electric bill.

You hit it right on the head! My electric bill with my M/H T5HO combo was topping 350.00 a month, Now with the Led's My last bill was 109.00 but we have had a cool Spring and I have not had to run Air or Heat that would have effected the bill.
But overall it has made a Huge difference in cost to run my tank. JMHO
Bill:headwally:













Im shocked that nobody that has a multi-tank system that is all plumbed together has tried LEDs on one tank and MH on the other to show a comparison series between the two technologies. I would love to see side by side frag grow out in two tanks with a shared water supply (so that it would be a controlled experiment).

 

[myzislow]

A continued report on LED's IMO they do not support adequate recovery for a new tank and growth of SPS with proper colors.

I recently took this LED's down and installed an ATI powermodule( 3-4 weeks) and the changes in color and growth have been significant and marked improvement over the LED's( w/o any other changes in husbandry and or maintenance)

IMO and experience LED's certainly have a place in d hobby but mainly for LPS and so forth. a FULL SPS system can be had but the colors and overall longevity of corals is simply lacking.

MY two cents.

MH --are still king
T5- good unit should provide close enuff growth and color w/o the expense of MH chillers and so forth.
LED-- great technology but in my experience and opinion will not sufice for a sps tank only.

Hope this helps all of you sps freaks!

Pretty much what I and a lot of other local reefers have thought this entire time. LEDs may be fine for LPS tanks and growing small frags but the long term sustainability with them is just not happening. They sure are good for a little extra coral pop though, in the form of supplements, but no way I could ever run a tank with nothing but LEDs. MH foreva!!!

 

[roberto_lopes]

OPS, I'm from the earth !!

myzislow. TWO years men, two years not only two or nine months.

Do you saw the size of the colonies ? Some of them has 2 or more years old. Some is with me since frags with less than 1 inch.
'
Have you ever look at the pics ??

 

[myzislow]

OPS, I'm from the earth !!

myzislow. TWO years men, two years not only two or nine months.

Do you saw the size of the colonies ? Some of them has 2 or more years old. Some is with me since frags with less than 1 inch.
'
Have you ever look at the pics ??

yeah man, cool tank and very good job with everything! Your corals do look healthy, I'm not doubting that. I still think LED's are only good for supplementation and I personally would never run a tank with them for the sole source of lighting. I look at LED only tanks in person on the regular and the only well colored SPS they have are the ones at the top, everything down low kind of suffers and doesn't grow.

Your tank also looks to be pretty shallow so I'm sure that helps a lot.

 

[roberto_lopes]

My tank has 25" depth.

I'm very very careful with placement so, I believe that all my SPS are colored.
For example, that purple bonsai is at 35cm (12-13") from teh surface (about 55cm from the light source).

The redplanet is also on this depth.

Taking care from where to place is the key I believe.

 

[gasman059]

As a side note there was no crash simply decided to restart from sand to barebottom, and in a period of 3-5 months there was not recognizable improvement vs other technologies all factors being equal

 

[Haksar]

+1 Roberto..

 

[roberto_lopes]

OK no improvements but not worse too right ?

Not even on your energy bill ??


I have noticed huge improvements when turn to LEDs. On the colors, reef looking, bill, coral healthy ...

What I must say is, every system is different.

But, say that LEDs are not prepared for SPS, I think is wrong ...

 

[chrisv]

hmm. tempting... I think i will give it another year worth of high energy bills and expensive bulb replacements before i make the jump, but I must say, I do like what i see in some of these tanks.

I just don't understand why it is that the LED manufacturing companies have not set up a controlled experiment to put this debate to rest. It would be SO easy to plumb two tanks together on a shared filer system-- start with frags in both tanks and let them grow taking a picture every month for 8 months.

8 months should be plenty of time for a reasonable sized frag to turn into a decent little mini-colony. If they showed me that data, I would buy one today.

 

[roberto_lopes]

Just to show...

09/2010

same frag on 04/2011

Birs of Paradise (< 1inch frag on 09/2010)

Same frag on 05/2011

My reef was moved . So don't bother with the diference on aquascaping.

