pods for mandarin

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So I noticed the group buy going on and have been considering my options.....looking for input.

I had a Mandarin Goby once and died, albiet from lack of pod population and told myself that I wouldn't get another again until I had a source of food for them.....

So, I have a few openings in my fish line up and soon to have another once my big Clown is in Karls Nano with her Sebae......

I added a remote DSB this weekend to combat some of the coloration issues with going BB, so I have the place for culture now......

I am considering using the Reef Nutrition Artic Pods as a supplement for the Mandarin and the other fish.....has anyone used this with success?

link:http://www.reed-mariculture.com/reefnutrition/

The other option is to culture them in the DSB, but my design is made for filtration and is not a real "freeway" from the DSB back into the display. Have people had great results with cultures in remotes making back into the display frequently and in the greatest numbers? How have you plumbed yours to do so?

Or perhaps a combination of the both.....cause the goby will tear up the pod community with or without the Artic Pods.

 

[robertloop]

A section of coarse gravel/coral is a good breeding ground for pods. I used alot of coarse gravel in my 55 for many years. Now I have a 120 with all really fine DSB. I dont see as many pods and my corals are not doing as well. I will be adding a section of coarse very soon.

I dont have any experience with mandarins but have read alot about thier LR requirements. Many say 90g minimum.

 

[dots]

Its all about the pods.....these suckers hunt all day every day....I think even if they eat other food, they won't have enough.....I dose phyto and have a decient amount of live rock, some large pieces infact and my tank is established enough and big enough to keep one long term I think....but I need to have a constant supply of pods for replacement.....I love seeing those guys work at night(pods) and know thats just a little less that will turn to nitrate. A real big part of the food chain

Are the larger amphipods live rock only based? Wanted to keep it simple down there with Cheato and Sand only....(carib sea not the finest but not sugar fine)(In fact my last batch of LS that I got rid of had tons of the smaller creepy crawlers, but not many worms other than bristles)......

Question now is....how to convince them to travel up into the light for sacrifice in regularity? As mentioned before.....a bit convoluted to the pump and even then....whats the odds?

 

[dots]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8500863#post8500863 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by robertloop
Now I have a 120 with all really fine DSB. I dont see as many pods and my corals are not doing as well.

Now thats been another topic that has been on my mind......Sand beds and "exactly" what they add to the system......When I went to BB, Pam and Tim suggested that I add one right away....in the month or so it took me to figure out what I wanted and have it built....I have some wierd colorations going on.....some look faded, others look like they are trying to brown....and some look just peachy.....very inconsistent. On the SPS forum, people arque about remote DSBs because the main point of a BB is to remove the nutrients that lie in a DSB and cause problems when disturbed.....just ask Builderguy.......anywhoooo......someone mentioned that the sandbed just adds that "x" factor and we don't know why as of yet.

I know that Tim and Pam know what they are talking about and sure enough.....my colors are really inconsistent and I imagine that has something to do with it.....too clean? So I have readded one to help stabilize it......I only removed the sand anyway because of the flow. And now all the junk the filter sock missed goes there.....then off to the main sump for skimmer and reactor....(I think the skimmer should be used after a sock to pull out the fine stuff last to polish the water)

But this to DSB or SSB or BB thing is intersting......I bet it ultimatly has to do with stability.......but does it produce or eliminate Nitrates?.......do they cause old tank syndrome or not?......are they needed.

I hijacked my own thread.....I am so mad at myself!!!!

 

[robertloop]

Ha ha! Its not totally hi jacked...... yet.... heh

I used to have to most brightly colored A.nana I,ve ever seen. Now its all but dead. I firmly believe coarse gravel and LR is a huge breeding ground for bacteria and misc plankton. Nitrates or not, all my acros thrived out of controll. My nitrates were always at LEAST 25. More like 50. Some guys didnt belive me so they tested the water that I would bring my frags in when they got home. The next day I would get an email.

Anyways.. the new tank is just that. New. I used all the old LR but tossed all the gravel. Its been three months so far. Maybe all the acros will recover as the tank ages a bit. Definetely vacuum/siphon the gravel form time to time because it is most definitely a detritus magnet. I could not belive what I was seeing when scooping out the old gravel. That's why I tossed it.

