N/P reducing pellets (solid vodka dosing)

[ari5736]

:spin3:
Nitrate down from 5-10 ppm and phosphate from .27 both readings last week. Did a small water change, imho not enough to bring levels as far down as they came, I am not running any gfo. I have 3 tangs an angel some wrasses and clowns, feed plenty of pellets and nori. If levels stay where there at, I am the pellets next big supporter.

Would like to see nitrates drop in my other tank though, where I feed much heavier (frozen mysids and silversides) and I have pellets running the same amount of time as on this tank. Never had the big bacteria bloom on the other tank though.

 

[izzy123]

Hmm...not sure it is flawed logic. You should know how to do math on paper long before you begin with a calculator. Understanding how your tank matures and learning the processes is always good. There are no magic pills, these just help a little. Learning solid husbandry...there is no substitute for that. I used these on a new tank, but coupled it with many many years of experience.

Now THAT is why I LOVE RC!!
The combined expierience of all you people AND the will to share that knowledge with a newbee like me, not for profit, but just to give a guy like me the chance to learn from your findings, instead of finding them out thru trial and error.

Thank you, thank you, thank you:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

[reefrad]

Hmm...not sure it is flawed logic. You should know how to do math on paper long before you begin with a calculator. Understanding how your tank matures and learning the processes is always good. There are no magic pills, these just help a little. Learning solid husbandry...there is no substitute for that. I used these on a new tank, but coupled it with many many years of experience.

i'm not sure thats a good analogy. one cannot reliably depend on a calculator because simple arithmetic comes up to frequently in our daily lives. in either case there is no reason one couldnt learn both at the same time. if a new reefer decides to try using BPs in addition to the typical husbandry practices i think thats fine. if he ever stops using the BPs he will have to use a different method of nutrient export. again, in theory the use of BPs is the same as a GFO reactor, refugium, algae scrubber. they are all just using biomass to export nutrients. none of them should be considered 'for experienced only'. in fact i would argue that they make keeping a clean tank easier and this should be our overarching goal.

i do not disagree with you that BPs should not be a substitute for learning basic husbandry skills.

 

[ari5736]

Fwiw I have them running on three tanks. One tank I think it is working, another I am not sure yet, and the third was set up a month ago and has no fish yet so of course there aren't any nitrates to speak, just wanted to get the pellets "cooking" for when the fish and eventually introduced.

Also the fallow tank seems to have a ton of bacteria growing on the walls of the tank if I am not mistaken and it is algae. I will take a photo for ID.

 

[tntneon]

...hopefully tntneon will first start to loose corals so we can discontinue using bp....

-I think i have to disapoint you then , as they all seem very happy and colorfull .
Although i have to clean my glass more frequently the last weeks , maybe it's time to replace some off the BP's by new ones (new formula) .
But first i'm gonna replace my carbon , and then see if the frequency drops .
If it doen't i will replace some BP's.

I'm very curious if i would see any differences old vs new formula ...

greetingzz tntneon

 

[TheFishMan65]

I would not replace any of the old. Only add some new. Can you tell if (or how much) has been used up?

 

[tmz]

I would not use them or any other organic carbon source unless there was a need to reduce NO3 or PO4. I wouldn't use gfo either if it wasn't needed. Folks should start by monitoring NO3 and PO4 levels to determine need, in my opinion.

There is no free lunch in a reef tank. Adding organic carbon sources has a cost and potential downside.

The pellets contain polymers(carbohaydrates which break down to (monomers) including glucose. These organics can be harmful . Oxygen depleting bacterial blooms are also a frequent side effect. Overall increases in bacteria colonies can also be troublesome since the nature of the bacteria produced as benign, beneficial or pathogenic is unknown and unpredicatable Even if the pellets localize the the breakdown of the polymers , it is still likely the bacteria or by products of there activity will flow into the system along with the organics they have consumed.

This can all work out in many systems but is not without risk to the animals in the system.So if NO3 and PO4 are not a problem ,why use them?

 

[tntneon]

...So if NO3 and PO4 are not a problem ,why use them?...

