ChrisColumbus
New member
Title pretty much says it all. Putting together a plan for 500 g D.T. plus fuge and sump (size not yet determined). Would appreciate feedback. Reef Octopus...Bubble King...?....
Skimmer Recommendations for 500 G Tank
- Thread starter ChrisColumbus
- Start date
slief
RC Sponsor
I've owned a lot skimmers in 25 years and personally, I'd go Bubble King SuperMarin 300 with the RD3 pump. You could also consider one of the larger Double Cones. I have an Alpha 300 (built by BK) on my system and absolutely love it but the one skimmer I'd replace it with would be the SuperMarin 300. You can't beat BK's build quality and they run like a well tuned engine without any noise. They are not cheap skimmers though.
Sometimes bigger isn't always better. Especially for a protein skimmer. For a 500 gallon display, that skimmer is probably way too big and would not be consistent. It would need constant adjust adjustment to keep it skimming constantly due to being oversized. I just don't think there would be enough bio load to keep it skimming happily. It would also be subject to overflows due to having to raise the foam head high enough to keep it producing.
That said, if you were to go external and don't mind running a pump to feed it and more maintenance, a good beckett skimmer is another great alternative. The skimmer before my Alpha was a Barr Aquatics dual beckett skimmer which I also loved but I didn't like the maintenance, noise, power consumption from the pump that drove it and the heat that pump added to my tank.My Alpha has produced equally as well but with much less maintenance, a fraction of the power consumption and no noise or heat transfer. But it also cost a LOT more. Then again, it's also paid for itself in power savings. Not only the pumps but the chiller I would need running constantly just to cool the water from the pressure pump.
Sometimes bigger isn't always better. Especially for a protein skimmer. For a 500 gallon display, that skimmer is probably way too big and would not be consistent. It would need constant adjust adjustment to keep it skimming constantly due to being oversized. I just don't think there would be enough bio load to keep it skimming happily. It would also be subject to overflows due to having to raise the foam head high enough to keep it producing.
That said, if you were to go external and don't mind running a pump to feed it and more maintenance, a good beckett skimmer is another great alternative. The skimmer before my Alpha was a Barr Aquatics dual beckett skimmer which I also loved but I didn't like the maintenance, noise, power consumption from the pump that drove it and the heat that pump added to my tank.My Alpha has produced equally as well but with much less maintenance, a fraction of the power consumption and no noise or heat transfer. But it also cost a LOT more. Then again, it's also paid for itself in power savings. Not only the pumps but the chiller I would need running constantly just to cool the water from the pressure pump.
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Just looked up the price on that skimmer....$2100.00!! Yeouch! I would get the most affordable skimmer and put the money towards livestock or something else. There is really a point of diminishing returns on protein skimmers as they only take 20-30% of dissolved organic carbons from the water column.
Now, if he isn't on a budget and wants a Mercedes, then that would be his skimmer.
Osteoclast
New member
I am running the SRO xp-8000 on my system. It works well and for around a 600 gallon system is perfectly suited. It is less expensive than BK and I have had good success with it. My DT is about 525 g so it is close to your planned build. Others on this forum are using it also. The skim mate is consistent and I have not needed to readjust it after the breaking in period.
prop-frags
SPS Slave
Chris,
Welcome to RC. More info will help us to help you make a more informed decision.
What is your plan for your sump? in-stand? Remote sump room? How large?
What about your stocking plans? Mixed reef? FO? SPS?
Since you planning to run a refugium, what about other methods of nutrient export?
What about budget?
Welcome to RC. More info will help us to help you make a more informed decision.
What is your plan for your sump? in-stand? Remote sump room? How large?
What about your stocking plans? Mixed reef? FO? SPS?
Since you planning to run a refugium, what about other methods of nutrient export?
What about budget?
ChrisColumbus
New member
The specifics of my 505 gallon dream tank
The specifics of my 505 gallon dream tank
Thanks all for your input so far. It is invaluable advice and I do plan to start a build thread to get input from all you experienced members.
I Know this is looooong, but if you read it all and give me your input, I would be very grateful! I can't do this without you guys.
