Real Cost Savings of LED vs MH/T5

Hey all,

Not trying to ninja the thread, just have a related question. Can you give me any advice on how to recognize when to replace MH/T5 bulbs? I got my fixture used and have no idea how many hours are on the bulbs. Without a PAR meter is there really a way to know?
 
If you have a used fixture get new bulbs. Not worth the hassle to try and figure out how much life is left. Or better yet, get leds!
 
bcunningham said:
Hey all,

Not trying to ninja the thread, just have a related question. Can you give me any advice on how to recognize when to replace MH/T5 bulbs? I got my fixture used and have no idea how many hours are on the bulbs. Without a PAR meter is there really a way to know?
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Footcandle / Lux Meters run around $100. When PAR goes down so does the foot candles. I replace mine when they drop 10% which can be as little as 12 months or 24 months.
 
mhucasey said:
3 Radion pros do not have the coverage of 3 250Watt radiums and 6 T5 tubes.
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Not even close.
mhucasey said:
I have a feeling we will see a lot of PO'd reefers when these fixtures wear out way sooner than the "10 years" or whatever the MFG are claiming.
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FWIW, I jumped on the LED bandwagon early on. Late 2009? Everyone was doing all cool white and royal blue CREE's with a 1:1 ratio. Everyone knew without a doubt that was the combination to use. Well, as we all know, everyone was wrong and they sucked. Point I'm getting at is that I saw a plainly evident decrease in emitter output from ones I had in my main rig versus a couple I swapped out after ~14-18 months. Clear as day. So there's not a doubt in my mind that people are going to be ****ed when their rig fails long before these crazy "billion hour rated LEDs" fail. Or simply because they're no where near as bright as they were early on.

Big tank. Small tank. Whatever. It's just about double the up front costs to run LEDs. Factor in bulb costs over the years and it takes ~3-4 years to break even on that difference in up front costs. Meanwhile, yeah, you were saving $50/year in electricity. Big deal. Been loving my halide. My corals have been loving it too.
 
firebirdude said:
Not even close.

FWIW, I jumped on the LED bandwagon early on. Late 2009? Everyone was doing all cool white and royal blue CREE's with a 1:1 ratio. Everyone knew without a doubt that was the combination to use. Well, as we all know, everyone was wrong and they sucked. Point I'm getting at is that I saw a plainly evident decrease in emitter output from ones I had in my main rig versus a couple I swapped out after ~14-18 months. Clear as day. So there's not a doubt in my mind that people are going to be ****ed when their rig fails long before these crazy "billion hour rated LEDs" fail. Or simply because they're no where near as bright as they were early on.

Big tank. Small tank. Whatever. It's just about double the up front costs to run LEDs. Factor in bulb costs over the years and it takes ~3-4 years to break even on that difference in up front costs. Meanwhile, yeah, you were saving $50/year in electricity. Big deal. Been loving my halide. My corals have been loving it too.
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Leds have come a LONG way since 09. Aside from that, if for any reason your leds do fail or fade, with many fixtures such as reef breeders, it's a simple and cheap procedure to replace the leds.
 
With leds I found myself paying more attention to fixture then corals. This hobby should be about corals not the light fixture. I am still using leds but experimenting with halides.
 
I found the opposite to be true. With my LED unit I spend zero time at all anymore worried about lighting and bulbs. It has a built in controller that ramps up from sun up to sun down. Now I spend almost all my time on water quality and husbandry. Fixture is a Photon 48. My efforts these days are centered around maintaining a high import/export of nutrients while keeping Alk as close to 8 as possible. Up front cost for my fixture was only 499. My goal isn't TOTM quality coral pictures but rather a well balanced reef system that pleases my eyes without working me to death.
 
