PO4 high, not coming down, need advice.

[SS_Sean]

Hey, guys...
I have a new 170g tank up and running since March, with a 50g sump. I checked the PO4 with an API test and saw the PO4 was high. We've backed off slightly on feeding, the skimmer seems to be doing a fantastic job. I went ahead and invested in a GFO reactor and put some Xport PO4 in there to try about 10 days ago. In the mean time I purchased a Hanna Checker and tested the water last night. It's still showing 1.23ppm PO4.

Any ideas how I can get that PO4 down to zero?

 

[vega77]

Cut down on feeding as mentioned. Water changes. Gfo. Check the water used to replaced evapotated tank water.

 

[Vinny Kreyling]

It is possible to get leaching from live or dry rock, especially Pukani.
If that's the case, it is going to take time to get the levels down.
Best way to check GFO is by the water exiting the reactor compared to the tank water.
If it is close or the same it is time to change it.

 

[bertoni]

That level is very high, and getting it down to zero might take a lot of GFO. The media probably will be exhausted within a few hours. You can check the phosphate level of the reactor output. Once it is the same as the level in the tank, the media is exhausted and needs to be replaced. Food is a source of phosphate, so checking the feeding levels might be appropriate. Lanthanum chloride dosing can be cheaper than water changes or GFO, but it is harder to dose. You should get an idea of the cost you're looking at fairly soon now, and can work from there.

 

[SS_Sean]

Thanks, guys. I'll do the suggested checks, and adjust from there.
I suspect the cause is the 40# or so Marco Rock structure I built. They use old mined reef rock from the ground, as I understand it.

 

[SS_Sean]

Just checked the GFO Reactor output at 1.43ppm.

 

[SloppyWhenWet]

Which hanna checker? ULR or PPM? The numbers you have are reaaalllly high.

 

[SS_Sean]

PPM... and yes, i've got to get them down... i just switched out the Xport PO4 I had in there for a fresh batch, but I'm going to have to get some ordered and start running through it, I guess.

I'm going to order up some GFO from BRS.... should I run a bunch in a media bag also, next to my intake pipe to the sump, at least until I can get the numbers down?

 

[bertoni]

I'd probably fill the reactor, and see how long it lasts, unless money is not an issue. Running a media bag might be helpful, but with the phosphate level this high, another reactor might pay for itself, if it comes to that. I'd probably just try running with the reactor as is for the time being.

 

[GroktheCube]

Might be worth picking up a salifert PO4 kit to verify the Hanna checker's readings.

With PO4 THAT high, I'd look into LaCl use. If you have a peristaltic pump, you can direct the output of a reactor into a 1-5 micron filter sock, and slowly drip dilute LaCl into it.

With PO4 THAT high, I'd think that the GFO bill would stretch into 4 digits.

Just make sure to monitor carefully if you use LaCl. It can also kind with alkalinity, and the precipitated lanthanum phosphate can irritate gills. It will also raise Na concentration slightly over time.

 

[bertoni]

Yes, I agree that the GFO bill might be very high. Regeneration is possible, although it involves working with toxic chemicals.

 

[Aquarist007]

You said you backed off on the feeding? What exactly are you feed how much and how often

 

[terry4505]

I was in a similar situation.

In March my PO4 was reading 1.14-1.20 on my Hanna Checker. I added a BRS dual reactor and was going through a TON of GFO, it would come down like .2, then stall out.

I added biopellets, even tried out the All-In-One biopellets and had very little luck keeping Po4 lower than .8-1.0

I started dosing with Red Sea's NO4-P04-X (or NOPOX) four days later, the PO4 was at .02, nitrates were 20-40 ppm on API test kit.

Two weeks later I've cut the dose in half, PO4 sits between .02-.04 on my Hanna Checker, Nitrates at 0 on API, no ill effects seen in any coral, water is clearer, skimmer in humming (Vertex Omega 150). I've left the Carbon/GFO reactor and Bio Pellets running because I figured they aren't doing any harm, even if they aren't doing much.

I know two weeks is a small sample size, and my tank could be unique, but my experience with Red Sea's NOPOX has been fantastic.

This is on a well-stocked 120 mixed reef with equal parts LPS, SPS and well-fed tangs.

 

[Aquarist007]

I was in a similar situation.

In March my PO4 was reading 1.14-1.20 on my Hanna Checker. I added a BRS dual reactor and was going through a TON of GFO, it would come down like .2, then stall out.

I added biopellets, even tried out the All-In-One biopellets and had very little luck keeping Po4 lower than .8-1.0

I started dosing with Red Sea's NO4-P04-X (or NOPOX) four days later, the PO4 was at .02, nitrates were 20-40 ppm on API test kit.

Two weeks later I've cut the dose in half, PO4 sits between .02-.04 on my Hanna Checker, Nitrates at 0 on API, no ill effects seen in any coral, water is clearer, skimmer in humming (Vertex Omega 150). I've left the Carbon/GFO reactor and Bio Pellets running because I figured they aren't doing any harm, even if they aren't doing much.

I know two weeks is a small sample size, and my tank could be unique, but my experience with Red Sea's NOPOX has been fantastic.

This is on a well-stocked 120 mixed reef with equal parts LPS, SPS and well-fed tangs.

Glad to hear that worked for you.
It's a good idea to keep the pellets going in a well stocked well fed tank
I do that but also carbon dose with vodka because I am in the same situation as you

 

[SS_Sean]

You said you backed off on the feeding? What exactly are you feed how much and how often

The tank gets a pinch of flake in the morning...

in the evening we're putting 2 cubes of mysis, 1 cube of brine and 1 cube of blood worms in there, with a quirt of some R.O.E. and some of the powdered coral food. but we are feeding 15 fish in the tank...

We throw the occasional clam in, also, for a little treat.

 

[SS_Sean]

Taking notes, guys.... and thanks for helping. I made the order from BRS last night. If running a quick cycle of GFO isn't going to help I'll move to some of the other suggestions here. I figure I'll switch GFO when the shipment comes in, and monitor the output from the reactor, then switch again, and continue to see if that doesn't get it....

 

[SS_Sean]

I started dosing with Red Sea's NO4-P04-X (or NOPOX) four days later, the PO4 was at .02, nitrates were 20-40 ppm on API test kit.

This stuff?

http://www.marinedepot.com/Red_Sea_...or_Additives-Red_Sea-RS22203-FIADSAWE-vi.html

 

[SS_Sean]

Might be worth picking up a salifert PO4 kit to verify the Hanna checker's readings.

I have an API kit... I tested and it was showing somewhere right around 1-2ppm... hard to read the differences with that kit...

What's weird is I have about ZERO algae problem...

 

[terry4505]

That the stuff.

 

[saltyair]

The tank gets a pinch of flake in the morning...

in the evening we're putting 2 cubes of mysis, 1 cube of brine and 1 cube of blood worms in there, with a quirt of some R.O.E. and some of the powdered coral food. but we are feeding 15 fish in the tank...

We throw the occasional clam in, also, for a little treat.

Wow that is a lot of food for 15 fish.
imo stop feeding corals and change to pellets for awhile maybe feed 2 cubes every other day.
Gfo will help and biopellets just takes some time.