So in a nutshell, I'm new to reefing, or should I say, will be new to reefing once I start. I've been running freshwater for 30 years non-stop, since I was about 8. Have 4 tanks right now, including one pseudo-high-tech planted tank, which I love. The reef tank has been my lifelong dream. I love the ocean, love fish and love the hobby. There was a family tragedy a couple years ago that changed my outlook on just about everything in life. I'm now starting to follow my dreams.
Now you may be asking yourself "why in the world is this newbie starting with such a big system?" Well pretty simple answer I guess. The opportunity arose to expand my home (just broke ground Monday) and I am building a "sanctuary" for my wife and I to escape the kids
... We all love the ocean and fish, though of course I had to concede to a kitchen remodel in order to get the wife on board with the tank. This tank is going to be expensive and I don't want to go through this twice...so I'm starting big, plus I of course want as massive a display I can muster so when its all complete, I can sit on the couch after a day at work and loose myself in the wonderful aquatic world inside the tank.
THE SPECIFICS (so far):
Budget for this is honestly as "reasonable" as I can keep it. Budget is by no means unlimited, but not shoestring. I want to do things right, but I can't go overboard. I also don't want to unnecessarily complicate anything unless it needs to be that way to serve a useful purpose. I'm looking to start primarily with fish and a few easy inverts and slowly build up into full reefing in time as I learn, make a few mistakes (hopefully not too horrendous) and gain experience.
Ultimate Goal:
Full reef but also full fish stocking as well...this won't be just a reef with light fish load. I'd say equal importance placed on fish and inverts.
Stocking:
Evolving...Fish: Tangs, Clowns, Chromis, Damsels, Wrasse, Gobies, Dottybacks, Triggers, Angels, Cardinals, Blenny (yes, some may or may not work but lets start with the dream and work from there); Inverts: my week point right now so looking for advice (of course starting easy but that will evolve to SPS and hopefully a Tridacna)...and of course the cleanup crew snails, stars, hermit crabs, shrimp.
Setup:
Display tank will be on the first floor. The sump and refugium will be in the basement one floor down and about 25 feet away (not directly under).
Tank (see attached PDF):
505 gallon 90" x 36" x 36" Midwest Custom Acrylic Tank (I've fully considered glass vs. acrylic and I know about the added challenges of acrylic, but overall it is my preference for tank material..I'd love to hear some positive feedback and support on this choice instead of negative feedback from neighsayers).
Tank will be viewable from front and both sides (with back placed against the wall).
Two trapezoidal overflows plumbed with (2) 2" bulkheads each. Durso drain and an emergency in each--I like redundancy when it comes to flood potential. Total of four 2" outlets available.
Return Pump:
One Reeflo Gold Barracuda/Hammerhead Hybrid planning for 2,500 to 3,000 GPH return flow (5x-6x D.T. volume). The pump will provide more flow than that based on calulcations, so I'm not sure if I want to just dial back the pump, or use the excess flow to run reactors, and maybe skimmer if external. Not sure. It would be nice to use the excess flow instead of "throwing it away", but then I am fully relying on one pump and if that one pump goes down, then everything is down. Maybe not a big deal in the end. I would have a spare pump available as a backup should the primary go down. With my head, I don't want 2 return pumps in operation as good as that sounds because they'd both be way underutilized and I'd be doubling my electric consumption.
Additional Flow:
Two Vortech MP60's...one at each end providing up to 15,000 GPH flow rate (30x D.T. volume)
Plumbing:
Drain Runnning two 3" returns to sump. The primary drain from left overflow and backup drain from right overflow connected to one, and primary drain from right overflow and backup drain from left overflow connected to the other (redundancy). Part of the reason for oversizing the drain to the sump at 3" is because of the distance of horizontal pipe runs between the two tanks.
Return Running one 2" return to the tank and then thinking of branching that off to four 1" returns to the tank. I'm still considering whether to include Sea-Swirls on the center two returns. (see attached PDF)
Skimmer:
Looking for advice.