I'm not so good on taking pictures...sorry.

I think it's a really goo growth for 7 to 8 months.

 

[poolkeeper1]

Missing Sand Bed

Missing Sand Bed

As a side note there was no crash simply decided to restart from sand to barebottom, and in a period of 3-5 months there was not recognizable improvement vs other technologies all factors being equal

Manny, Just to be objective here the Fact that you removed the Sandbed is a huge change in husbandry IME. As a tank with sand has more Bio/Filtration than one without and I have never been a fan of Bare Bottom tanks and believe that the Absence of sandbed could be the tipping point that you made to make it different than before. If you get my logic to the comparison.
I have got to get a decent camera and i will show you some photos of my SPS since changing to Led's and I think you will agree that they are better than when under m/h and T5HO's
Did you already sell your fixtures as I may have a buyer for them if not, Shoot me a PM if you like.
Best Wishes
Bill

 

[tmgrash]

I definately believe it had to be some other change in the tank. Looking at your pics you changed the lighting quite a bit during your testing period. At one point you had only the AI, then you had AI+ t5, then you had AI+diy led. IMO that is quite a bit of change during that period. Not sure what happend for you but I have been running the AI's for about 18months, gowing red planet 29" from the fixture colored and growing like nuts, tri color 24" from fixture, actually the closest coral to the light is a stag and is 15" from the fixture. It is kind of an odd statement to say these dont support growth at depths because with optics (40deg in my case) their par far out performs MH. For reference the furthest corner of my 31" deep tank is getting 150 par on the sandbed.

Potential LED users please do not be discouraged by this one thread, you can find many more with great LED success.:headwally:

 

[gasman059]

Guys I'm just sharing my experience as well as many others around me all things being equal.
There's a definite place for LED's in this hobby but right now not in my tanks.

I do agree there's plenty of success stories with them, but in my experience and sorroundings 3-5 different tanks we have all seen the same results.

 

[gasman059]

Well Chrisv

As you, i think that the crash was the major cause of failure on this topic.

I can say that, in terms of growth, today I have about 1-2 cm/month on the hard growth species like echinatas and tables. On easy growth species like younguei, stylo about 3 - 4cm /month. MOntiporas like superman are on this case too.

The growth was in fact improved (of course that lightning is only one of the factors) due to the higher PAR .

Unfortunately I don't have a mix (MH+T5 and LED) tank ... I would love to see one too.

I want what you are having cause I've never ever been able to see 3-4 cm growth in a month in over 20 years of keeping corals.


BTW you have a beautiful tank and reef!! great success with LED's congrats to you and happy reefing.

I'm not turning this into a back and forth cause is not my intent, just wanted to share my experience and lack there off with this particular technology since I was able to test it.:deadhorse:

 

[ed4]

I just stumbled upon this post...

Gasman, sorry to read this. I ended up getting a smaller Elos, but I opted out of LED's and went w/ halides.

 

[roberto_lopes]

3-4cm on younguei, montiporas and seriatophoras that's really fast growing corals.

I think that the balling method, lightning and zoo and phyto dosing is the secret.

 

[gasman059]

I just stumbled upon this post...

Gasman, sorry to read this. I ended up getting a smaller Elos, but I opted out of LED's and went w/ halides.

Hey Ed no biggie they do have many pros more than cons. They just don't fit my eye.:beer:

 

[NatureNerd]

Well, it is a data point. I installed AI Sol's a month and a half ago. So far I have been thrilled. SPS health, growth rate, and PE seem better with the change to LED's. When I get to about six months I should be able to judge how they are doing for my tank. I did not throw away my MH's, so I could go back, but, so far, I would not even consider it.

We all must realize that until many people get experience with LED's it will be impossible to draw general conclusions. It is just so hard to seperate all the variables. In Feb, Gasman was thrilled, in May he is dissapointed. Between those two times he did a major change to his tank. It could be that change or it absolutely could be the lighting for his setup.

Thanks Gasman for posting your experience. That is what this site is for.