OK! Enough chat...Starting a 1000g+ Reef
- Thread starter JohnL
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jnarowe
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well it's not really. I did a little but not sure what to do next. I think I am going to slowly go around the tank, move the rocks, vacuum, and re-set the rocks so that more water will flow under them. I might even set them on 1 - 2" slices of PVC pipe. In the mean time I am deciding where certain corals will have their permanent home. The open brain I fed was very fluffy yesterday and getting blown around a bit by flow, so I have picked a new spot for it too. Of course, picking a new spot and putting it there don't often happen at the same time. It is such a project to move stuff around, and then there is the maroon clown that OWNS a substantial portion of the tank. 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9939505#post9939505 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by mrcrab
You know for someone who is SOOOO busy...you sure spend alot of time on RC.
No kidding. Since I'll be a couch potatoe for the next few weeks, I'll be right here with ya J
This is the first that I had heard of this particular deficiency with the Vortecs. I guess that we are going to be in serious trouble come summer time in our tank room *sigh*. It just never ends with such information coming in trickles about these pumps. But I have to say that once they replaced all 4 of ours they have been running rather trouble free (for the last couple of months now).
somehow or other my subscription to this thread got lost... had to resubscribe (and catch up on a bunch of posts).
. Just resubscribed so I won't get so far behind again .P.S. Jonathan.. just got the tracking info on our skimmer.. it finally shipped !!!
EcoTech Marine
.Registered Member
Sparkss-
Jon's setup has posed some interesting issues over the last few months. We're not at the bottom of it yet but there's no question that something specific to Jon's tank room environment is causing an issue considering I speak with him more than any other customer.
Soon enough we'll figure out what the heck is going on even if it means I have to fly out there myself!
-Tim
Tim,
Having dealt with you personally on our tank and pumps, and having talked with you at length on the phone on more than one occassion, I am sure that you will get it figured out. I sincerely hope that ambient temperature is not the silver bullet, as rarely does anyone keep their fish room (or house) at 72 degrees year round.
I did check our pumps a couple of days ago and 2 were running around 80 - 90 degrees and the other 2 were up over 120+. Guess it's time to clean the 2 "hot" wet ends ? Make me want to go back out there later on today to take more readings and actually write them down (versus trying to go from memory).
Jonathan,
What temp did you say your pumps run at ? Seems like I recall having read you post the temperatures once, a while back.
Having dealt with you personally on our tank and pumps, and having talked with you at length on the phone on more than one occassion, I am sure that you will get it figured out. I sincerely hope that ambient temperature is not the silver bullet, as rarely does anyone keep their fish room (or house) at 72 degrees year round.
I did check our pumps a couple of days ago and 2 were running around 80 - 90 degrees and the other 2 were up over 120+. Guess it's time to clean the 2 "hot" wet ends ? Make me want to go back out there later on today to take more readings and actually write them down (versus trying to go from memory).
Jonathan,
What temp did you say your pumps run at ? Seems like I recall having read you post the temperatures once, a while back.
EcoTech Marine
.Registered Member
Tom-
Thanks for the kind words.
Regarding temps, don't worry about it: The pumps are microprocessor controlled to run within a safe range. They won't damage themselves.
There will be some variation in the temperatures that these pumps run. My point is that they're designed to be left alone to do their thing, as they keep tabs on themselves.
-Tim
jnarowe
New member
Tom, I am trying to keep mine in the 120F range. I believe they are spec'd to slow down at 140F (Coorrect me if I am wrong Tim!). On many occassions I have seen mine slow in response to over-heating. After my acrylic got crazed, I bought a non-contact temp. sensor to find out how hot they were getting and regularly saw readings between 135F and 145F. I now run them between 60 - 70% or so to keep the temp. down, although as you know, I don't really know what the percentage is or even if the control is linear.
Your temps. are well below the danger zone and within spec. and as Tim wrote, I wouldn't worry about it. If you feel that temps. are rising, I would visually inspect the gasket to make sure that the magnet is not rubbing on them. The wear is very apparent and can be the cause of excessive heat.