Lights:
Want to go LED (without breaking the bank) to keep heat down. I really don't want a chiller and would prefer to avoid the endless cycle of lamp replacement on MH, PC, T5. I know I've got the added challenge with the 36" tall tank, but I'm looking for that extra height visually and room for all the inhabitants. A few ideas have been thrown around, but haven't thought too seriously since I won't be at that stage of the project till next year some time (remember the room for the tank is under construction and right now it's just a hole in the ground.)
Reactors:
Probably TLF PhosBan for GAC, and another one for GFO or/and a Polymer/Biopellet. Thoughts?
As for Calcium, trying to avoid (at least for now) a calcium reactor but use Kalkwasser through top off. By the way, my municipal water is naturally high pH around 8.1 and about 9 dKH.
Live Rock and Substrate:
Would love advice on sourcing and quantity of live rock. Aquaculture, or actual oceanic rock? "Live" sand (ya know, from the bag) or real LIVE sand (direct from the sea).
Sump and Refugium:
To Be Determined. I've not given much thought to that yet other than the location and probably set the refugium above the sump with a branch off a return line to flow through the refugium at the required "slow-flow" rate then gravity into the sump. Would love to hear ideas on this part of the project. Size?, design? ATO?
What else? I'm sure I missed some things.
Thanks for reading.
The specifics of my 505 gallon dream tank
Thanks all for your input so far. It is invaluable advice and I do plan to start a build thread to get input from all you experienced members.
I Know this is looooong, but if you read it all and give me your input, I would be very grateful! I can't do this without you guys.
So in a nutshell, I'm new to reefing, or should I say, will be new to reefing once I start. I've been running freshwater for 30 years non-stop, since I was about 8. Have 4 tanks right now, including one pseudo-high-tech planted tank, which I love. The reef tank has been my lifelong dream. I love the ocean, love fish and love the hobby. There was a family tragedy a couple years ago that changed my outlook on just about everything in life. I'm now starting to follow my dreams.
Now you may be asking yourself "why in the world is this newbie starting with such a big system?" Well pretty simple answer I guess. The opportunity arose to expand my home (just broke ground Monday) and I am building a "sanctuary" for my wife and I to escape the kids
... We all love the ocean and fish, though of course I had to concede to a kitchen remodel in order to get the wife on board with the tank. This tank is going to be expensive and I don't want to go through this twice...so I'm starting big, plus I of course want as massive a display I can muster so when its all complete, I can sit on the couch after a day at work and loose myself in the wonderful aquatic world inside the tank.THE SPECIFICS (so far):
Budget for this is honestly as "reasonable" as I can keep it. Budget is by no means unlimited, but not shoestring. I want to do things right, but I can't go overboard. I also don't want to unnecessarily complicate anything unless it needs to be that way to serve a useful purpose. I'm looking to start primarily with fish and a few easy inverts and slowly build up into full reefing in time as I learn, make a few mistakes (hopefully not too horrendous) and gain experience.
Ultimate Goal:
Full reef but also full fish stocking as well...this won't be just a reef with light fish load. I'd say equal importance placed on fish and inverts.
Stocking:
Evolving...Fish: Tangs, Clowns, Chromis, Damsels, Wrasse, Gobies, Dottybacks, Triggers, Angels, Cardinals, Blenny (yes, some may or may not work but lets start with the dream and work from there); Inverts: my week point right now so looking for advice (of course starting easy but that will evolve to SPS and hopefully a Tridacna)...and of course the cleanup crew snails, stars, hermit crabs, shrimp.
Setup:
Display tank will be on the first floor. The sump and refugium will be in the basement one floor down and about 25 feet away (not directly under).
Tank (see attached PDF):
505 gallon 90" x 36" x 36" Midwest Custom Acrylic Tank (I've fully considered glass vs. acrylic and I know about the added challenges of acrylic, but overall it is my preference for tank material..I'd love to hear some positive feedback and support on this choice instead of negative feedback from neighsayers).
Tank will be viewable from front and both sides (with back placed against the wall).
