So you got a new fish tank Newbie

[MPH]

Hi Tom,

I posted to you a month or so ago. Iââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢m the guy how moved a 120 gal tank and a ââ"šÂ¬Ã…"œschool of tangsââ"šÂ¬Ã‚ for CT to PA. You answered a question about the ammonia test. The tank has been up for almost 3 months now and everything is doing fine. I added a mandarin that was kind of skinny and heââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢s plumped up nicely.

Anyway, I was reading Marinegrilââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢s post about having pink and purple coraline after a couple of weeks. I havenââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t seen any signs of it yet and remember the LR and LS are about 10 years old. When I picked up the tank the end was completely covered as well as the internal plumbing. The rocks have a lot of all different colors, nothing sees to growing anywhere. Is there some problem here?

 

[WaterKeeper]

I'm a little lost here MPH. Is there coralline growing on the LR, remember it may be other shades than pink? Lack of growth on the glass, and especially the plastic seams of the tank, would indicate some sort of a problem. The most common ones would be extremely low calcium levels, light of limited spectrum or perhaps a toxicity problem. Ten year old rock should be covered completely with coralline.

 

[MPH]

The rock was covered with coraline when I it but I can't tell if its still growing. Has lots of different colors. Haven't checked for calcium yet but I do farily large water changes, about 30% every 2 weeks and add kalc every day. Lights are MH and VHO. Don't know the color temp. VHOs look to be 1 10,000 K and 1 actinic.

 

[fio1022]

Just Another Dumb Question

Just Another Dumb Question

Hi Tom,
I've been cycling my rock for about two weeks now.I decided to convert my old Magnum canister filter into a mechanical rock vacuum.It works too well.It sucked up so much debris that it forced a pleum a tiny debris back into the tank.
I figured I it was better to get it out.Am I doing more harm than good?Also my skimmer stopped bubbling since I did this.Should I not vacuum the rock?
Just another dumb question,
Thanks,
Jim

 

[WaterKeeper]

Miles,

Coralline doesn't grow real long so it is hard to see real growth by judging length. Dead coralline turns white much like coral bleaching. I would expect some to grow on the glass in a healthy tank.

Jim,

Not sure what to tell you. Vacuuming rock should not hurt it. I blow sand and debris off mine using a turkey baster. The thing to avoid is deep vacuuming of an established DSB. You can clean the very top of a sandbed but you don't want to disturb much more than the surface or you upset the denitrification process.

Are you saying that the skimmer is no longer making foam or that the aeration system has ceased to function?

 

[fio1022]

Hi Tom,
My tank looks so much better since I did this.The skimmer is foaming again but I've yet to remove anything from the collection cup so far(running over two weeks now).I thought I would be removing a lot of muck by now.Is this normal?I read somewhere that skimmers need time to break in.I don't know what to expect.
Thanks,
Jim

 

[tigerczr]

Hey Tom,
I'm currently cycling my 75g tank with LS/LR and just started my 3rd week. You mention that dead coralline turns white. I'm starting to see a lot of white on some of my LR. Are those rocks ever going to regrow coralline algae? Or are they just going to remain white?

 

[MPH]

Tom,

I have the same skimmer problem as Jim. Mine does not foam for more than half the day and when it does, it doesnââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t collect anything. All I get in the collection cup is about Ã"šÃ‚½ cup of light green water a day. Looks like Chinese green tea. Is it possible that the large clean up crew and abundance of soft coral is removing too much of the organics?

 

[Scuba Oz]

WATERKEEPER,
Just finished reading this whole thread so far, I think you answered almost every question I have had so far. I just wanted to thank you for you wisdom in helping a new guy like me out, acnt wait to read more

 

[fat_terry]

Waterkeeper,

just in case you were in any doubt at all, this thread you have is fantastic for us Newbies. You cannot be thanked enough. No, really. I only wish Id found it earlier. Its taken me ages to read, but finally I have reached the end !!

So, having just entered the class Im sat at the back so you can only send me to the corner for failing the comprehension test on all those millions of pages you have written ! Actually, Ill go to the corner now and ask my "newbie" questions ..... OK here I am (standing, back to class, in corner)......

15 years ago I tried saltwater fish (only) keeping. Under gravel filter, water changes. That was it. I didnt learn a lot. It was only marginally successful.

So now you're telling me had I turned the undergravel filter off, added some "LIVE" sand critters and a skimmer I have been able to keep corals and loads of fish quite successfully ? Have I got this right ?

Well, assuming Ive understood, what happens if I live in Australia (as I do) and requests for "LIVE SAND" are met with a "ohh, you've been reading an American book have you - we dont do LIVE SAND, its hard to get hold of" (as they are) ?

Do I then revert to bioballs (or DIY version) in (DIY) sump and a skimmer (again, Im thinking home made) ? Or do I put on my scuba gear (I live near the coast) and dig around on the seabed and get loads of sand (and a few rocks) and use that ? Where does this live sand come from, and how do I know its any good ? Or really, are bioballs going to do me just as well if I really cant do it the way you suggest ?

Now remember, Im already standing to attention facing the corner (what's that, hold out my hand .... a ruler ? OUCH.)

