My own AEFW (Acro Eating Flatworms) images

[Serioussnaps]

Effectiveness of TMPCC killing flatworms and as a prophylactic dip on all incoming acros????

posting this here and in clkwrk thread as they are quite related and both very good threads!!!

 

[Stoney Mahony]

Done

 

[Neptune777]

IMO since the flatworms can be so hard to see via visual inspection I think a prophylactic dip is a necessary "evil" for acros. A long QT alone might not reveal an infestation until their numbers greatly increase. TMPCC is just a form of iodine (verified by TM via email..).....people seem to not have many issues using it as a dip....it's just a tad pricey...


Not sure if it was mentioned in this thread by somebody but I too plan on buying a dissecting microscope to do inspections of new frags....they're pretty cheap on ebay and will mag up to 80x...should make seeing the wee beasties a bit easier

 

[melev]

Hopefully they'll have TMPCC at MACNA for sale.

 

[Neptune777]

Here is the correspondence I had with Tropic Marin...



From : Hans-Werner Balling
Sent : Tuesday, August 8, 2006 9:19 AM
Subject : Re: [?? Probable Spam] Re: Pro Coral Cure

| | | Inbox


Dear Dave,

yes, PCC does not contain any other anti-parasite chemical apart of the iodine component.

With best regards

Hans-Werner

Tropic Marin


----- Original Message -----
From: David Brahms
Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 8:45 PM
Subject: [?? Probable Spam] Re: Pro Coral Cure


Thank you Mr. Balling!

So the TMPCC is an Iodine formula without some other anti-parasite chemical? -Dave




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Hans-Werner Balling
Subject: Re: Pro Coral Cure
Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 08:25:02 +0200


Dear Dave,

Thank you for your e-mail.
When applied in the described way PRO-CORAL CURE will kill the flatworms or at least loosen and detach them from the corals, so that they fall off, when you turn the Acropora coral upside down in the PRO-CORAL CURE bath.
Several different substances are containing iodine. PRO-CORAL CURE is one that is efficient against parasites and relatively mild to corals.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Kind regards

Hans-Werner Balling


Dr. Biener GmbH
Steinaeckerstr. 3 - 5
36367 Wartenberg
Germany

 

[melev]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8053397#post8053397 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by melev
Hopefully they'll have TMPCC at MACNA for sale.

I contacted Kim at MARSH about this topic. One speaker will be focusing on AEFW on Sunday morning at MACNA, and I've requested that the Tropic Marine booth carry TMPCC so we can purchase it at the show.

 

[Neptune777]

That's cool....I would love to hear what the speaker has to say...who's it going to be?

Also, since discovering that TMPCC is nothing but iodine I don't feel good about paying $25 a pop......I am going the Fluke Tab route whenever they arrive in the mail....

 

[SaraB]

Someone mentioned earlier about using water from the main tank as water change water for the QT set-up. I highly recommend using new saltwater for that as my AEFW's have returned after 5 weeks of QT and 4 Levamisole treatments. Using water from the display tank is a way for the AEFW's to end up back in your QT tank during your treatments. I now have all acro's back in QT and am using TMPCC this time around. The second dip was yesterday.

I also have a AEFW that looks different from the photo's shown. I do not have a digital camera that can do macro shots, so I have not photo's ... sorry! They are translucent in color and they have a "V" up front. Not a V in the body shape, but a V within their body is brown in color and looks like some sort of antenna's. Also, they do not leave bite marks, they eat entire paths from the bottom upward. While my Acro's were in QT for a week or two, one of my monti's was looking funny. I pulled it out and found this same bug on it when I dipped in TMPCC. I then added all of my encrusting Monti's to the QT and treated with Levamisole. I could have re-infected my Acro's this way, but they were treated 3 time with Levamisole, so I am not sure what happened.

 

[Stoney Mahony]

Sorry to hear Sara, that really stinks. I hope you don't have some new critter like an acro eating Nudi or something!! YUK! Im doing my 3rd dip in fluke tabs today. Have not seen one adverse effect from the dips and recomend giving it a try if the TMPCC does'nt work for you.

Im doing tests as we speak so ill post up some pics and more results tonight.

 

[Zoom]

I pull my A. valida out of the tank and dip it to a Lugol's solution.
I use 10 drops to one gallon of tank water .
It was no bite marks or any eggs on the coral at all .
After the dip i check the bucket nothing no AEFW the coral did not look to good when i put it back i think i use to much lugol's solution.
I still said is something in the water i don't know what it is i have to take a water sample to my LFS to do some test with the new Lemotte multy colorimeter it is a $5 a test so he will do is many as he can.
I have a feeling as old as the tank is it may have a build up of heavy metals in the water and live rock.
I will see what all the test will reveal.
Here is what the LFS use to test the water.
http://www.aquaticeco.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/product.detail/iid/693/cid/158

 

[Neptune777]

I treated Monti nudi's with Levamisole and it definitely did not kill them...just stunned 'em. From what I have seen and heard of the Fluke Tabs these really do kill! I don't trust levamisole as the sole med for treatment......my Fluke tabs arrived today so I will be setting up the QT over this long weekend!!!!! Finally! I think water from the main tank is OK if you put it through a micron filter or something first.
Did you remove the corals from the QT for dips or did you treat the QT system? It's possible (not likely) that the FW's were hanging around in the QT during treatments....or more likely the montis introduced them as hitchhikers like you mentioned......or there was an egg mass on a colony that survived treatments with levamisole (and avoided your detection....Also, I think 8 to 12 weeks of QT should be the standard. Usually 3 months of QT is used for all other types of greater animals.....I don't see why acros should be any different.