Two trapezoidal overflows plumbed with (2) 2" bulkheads each. Durso drain and an emergency in each--I like redundancy when it comes to flood potential. Total of four 2" outlets available.
Return Pump:
One Reeflo Gold Barracuda/Hammerhead Hybrid planning for 2,500 to 3,000 GPH return flow (5x-6x D.T. volume). The pump will provide more flow than that based on calulcations, so I'm not sure if I want to just dial back the pump, or use the excess flow to run reactors, and maybe skimmer if external. Not sure. It would be nice to use the excess flow instead of "throwing it away", but then I am fully relying on one pump and if that one pump goes down, then everything is down. Maybe not a big deal in the end. I would have a spare pump available as a backup should the primary go down. With my head, I don't want 2 return pumps in operation as good as that sounds because they'd both be way underutilized and I'd be doubling my electric consumption.
Additional Flow:
Two Vortech MP60's...one at each end providing up to 15,000 GPH flow rate (30x D.T. volume)
Plumbing:
Drain Runnning two 3" returns to sump. The primary drain from left overflow and backup drain from right overflow connected to one, and primary drain from right overflow and backup drain from left overflow connected to the other (redundancy). Part of the reason for oversizing the drain to the sump at 3" is because of the distance of horizontal pipe runs between the two tanks.
Return Running one 2" return to the tank and then thinking of branching that off to four 1" returns to the tank. I'm still considering whether to include Sea-Swirls on the center two returns. (see attached PDF)
Skimmer:
Looking for advice.
Lights:
Want to go LED (without breaking the bank) to keep heat down. I really don't want a chiller and would prefer to avoid the endless cycle of lamp replacement on MH, PC, T5. I know I've got the added challenge with the 36" tall tank, but I'm looking for that extra height visually and room for all the inhabitants. A few ideas have been thrown around, but haven't thought too seriously since I won't be at that stage of the project till next year some time (remember the room for the tank is under construction and right now it's just a hole in the ground.)
Reactors:
Probably TLF PhosBan for GAC, and another one for GFO or/and a Polymer/Biopellet. Thoughts?
As for Calcium, trying to avoid (at least for now) a calcium reactor but use Kalkwasser through top off. By the way, my municipal water is naturally high pH around 8.1 and about 9 dKH.
Live Rock and Substrate:
Would love advice on sourcing and quantity of live rock. Aquaculture, or actual oceanic rock? "Live" sand (ya know, from the bag) or real LIVE sand (direct from the sea).
Sump and Refugium:
To Be Determined. I've not given much thought to that yet other than the location and probably set the refugium above the sump with a branch off a return line to flow through the refugium at the required "slow-flow" rate then gravity into the sump. Would love to hear ideas on this part of the project. Size?, design? ATO?
What else? I'm sure I missed some things.
Thanks for reading.
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ChrisColumbus
New member
Thanks Drae.
Everyone seams to have their own opinion about things with little consensus. That's the tough part.
So anyone else on all of this craziness above?
Everyone seams to have their own opinion about things with little consensus. That's the tough part.
So anyone else on all of this craziness above?
Squidward5
New member
What ever you decide to go with DO NOT undersize your skimmer! people that do are usually the ones on here about a year and a half after there tank is setup selling there stuff off because there tank crashed from to large of bio load.. btw, welcome
ridetheducati
20 and Over Club
The key is to make the purchase and stay off RC. If you are looking for consensus, forums are the wrong place.
Alex T.
