QUARANTINE YOUR FIRST FISH! Why?>>>

[gone fishin]

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2389659

This is in the fish disease forum. There is a diagnosis section that lists symptoms. It is a good start as to what to look for. Hope it helps, good luck

 

[FraggledRock]

I think this statement has been misinterpreted because I have the same question/concern.

During the 4 weeks of QT "watching and observing" for some disease to rear its head before moving to DT, there's no guarantee ill see a sign of a present disease/parasite.

So as somebody asked earlier in the thread... what should I be watching for in QT?

white spots. fast breathing, scales missing, white slime coats. puffy eyes, discoloration. stress indicators like loss of appetite, lethargy, alertness.

 

[Mishri]

indeed, it can.



this statement doesn't even make sense.

it's a pretty simple concept...
-just because you don't see ich doesn't mean it isn't there.
-you don't see ich so you assume first fish is ich-free.
-you add first fish without qt'ing it first.
-because it could have had the dreaded "unseen" ich, you have now introduced the parasite into your tank.
-say you decide to add a tang (ich magnet). while you may have gone through proper qt with the tang, you add him to your dt and wham, he gets ich. he gets it because it was introduced to your tank by your first non-qt'ed fish.

more power to ya if you wanna take that chance.

Right, So I don't see it in QT, so I add it to my DT, But it still has ICH, so I QT my next fish, no signs, I add i to the DT. Now suddenly my new fish has ICH. now.. which one introduced? Both QT'd, But now the new guy is showing signs. It could have been they both had ich, could have been one or the other.

Is that any different than just putting my first fish in the DT and then QTing my 2nd fish and then adding it and seeing the same result?


The only reason to QT your first fish would be because it's easier to treat without potentially killing off stuff from your live rock. And I really don't care. I'll dose copper or whatever else to the DT since it's the first fish and I wont do any corals till I add all of the fish I want. - My theory behind that method is I get water parameters stable with all my heavy bio-load first, so I'm not stressing out corals changing my bio-load. Also, if I do run into the above scenario where I saw no signs, I don't have to worry about killing off my corals if I need to dose.

I have 24, 40, 55, and 75 gallon tanks.

 

[lifeoffaith]

My understanding is that if you dose copper in your main tank, the rocks will retain the copper and your corals in the future will suffer.

 

[FraggledRock]

My understanding is that if you dose copper in your main tank, the rocks will retain the copper and your corals in the future will suffer.

If you use Cupramine, you can remove that organic floating copper with carbon.

Chelated copper will get absorbed then leech out later.

 

[PCygni]

Not QT'ing your fish is the best way to see (in the end) how important it is to QT your fish. Experience is a fool's teacher...

 

[Nina51]

Right, So I don't see it in QT, so I add it to my DT, But it still has ICH, so I QT my next fish, no signs, I add i to the DT. Now suddenly my new fish has ICH. now.. which one introduced? Both QT'd, But now the new guy is showing signs. It could have been they both had ich, could have been one or the other.

Is that any different than just putting my first fish in the DT and then QTing my 2nd fish and then adding it and seeing the same result?

first fish has ich, you just don't see it because it's in the gills. first fish may never show symptoms and fight it off and look to be fine. however, you introduced ich via first fish and now ICH IS IN YOUR TANK!

first fish stays in your tank and is a HOST to ich, therefore, ICH IS IN YOUR TANK!! if your first fish dies w/o showing any symptoms, you wonder why and convince yourself it couldn't have been ich. you can qt your second fish till the fat lady sings and when you put it into your dt, it will be exposed to the parasite because ICH IS IN YOUR TANK!! unless, of course, you wait a full 72 days before you introduce the second fish.

i don't understand what you aren't seeing in this scenario.

Not QT'ing your fish is the best way to see (in the end) how important it is to QT your fish. Experience is a fool's teacher...

+1 x 1,000,000

 

[gone fishin]

Nina all I can say is "Ring, Ring" :wavehand:

 

[Mishri]

first fish has ich, you just don't see it because it's in the gills. first fish may never show symptoms and fight it off and look to be fine. however, you introduced ich via first fish and now ICH IS IN YOUR TANK!

first fish stays in your tank and is a HOST to ich, therefore, ICH IS IN YOUR TANK!! if your first fish dies w/o showing any symptoms, you wonder why and convince yourself it couldn't have been ich. you can qt your second fish till the fat lady sings and when you put it into your dt, it will be exposed to the parasite because ICH IS IN YOUR TANK!! unless, of course, you wait a full 72 days before you introduce the second fish.

i don't understand what you aren't seeing in this scenario.



+1 x 1,000,000

Because frequently if there are no external symptoms of ich they don't die. They can live a long time with ich if they aren't showing visible signs. So I would add my infected fish to my DT unknowingly, it's still living just fine, so then I add my newly QT'd fish which gets it.

This can happen, It has happened to people. I really so no point in quarantining the first fish if you can dose the tank they are in.

 

[shesacharmer]

Ich lives in your sandbed if you allow it to get in there. Treating your DT with any medicine or copper is just foolish. Read the directions on the product and it will tell you not to do it. Forcing fish to "live with" Ich because you don't notice it is cruel. You'll figure it out.

 

[Mishri]

I guess I remember why I stop posting in these forums. You guys have "all the answers" I'm surprised PaulB sticks around. 18 years of saltwater and 29 years of freshwater experience, currently have 4 tanks.. but "I'll figure it out".

 

[Nina51]

You'll figure it out the hard way.

ftfy

Nina all I can say is "Ring, Ring" :wavehand:

yeah, no kidding. i'm out!

 

[Paul B]

I guess I remember why I stop posting in these forums. You guys have "all the answers" I'm surprised PaulB sticks around.

Don't get me involved in this thread as I disagree with so much of it and I am to old to argue. I am relatively sure I have some of the oldest fish on here that have always been ich free, and I have a totally different approach, but I try very hard to stay away from some threads. Ich, Hair algae and ground probes are off limits although I did make a mistake and answer a poll in another thread about ich. I think it was a mistake and I will just try to ignore it.

 

[Clowny88]

A fish in QT with no symptoms dies not necessarily equal a disease free fish. (The fundamental flaw in QT, no?)

 

[Mishri]

Don't get me involved in this thread as I disagree with so much of it and I am to old to argue. I am relatively sure I have some of the oldest fish on here that have always been ich free, and I have a totally different approach, but I try very hard to stay away from some threads. Ich, Hair algae and ground probes are off limits although I did make a mistake and answer a poll in another thread about ich. I think it was a mistake and I will just try to ignore it.

Haha, maybe that's what I'll have to do... learn which topics to just avoid. I will try your RFUG system in a tank sometime. Maybe once you release your book.

 

[Paul B]

If you know which topics to avoid, you will never have any problems although i do like being in threads with Nina.

 

[Nina51]

is that because i'm always right or because i'm a super model?

 

[Paul B]

A little of both. I am in a quandary which one is more correct as I am leaning towards Supermodel.

 

[Nina51]

i have great danes so i'm used to being leaned on. go right ahead.

 

[DIGH]

If there just is not an option to do a QT, what is the next best method? Series of dips? I want to do the best I can but right now there just is no option for me to do a QT.