Stackemdeep said:
I found the opposite to be true. With my LED unit I spend zero time at all anymore worried about lighting and bulbs. It has a built in controller that ramps up from sun up to sun down. Now I spend almost all my time on water quality and husbandry. Fixture is a Photon 48. My efforts these days are centered around maintaining a high import/export of nutrients while keeping Alk as close to 8 as possible. Up front cost for my fixture was only 499. My goal isn't TOTM quality coral pictures but rather a well balanced reef system that pleases my eyes without working me to death.
Click to expand...

With my radions i spend a lot of time on ecosmartlive messing with my graph, always looking for ways to improve growth and color. Changing color channels, intensity, how long it ramps up and down, etc. It's kind of a catch22... the more options available, the more we want to play and the harder it is to just leave things be.

I too am curious what you were doing with your bulbs previously? I didn't touch my bulbs until it was time to change them.
 
ssdawood said:
With leds I found myself paying more attention to fixture then corals.
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My response is to the sentence above Jack. My fixture was a Current Orbit Dual MH 150 watt and dual 130 watt PC actinics. I had a constant struggle the last six months I ran that unit. One side not firing the bulbs, then the other not firing, fans, failed square pin ends on the PC bulbs, hours spent online trying to find parts since no one stocks them anymore. I took that unit apart completely three different times the last month alone. Never kept a log sheet on actual hours but I had to come home at lunch just to verify that it was running both sides because it would fire, then quit, then fire again in the evening. Perhaps it is the high heat with MH? I spend no time on that fixture anymore, it is sitting on a shelf in my garage.
 
Current is pretty crappy stuff that is way over priced. You should have never had to spend more time a year than is needed to change the bulbs or wipe down the glass.
 
The worst was chiseling out the plexi glass splash guards over the actinic sides. They would not slide out and I did not know they needed to be pulled every week and cleaned with vinegar. I only wiped the lens. I knew it was time to try a new light when my little son came in and said "dad, all you do is mess with that light, why not get a new one?". Hello Photon.
 
Agreed. Let me share something cool though. I just returned from Disney world with the kids and was given a rare treat at Epcot. At their under the seas ride when you exit there is a very large SPS coral tank on display, it was a circular tank. I could tell something was strange because the corals looked different on both sides. I was on my knees looking up trying to see the lighting when a "cast member" came up to ask me if I would like to see everything. She recognized me as a "reefer" and got a set of keys and opened up the display panels that are closed to the public. Sure enough, there is a divider in the middle and they are running 400 watt MH double end bulbs on one side and LED Cluster floods on the other side. She said they are testing them and you could see some corals looking better on one side and some better on the other. Their clusters were about 36" off the water so they had to have some serious power. They did not look like anything I have seen on the market. It was obvious that she shared our interest in coral care. Cheers.
 
d2mini said:
Yeah, my skimmer is currently being powered by a Mag 12 rated at 110w.

So over 24 hours, that's 2,640w or 2.64 kw/h or $6.93/month.

Seems insignificant, but i guess it all adds up.
Click to expand...


Can you tell me how you calculated it? :)
I bet it gonna cost you at least twice, the total price isn't only kWh price you need to add other things... Basic service charge, delivery charge, temporary state surcharge, SBC/RPS charge, GTR and other tax surcharges, finally your sale tax... ;)


e4azequq.jpg


Last month I used 804 kWh - $171.11
The only delivery cost me $118.69
And total bill after all extra surcharges is $$311.65

Your mag 12 power consumption is rated at 110 watts, times 24 hours = 2.64kw daily - times 30 days = approx 80 kWh
In NY to run your pump 30 days we need to pay about $18 before extra surcharges... (Looks like)
 
Has anybody else noticed a significant difference in evap and rodi usage switching between LED and MH?

We just switched from MH to LED and so far that has been the most noticeable difference for us. Topoff dropped significantly and this is the first time in 2 years that the dehumidifier hasn't kicked on regularly. It used to run year round to keep the house below 50%, it now sits at 30% without help.

Will have to get a good year of use before I could tell you my experience in overall savings, but topoff alone could have significant effects. We dose kalk with our topoff and I imagine that will all change soon if it doesn't keep up anymore due to lower topoff needs.
 
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