 

[dots]

Its definatly a balance between the microbes eating all of the stuff before it breaks down, but not harboring stuff in the sand bed and decaying......eventually being stirred up and the tank not be able to absorb it.....I think the SSB and stiring it has the best results and use macro......but there is something to it.....some kind of stabilizer to the system that ultimatly contributes to colorization. I was comtemplating how much sand exactly would get this "stabilizer" and still not have a big muck magnet as I believe DSBs are.....but I will need some sand in the 29g nano....so this stuff will be groovy come time....

I just find the rhetoric confusing....some say sand good, other bad....does it eat nitrate or produce it.......don't stir the sand....etc....All I know is when my SSB was in the display I had low nitrates and no clumps or problems and I stirred it all the time so the water column would absorb the junk in it to be filtered out slowly and consistently. Now my coloration seems to be whacked and I am looking to thier suggestion and experiences to see if it subsides.

Others even say a rubble bottom is pure madness from the traps as you mention......

So how bout them pods?

 

[dhnguyen]

Assuming that your tank is established enough with enough LR and has a decent pod population to start with you CAN train the mandarin to eventually take prepared food. I have done this with 3 mandarins now so I do think it is possible.

 

[TNTREEF]

get a couple pieces of live rock and take a hammer to them. break em up into different sized small pieces. then glue them back together to form a box with a bunch of small openings so that the fish can not get in side. place them in the back corners of the tank. now you'll have two amphipod hotels. it is the same as using a strawberry basket filled with rubble minus the basket . it will look more natural. just my 2 pennies. oh ya the more you feed your other fish, the bigger the pod pop you will retain for your manderin. keep the others fat and they won't have to look for food.

 

[loup]

that's an awesome idea on the pod hotel. I got some rock in my fuge that I plan to pull out. Looks like I'll be building some pod love hotel this weekend.

 

[dhnguyen]

Don't forget the vibrating bed :lol:

 

[Unarce]

We've gone over the whoel SB/BB thing before, Doug, so I'll stay away from comparisons.

Just from my experience, I've favored 1-2" shallow sand bed with multi-grains. Even at this depth, it's enough to house nitrifying and denitrifying bactera.

"As much as 70 to 90 percent of the overall denitrification was located in the uppermost centimeter. The remainder was found at 1-3 cm depth"

-T.K. Anderson 1984 "Diurnal Variations of Nitrogen Cycling in Coastal, Marine Sediments."

"anaerobic habitat can be as small as 1mm, that aerobic and anaerobic bacteria essentially coexist, and that as little as 0.08mm distance is sufficient for nitrification and denitrification to take place simultaneously."

-Ecology and Evolution in Anoxic Worlds. Oxford University Press, Fenchel, T. and B.J. Finlay. 1995.

The different size grains also allows for a greater diversity of microfauna. My current tank does not have a refugium. Even with 3 Orchid Dottybacks actively hunting them, they still can't make a dent in my pod population.

The small grains are great for anaerobic bacteria and bouncing off white light. The large grains make a great breeding ground for fauna, help prevent sand dunes, and give a nice two-tone look when they encrust with coralline.

HTH

Karl

 

[loup]

hey Karl,

I've been meaning to ask you where you get those larger grain sand. I need to fill my some area where the flow has expose the bottom.

 

[Unarce]

Lou,

My last two set-ups were started with live sand. For my current one, I think I used 3 bags of Bio-Activ reef sand and 1 bag of reef substrate: http://www.naturesocean.com/live_sand.htm . The substrate looks to be just puka shells and crushed coral.

Karl

 

[dots]

Karl, those were my thoughts also.....and plan to take what I put in to the new nano, but was second guessing myself......and will probably end up with the 1-2inchs as I had in the display before......now just to get the suckers into the display....

But I am very suprised how odd my SPS is looking these days...hard to read them to adjust....but I am pretty sure it has to do with the lack of the Sand Bed.


I noticed that Exotic has a great selection of sands.....one could mix the live with the dead and get the mesh size they were looking for.