I think there are many different things playing into my Vortech experience, most of which are well beyond normal R & D.
Food for thought in regards to why I am having so many issues:
-- Tank room temp. and humidity is above normal (if this does indeed become the top-line issue, I am afraid there will be a lot of resistance to the MP-40 long term);
-- I am using 1000W Sunlight ballasts which have been indicated in some interference issues;
-- my tank is 3/4" acrylic which may or may not be exact, and is on the outside edge fo the Vortech's specs. It could even be slightly bowed and causing a problem.
-- I was using an ACIII Pro to control the pumps (I can't risk any ON/OFF cycles at this point so I just leave them on 24/7);
These are just the lingering questions in my system. Tim has worked with me throughout this ordeal and I can imagine that the Eco-Tech team is getting tired of dealing with me. Unfortunately for them and me, I cannot go back and put in closed loops without even more pain and the total dismantling of my system, so they are stuck with my outer-edge install. There really are no good alternatives IMO as I distinctly dislike their closest competitor's products with the heat, wires, etc. in the water column. In fact I plan on installing two more MP-40s bringing the total to 7 before the end of the year. Lucky Tim! :lol: I sure wish I could run them flat out too.
I am currently thinking about how to bring down the temp. and humidity in the tank room without instaling a chiller or HVAC unit. When I originally designed the system, I added extra valves for later expansion and one was slated for a heat exchanger/ground loop. That may help control the tank temp. but its affect on the tank room itself may not be enough to counter the current conditions.
One of the key reasons why I selected the Vortech was to make my system as electrically efficient as possible, but unfortunately, I may have to eat up that savings with and HVAC unit and that is really depressing.
Your temps. are well below the danger zone and within spec. and as Tim wrote, I wouldn't worry about it. If you feel that temps. are rising, I would visually inspect the gasket to make sure that the magnet is not rubbing on them. The wear is very apparent and can be the cause of excessive heat.
I think there are many different things playing into my Vortech experience, most of which are well beyond normal R & D.
Food for thought in regards to why I am having so many issues:
-- Tank room temp. and humidity is above normal (if this does indeed become the top-line issue, I am afraid there will be a lot of resistance to the MP-40 long term);
-- I am using 1000W Sunlight ballasts which have been indicated in some interference issues;
-- my tank is 3/4" acrylic which may or may not be exact, and is on the outside edge fo the Vortech's specs. It could even be slightly bowed and causing a problem.
-- I was using an ACIII Pro to control the pumps (I can't risk any ON/OFF cycles at this point so I just leave them on 24/7);
These are just the lingering questions in my system. Tim has worked with me throughout this ordeal and I can imagine that the Eco-Tech team is getting tired of dealing with me. Unfortunately for them and me, I cannot go back and put in closed loops without even more pain and the total dismantling of my system, so they are stuck with my outer-edge install. There really are no good alternatives IMO as I distinctly dislike their closest competitor's products with the heat, wires, etc. in the water column. In fact I plan on installing two more MP-40s bringing the total to 7 before the end of the year. Lucky Tim! :lol: I sure wish I could run them flat out too.
I am currently thinking about how to bring down the temp. and humidity in the tank room without instaling a chiller or HVAC unit. When I originally designed the system, I added extra valves for later expansion and one was slated for a heat exchanger/ground loop. That may help control the tank temp. but its affect on the tank room itself may not be enough to counter the current conditions.
One of the key reasons why I selected the Vortech was to make my system as electrically efficient as possible, but unfortunately, I may have to eat up that savings with and HVAC unit and that is really depressing.
EcoTech Marine
.Registered Member
Jon-
You won't have to add an HVAC for the VorTechs, (however I personally feel you need ventilation in your tank room from our convos) and no, this is not a long term issue. The pumps were thoroughly tested in 90deg summer heat with humidity above the 70% mark. As in: it was so unbearable that we couldn't be in the test room with anything more than shorts on.
They performed fine. Were the hot? Sure, of course they were hot, its all about temperature differentials (Newton's law of cooling). However, did they break? No. The worst that would happen is some pumps that ran hotter than others would slow down for a period, something we designed into them. The pumps will run coolest between 70 and 80deg ambient.