Active member
Easier said than done.:lolspin:
I don't want to criticize, and I am not. I currently am doing the same as you in planning an aquarium that you do not want to have to upgrade. I have learned from several upgrades that I have recently done. My first big tank was a 72x30X36" tank that was acrylic. I had started with a glass tank of those same dimensions that I purchased used. The group that I had to install broke that tank and then told me they would do the install if I replaced it with a glass tank. I purchased a new tank of the same dimensions in acrylic from them. Biggest mistake ever. I had cleaning people that in the 3rd week of owning the tank they took my magnet and was going to do me a favor and clean. I came home to a gigantic "W" scratched into my tank from the gravel that was collected in the magnet when they went to close to the substrate. Subsequently, $1200 later the LFS, buffed my acrylic, however I could still see remnants of the "W". I then changed up my tank, I could take the difficulty in cleaning the sides with the acrylic scrapper. I got a 72X30X30 glass. It is so much easier to deal with. Now I do my own maintenance as opposed to before with the acrylic, however. I am now going to upgrade. I am replacing my tank with a 96x36x42, glass. I am not trying to change your mind, but think about it. Acrylic is lighter which is a big consideration for my situation, but I will never go back. Glass is easier. I have live rock, but am currently preparing dry rock for my new tank. I ordered a MRC orca II for the skimmer.
I will be selling my Vega LEDs although they are great, the depth of my new tank will need different lights. I recently purchased the Vertex media reactors and I love them. I have one for my GFO and one for my carbon. I also have designed a custom sump for my set up. Install date is supposed to be December 12. We will see how pleased I am. Just suggestions or ideas. Good luck with your new install.
I will be selling my Vega LEDs although they are great, the depth of my new tank will need different lights. I recently purchased the Vertex media reactors and I love them. I have one for my GFO and one for my carbon. I also have designed a custom sump for my set up. Install date is supposed to be December 12. We will see how pleased I am. Just suggestions or ideas. Good luck with your new install.
ChrisColumbus
New member
Sigh...I worry about the scratch factor a lot but think I'd worry more about silicone and glass holding 2 tons of water and another half ton of sand and rock. Plus the cost to go glass was literally double and I do not have that kind of dough sitting around. I tell myself I'll be careful. I hope it works out.
Sorry about the above typos, I just reread what I wrote. I made a lot of mistakes my first time around, my biggest mistake was completely trusting my LFS and not doing my own research. You have me beat hands down in that regard. My LFS in retrospect charged me a lot for my acrylic tank. They told me they were giving me their cost and dividing it between both of us, however i now realize I grossly overpaid, and they gave me no deal. They had me over a barrel with the acrylic since they said they wouldn't help me with a glass tank. Many people do well with acrylic and I am sure you will too. As far as skimmers look into the Orca. I was torn between that and the Bubble King, but the price differential was to great for me to take the Bubble King. Hope I have no regrets. Good luck.
ChrisColumbus
New member
Hey thanks mh! Best of luck to you too. I really hope I don't regret the acrylic. Keep in touch. I'd like to see how things go for you. The 96x36x42 sounds absolutely incredible!
toothman
Premium Member
I would install the hammerhead impeller and a ball valve and union valve for replacement or cleaning, I run mine full speed ahead. Two 2" return pipes are sufficeint, I run mine 40' to the sump, if you want 3" it can not hurt.
We all know the problem with acrylic it scratches, it is easier to move and less expensive, and looks really cool though.
you can get good fiji live rock on ebay 50lb, $130
Bulk reef supply has some nice dry rock to add, both are good.Pukani.
As far a substrate just remember what goes in must come out some day, I would put as little as possible after you add live rock or none. Live sand is not necessary. Dry and soak in ro/di for a couple of days.
You do not need a refugium with carbon dosing.
I would just use a 125 gallon tank for sump that is what I do.
And skimmer sorry bubble king 300.
Mp 60's are loud, just so you know.
Just some bullets from a large tank owner for 6 yrs.
We all know the problem with acrylic it scratches, it is easier to move and less expensive, and looks really cool though.
you can get good fiji live rock on ebay 50lb, $130
Bulk reef supply has some nice dry rock to add, both are good.Pukani.
As far a substrate just remember what goes in must come out some day, I would put as little as possible after you add live rock or none. Live sand is not necessary. Dry and soak in ro/di for a couple of days.
You do not need a refugium with carbon dosing.
I would just use a 125 gallon tank for sump that is what I do.
And skimmer sorry bubble king 300.
Mp 60's are loud, just so you know.
Just some bullets from a large tank owner for 6 yrs.
ChrisColumbus
New member
Is running two smaller skimmers more effective than one larger? Have you done that?
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