-Like in my case , before i got into vodka dosing and BP , i had low NO3=0.5 ~1 ppm and Po4 =0.03~0.05 .
This was what i measured but i had GHa , bryopsis and caulerpa growing in there , so probably those values where higher .
When using BP caulerpa/gha and bryopsis went away eventualy ( 5 month's) .
so even when you measure nothing you still can have some trouble's.

-Now that algea and no3/ po4 are gone , would you suggest to decrease the BP's , Tom ?
i'm sccarred that i remove them , that all the old problems will again occur ?

@thefishman : The volume of the pellets have shrinked to about half the size


greetingzz tntneon

 

[TheFishMan65]

Well I admit I am not using them. But if I were you tntneon I would add enough to get about 3/4 of where you were and see if that cuts down on the class cleaning. They say you can't overdose, but I wonder somtimes.

 

[bluereefs]

I took some top down pictures yesterday to show the corals under the bio pellets, more or less things are stabilizied now, nitrates are 1-2,5 mg/lit ,reactor again start to produce more bacteria and my filter sock get cloged again in 24-48 hours. It look that there are some kind of rythm in bacteria production after I lower the nitrates, week ago bacteria production was low what was visible with almost non existent bacterial slime at filter sock, skimmer was also acting weird with sudden overflowing and similar action from time to time, then again yesterday bacteria slime get visible on filter sock and skimming get more consistent and stronger.

Polyps expansion on my corals are again very good ( I am probably the only one who get less PE with bio pellets ) so more or less my aquarium start to look like it was looked before bp but this time he dont have 100 mg/lit nitrates. Is also weird IMO that my aquarium and corals look almost the same with 100 mg/lit nitrates and with 1 mg/lit, only diference what I can see are colour on salifert nitrate test kit. Maybe some corals grow faster but I am not so sure about, can be subjective view.

top down picture

I am not so much in SPS corals, lps are what I like.

 

[drummereef]

Beautiful pics bluereefs! :thumbsup:

 

[DJREEF]

Outstanding bluereefs.

DJ

 

[bluereefs]

Thank you Drummereef and DJREEF

Euphyllia glabescrens from this picture, located right on tridacna

grow from tiny polyp in 14 months, it was even smaller when I notice her for first time but she was to small to take the picture, now he have aprox 10 inches long tentacle

Maybe someone find this interesting.

 

[drummereef]

Wow, wouldn't have guessed the Euphyllia was attached to the clam! Too funny.

 

[goochesfish]

That's really cool bluereef that the coral grows right off the clam. How long have you had your flower pots ad do you feed them?

 

[bluereefs]

Green flowerpot and alveopora are in my aquarium around 2,5-3 years, red goniopora around 9 months, I have few more frags/colony of diferent goniopora species, from long to short polyps (also around 2,5-3 years in aquarium), I feed heavy last few months but to tell you the truth they was in same shape when I was feed sparingly, just artifical dry food few times a day (flake, granules), there are many anecdotal stories how to keep gonioporas/alveoporas (from specific aditives to nutrient rich aquarium) but IMO and IME they are just like all other corals, need proper position and good aquarium. I do not have refugium or dsb or anything similar either, actualy this particular aquarium are started sterile as much was posible, dry sand, dry reef ceramick, no live rock at all, all frags was dipped in dips to remove hitchikers and micro life... (just another experiment I made to test some of my theories :beachbum: )

Green goniopora I just frag/cut few days ago and made 1 frag from her.

 

[izzy123]

bluereefs...... I have just one word for you.......

WOW :eek2::eek2::eek2:

 

[Plato]

Excited, I have a custom biopellit reactor on order from Next Reef. 6" diameter by 24" tall, to be able to hold 4 to 6 liters of media. It is going on a 525 gallon heavily stocked tank. I should have it two weeks, I'll get some pics up for eye candy.

 

[zoolan70]

bluereefs...those shots are awesome!

 

[tntneon]

-cool pictures bleureefs !

coloration looks very natural and IMO very good ,
I think if you want more color , you have to wait now and try to keep your system as stable as possible (also meaning temprature / s.g. CA and alk).
Your system is just recovering from much higher NO3 numbers the longer they live in that stable low nutrient enviroment the better they look and grow .
Also dosing some trace elements can give you that ZEO-color-look , but my experience with those products (jodine ,potasium,iron...) is that i have to clean the glass more often , but coloration of corals is also more intense...

greetingzz tntneon