New surge device design, opinions wanted
- Thread starter Foxy Brown
- Start date
Foxy Brown
New member
Yeah, the other (sneaky) reason for this post was to recruit the expertise of some of the truly amazing DIYers on this site. I'm a whiz at electronics, and have made tons automation gear for myself (auto-dosers, a koralia (12V) variable speed driver, dimming high power LED drivers, even a few robots) but a simple acrylic box that doesn't break or leak appears to be beyond me. 
I blame my tools!
I blame my tools!BeanAnimal
Premium Member
I like to let the smoke out of integrated circuits...
Foxy Brown
New member
It's always such a pretty blue color
BeanAnimal
Premium Member
I have a high current amp I built several years ago, that has yet to see current... I am sooo afraid that all of that hard work end up an flames. I don't have a variac to work the bugs out, and until I do, it sits 
ducksmasher
New member
scuppers off a boat would work good. Why not just use a self starting siphon?
Foxy Brown
New member
Yeah, the point was no bubbles and no noise. I would like to be able to have sponges and such that are susceptible to bubbles, plus there's the associated salt spray. :sad2: The noise is because it'll be near the TV and my wife likes to be able to hear that instead of the tank... go figure. Everything tank-related has to pass her inspection when I'm done, or I'll lose her acceptance of my very expensive hobby.
Unfortunately, the siphon-based systems tend to suffer from both issues. Though if someone had a trick, I do like their reliability.
My first thought was to use a solenoid activated flapper so I could do tricks using 2 and timing them however I want... One on each side of a 6-foot tank has some obvious advantages. But, I know most folks would see red flags with that, and I hoped to make something others could use too.
It can be made fairly reliable using things like multiple redundant float switches and such. Virtually everything I make is computer-controlled so I can continually check for failures and put in alarms.
Unfortunately, the siphon-based systems tend to suffer from both issues. Though if someone had a trick, I do like their reliability.
My first thought was to use a solenoid activated flapper so I could do tricks using 2 and timing them however I want... One on each side of a 6-foot tank has some obvious advantages. But, I know most folks would see red flags with that, and I hoped to make something others could use too.
It can be made fairly reliable using things like multiple redundant float switches and such. Virtually everything I make is computer-controlled so I can continually check for failures and put in alarms.
Foxy Brown
New member
I got a cheap variac on ebay not long ago, like $20... it cost more to ship the thing than to buy it .. def worth the money.
.. def worth the money.BeanAnimal
Premium Member
I just never gettting around to buying a variac... I will stumble upon one at a fleat market one day.
The ultimate in no fuss silent and bubble free surges is an actuated ball valve connected your surge tank. Float switches, hall sensors, pressure transducers, optica switches or any other leve detection can be used. I prefer optical sensors.
Jandy pool valves and actuators are dirt cheap on eBay.
The ultimate in no fuss silent and bubble free surges is an actuated ball valve connected your surge tank. Float switches, hall sensors, pressure transducers, optica switches or any other leve detection can be used. I prefer optical sensors.
Jandy pool valves and actuators are dirt cheap on eBay.
HippieSmell
Occupy Reef Central
I am so glad you mentioned those valves on ebay. I've always wanted to use ball valves and float switches for a surge, but industrial actuated ball valves are not cheap.
Foxy Brown
New member
I know that solenoid valves have too low flow, but I figured an actuated ball valve would be too slow. Plus there's the shear number of cycles... open and close every few minutes 24/7. I didn't think a hall ball valve could take that sort of abuse for long. I'll have to give it a second thought. Otherwise, perhaps this design could be solenoid actuated.
Foxy Brown
New member
Do you have to worry about salt creep on optical float switches? Never tried one. And how loud are those valves?
HippieSmell
Occupy Reef Central
Yeah, there will be some abuse for sure, but a 2" valve will create a nice surge for a tank up to 6 feet. I think Jandy makes 3" valves, which will blow your rocks over. I forget who it was, but I remember someone telling me how they built a surge system for a zoo, and they used 4" butterfly valves. I'm guessing it was all industrial grade, not pool equipment, lol.
Edit: I don't know how loud ball valves are, but a solenoid will have a very audible click.
Edit: I don't know how loud ball valves are, but a solenoid will have a very audible click.
Foxy Brown
New member
Yeah solenoids can be a bit loud, but some rubber in the right place works wonders. Butterfly valves would be great, but talk about pricey! 2" was the size I was planing, I'm glad to hear it's about right... I don't want to over do it.
kcress
New member
I have never seen a solenoid valve that is quiet enough for a living room(next to a TV). I had one hanging from a hose above my tank and while it was not "loud" it was a sharp 'click' that you could hear out in the driveway.... And, if you insulate them they will fry.
As for continuous operation of some valve, I wouldn't worry about it. What might happen is they start to leak a little.. Why would you care? Drip, drip, drip, won't matter to a surge.
I don't know why "Variac" came up but I sure hope it was NOT related to running solenoids or motors. Both will surely fry if you use them on a Variac. (unless they have brushes in them)
As for continuous operation of some valve, I wouldn't worry about it. What might happen is they start to leak a little.. Why would you care? Drip, drip, drip, won't matter to a surge.
I don't know why "Variac" came up but I sure hope it was NOT related to running solenoids or motors. Both will surely fry if you use them on a Variac. (unless they have brushes in them)
Foxy Brown
New member
I'll have to check out the actuated ball valves.
True. That's why I don't get everyone's concern about failures. Absolute worst case is stuck completely open or closed, and by putting an overflow in, they both just create a plain-old return instead of surges, so no harm done. But, if I'm buying new valves every few months, that gets expensive.
No, definitely not planning that!