 

[clkwrk]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8056992#post8056992 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Neptune777
That's cool....I would love to hear what the speaker has to say...who's it going to be?

Also, since discovering that TMPCC is nothing but iodine I don't feel good about paying $25 a pop......I am going the Fluke Tab route whenever they arrive in the mail....

They said it was a form of iodine What form who knows?

I have used lugols at a very high dosage and it still did not kill them like TMPCC.

 

[Neptune777]

No doubt it seems to work....it's just pricey

 

[clkwrk]

I agree I treated all my corals for 50 bucks . Been loving life for months.

 

[dgasmd]

I'l try to be brief. I had the AEFW about 5 months ago. I lost 50+ acros before I even knew what hit me and another 30+ before it was all said and done. I tried iodine without success. Neer tried FWE as I had already read it did nothing. Bought some levimasole, but never got to use it. I bought 15 velvet nudibranchs and they got sucked up by the close loops in less than 5 min. Stupid things didn't seem to know how to hang on to anything Finally, I took the advice of soemone that had them for a while and got rid of them a couple of times. I took each coral that I thought was affected and rotate it in front of one of the close loop outlets for about 1 minute. I did this every 2-3 days for about 2 weeks. In addition to that, my instinct was telling me that the yellow coris may be a good fish to try. I bought 3 small ones. When I would place the corals in front of the outlet, the flatworms would fall off and the fish would snack on them. I can seriously tell you I was at the brink of turning my tank into a LPS and fish tank, but this worked for me. Did not loos any more corals for 5 months until this last week when I noticed that I had some acros looking all too familiar. I had added a few pieces the week or two before. I started to do the same thing with the outlets again.

What I seriously wonder at this point is if I re-introduced them or if they were just dormant or to a low enough numbers that for some reason got triggered to start back up again. Likely a combination of both!!

One thing that has been all too obvious to me is that since the aquacultured corals took over the main share of the coral markets in the last 2-3 years, these pests seem to have exploded. Back in the days of the wild acros, you never heard about things like these. I think there has to be something to this as too many of these corals coming from the same origen and sitting cms from each other for months. Too easy for one to catch the bug and pass them to all the others next to it. Wild acros on the other hand, would come from such a variety of locations. Despite being an avid supporter of aquaculture, I always thought the ultimate downside to aqwuacultured corals was the lack of variety as every store would carry the same corals (true today), but these bugs may be another far worse byproduct.:mad2: :mad2:

 

[Kent E]

I've had AEFWs for years and with the blow off method they are kept in check. Every once in a while a coral will start showing bite marks and the numbers will be higher and then I take my powerhead on a stick and blow them off. I have a solaris wrasse that eats small ones but not the larger. I'll have to try the yellow coris.

 

[Stoney Mahony]

I just see this "blowing off"as prolonging the problem. You might get rid of most but you can't trade with anyone or youll spread them and you might end up loosing your favorite piece the next time you have an explosion. JMO!

 

[clkwrk]

If you are dedicated to doing it it can be done . I too got advice from an old time reefkeeper that outlined the same thing dgasmd posted above. This is what I was doing before TMPCC was even available in the states or online outside the UK. I have always kept a good number of lubbucks wrasses and during the time I was blowing off corals they would eat every single one that ever flew off the corals . Also my problem never got out of hand as my biggest egg cluster had less than 20 eggs.

Once I found that reefers overseas were using it I became even more interested. Luckily the first us distributor to have it was a LFS near me. I tired it and it worked so I passed the word. It was an easier treatment than blowing corals off and scraping eggs off daily or weekly.

At one time blowing them off and scraping eggs was the only way .

 

[dgasmd]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8060071#post8060071 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Stoney Mahony
I just see this "blowing off"as prolonging the problem. You might get rid of most but you can't trade with anyone or youll spread them and you might end up loosing your favorite piece the next time you have an explosion. JMO!

Maybe so, but you have to put something in perspective here. Tearing up a 50g tank with some acros in it is a compeltely different game than tearing up an entire 750g tank with nothing but SPS. It is just impractical altogether. HOwever, I may get to actually do just that anyway as I am in the process of moving int he next few months.

 

[Stoney Mahony]

I would have to tear it down, use big vats, do whatever I had to to finish them off for good. It's just my preference. I prefer to trade with people, and spread rare acros around. I would never trade with someone unless I was sure I am pest free. I might only have a 55 but it was packed wall to wall with acros(only 3 or 4 montis in there). Also, with a fully stocked tank, I would imagine that it is pretty difficult to see behind/underneath and inside every colony to inspect for eggs or masses of fw's. Think if two large egg broods made it all the way to hatching, they spread through your tank and there too small for the fish to even eat. Then you have a mass outbreak on your hands. 750 gallons is a HUGE area for fw's to hide and with all those corals I wouldnt have an option. Isn't it stressful looking at all your babies wandering witch one is getting eatin by nasty little worms??? I hate them......