Jon- in response to your energy efficient tank room, getting the heat and humidity OUT of your tank room will go much further in cooling your tank more efficiently than any chiller. Your tank is no different than a VorTech, the amount of heat that can be removed from your tank through evaporation is limited by the amount of heat and humidity in your tank room. Keeping all that heat and humidity in your tank room really isn't the greatest idea in the world, long term.
However, it's really up to you. Whatever issues you're having with the VorTechs are issues you and I will sort out. Under no circumstance should you feel compelled to add an HVAC just for the VorTech units. It would be a waste of your energy.
-Tim
You won't have to add an HVAC for the VorTechs, (however I personally feel you need ventilation in your tank room from our convos) and no, this is not a long term issue. The pumps were thoroughly tested in 90deg summer heat with humidity above the 70% mark. As in: it was so unbearable that we couldn't be in the test room with anything more than shorts on.
They performed fine. Were the hot? Sure, of course they were hot, its all about temperature differentials (Newton's law of cooling). However, did they break? No. The worst that would happen is some pumps that ran hotter than others would slow down for a period, something we designed into them. The pumps will run coolest between 70 and 80deg ambient.
Jon- in response to your energy efficient tank room, getting the heat and humidity OUT of your tank room will go much further in cooling your tank more efficiently than any chiller. Your tank is no different than a VorTech, the amount of heat that can be removed from your tank through evaporation is limited by the amount of heat and humidity in your tank room. Keeping all that heat and humidity in your tank room really isn't the greatest idea in the world, long term.
However, it's really up to you. Whatever issues you're having with the VorTechs are issues you and I will sort out. Under no circumstance should you feel compelled to add an HVAC just for the VorTech units. It would be a waste of your energy.
-Tim
That was what I was concerned about.. I can only imagine, based on last year's experiences, what this year will hold for ambient temperatures in our fish room
.We also invested in a non-contact temp. sensor some time ago to monitor our sequence return pump and other equipment.. and of course we periodically use them to monitor our Vortecs
jnarowe
New member
Well guys, my tank room has a large exhaust fan (which you have seen Gabriel!). I do need to vacuum the vent though and keep forgetting. It gets filled with bugs over time. It worked really well during last year's fairly hot Summer, but perhaps when it dies I will get an even more powerful one.
Tim, if you tested the pumps in 90deg summer heat with humidity above the 70% mark, then why are mine having so much trouble with heat at 75 - 80F and 50% humidity?
And believe me, I have a thorough understanding of the effect of removing the heat and humidity vs. using a chiller or ground loop. However, it may just be that since building it the exhaust system efficiency has declined while I have added more heat producing equipment to the room, making it unable to keep up.
I just went down there before the lights had come on and it was a little warm. All I need to do (and did) is adjust the temp. switch on the exhaust fan. What I will do is lower that so that it runs more, and see what the result is. Unfortunately I don't think it will be enough to get the Vortechs to run at full power without overheating. My tank crazed long before I added additional equipment and at the time, the room temp and humidity was lower on average.
BTW, third day with no stalls!
Tim, if you tested the pumps in 90deg summer heat with humidity above the 70% mark, then why are mine having so much trouble with heat at 75 - 80F and 50% humidity?
And believe me, I have a thorough understanding of the effect of removing the heat and humidity vs. using a chiller or ground loop. However, it may just be that since building it the exhaust system efficiency has declined while I have added more heat producing equipment to the room, making it unable to keep up.
I just went down there before the lights had come on and it was a little warm. All I need to do (and did) is adjust the temp. switch on the exhaust fan. What I will do is lower that so that it runs more, and see what the result is. Unfortunately I don't think it will be enough to get the Vortechs to run at full power without overheating. My tank crazed long before I added additional equipment and at the time, the room temp and humidity was lower on average.
BTW, third day with no stalls!
EcoTech Marine
.Registered Member
Jon- I just don't know. Something weird and specific is going on here.
-Tim
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