(PS I know it looks like Im giving the teacher an apple, but really Im not (I cant post an apple) and your help to us newbies is absolutely the best)

 

[Scuba Oz]

fat_terry, I use to live in Randwick and went to Bondi beach every morning for a little run or walk, I could always call me mates and have them send you some live sand from the point! Just kidding, I do have some friends in Oz still that do tanks, I will ask them where they got their live sand from and post it back on this site. I am surprised being so close to Fiji, and southeast Asia that this is a problem for you, BUT I do remember how much my first T.V. cost in Australia which was made 500 miles from Sydney! Will be back in touch

 

[WaterKeeper]

Hi all, I didn't answer these latest questions sooner but I was busy during the election serving as a Poll Watcher. This is a rather boring task as there is not a large Polish population in this area.

Tim and Jim,

Skimmate collection is tightly intertwined with the amount of organic protein dissolved in the water column. This protein, sometimes called albuminoid nitrogen, is what mainly comprises skimmate. In a fully cycled tank with low organic waste production there may be very little of this organic material to collect and hence low amounts of foam appear in the collection cup. On the other hand, in tanks with tons of livestock and heavily fed there can be large amounts created every day. It all depends on the bioload. I won't be at all concerned if collection is low as long as your nitrate levels are not going through the roof.

One other thing is that new or freshly cleaned skimmers take awhile to "season". The draft tube develops a film with time that helps the foam rise in the draft tube and reach the collection cup. Once again it is not a great concern if water quality is good.

Hi Terry
<img src="/images/welcome.gif" width="500" height="62"><br><b><i><big><big>To Reef Central</b></i></big></big>

Darn, yet another Aussie. At least Oz escaped the penal colony and is hiding in Texas.

I too wouldn't think it is a big problem to find live sand if you live on an island in the Pacific.

Actually there is a trend right now to go back to the old "bare bottom" system that was in place some years ago. It just so happens we have a good thread Starboard Reef Thread that talks about the virtues of such a bare bottom system. You will note however that Bomber lists his occupation as a Doctor of Marine Pathology, which does not bode well for his fish.

Kidding aside, Bomber is very knowledgeable in reefkeeping and that may be the rub. He knows very well the limits of a system and doesn't overload his tanks. Most of us end up with tanks that have as many critters in them as we can afford. This, IMO, is where the DBS is important. Its anoxic/anaerobic biology allows nitrates to be reduced to nitrogen gas and be removed from the tank's environment. I still advocate the use of a DSB but as more people jump on the bare bottom bandwagon we'll get a better idea of how well it works.

Lastly, the white areas on new rock is common and the coralline will grow back in these areas. The white you see is the remaining calcium in the alga's cell wall and new coralline will grow over this old material.

 

[marinegirl]

No snow storm
No Brown
No Green
am I lucky hey ....

Then wham I get cyano! And I mean cyano every where it looks like a bad taste nite club with red shag all over

Its my lights I think so I replaced the odd bulbs /tubes... my tank params are the norm from what i can see ...all @ 0

So I try to remove the cyano ... it comes back I water change and water change ... I swear ive lost kilos doing water changes...
It comes back yet again

So I ask the forum what do I kill it with... they say chemi clean... i say wonderful except i cannot buy it here in Australia then i stumble across a thread about sugar saying how good it works and some saying what a fool for even thinking of trying it ...

but im brave ill try anything once so are our fish there starting to trust me if they had crash helmets they would have donned them as I stepped upto the tank with my glass of dissolved sugar !

The thread says 1 tablespoon for a 55 I think... so i do 1 table spoon for my 200 (im not that brave and the fish had that worried look about them) ... i slow pour it into my sump and nothing absolutely nothing happens in the tank all afternoon...
So im thinking well that was a pretty stupid thing to do.

I goto bed, I wake up to a tank that looks like scene out of an old Dracula movie with fog romping everywhere in my tank by the end of the day its clearing again ....

But as it clears im expecting to see the cyano laughing at me all over the place but instead.... my cyano has died as dead as dead can be....

So go figure I just saved $50 on chemicals thanks to Raw Sugar

All my fish buddies are happy and donââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t look stressed either

 

[WaterKeeper]

It also appears that our Down Under Marinegirl stays up real late and watches her tank. I really have no idea why sugar would end a cyano bloom but don't mess with success.

Maybe you can use it to lower the pH on your rock farm too.

Cane sugar the miracle cure for all your tank problems.

 

[marinegirl]

if only !

 

[kennethl]

waterkeeper, I've been enjoying the thread and learing lots in the process.

I have a couple of questions for you and anyone else that might have some advice to a newb

I have a 200 gal that is almost ready for plumbing and inital setup, a 90 gal converted into a sump. 4 6' VHO's for lights & skimmer is still being selected.. tied between MRC MR-3 and ETSS and AquaC 240 and not sure which way to move.. any opinions on these skimmers would be appreciated.

was/am planning to run <b>FO</b> as this is my try at a salt system.

My LFS (has great reputation) has reccomended a lower salinity for FO. They said this is good for preventing parasites and the fish dont have to work as hard to maintain osmotic pressure.. I'm starting to get the impression that running a lower salinity has a cascading effect..

<b>First question</b> Do you know, is this detrimental to the fishes health if the water is maintained at a lower salinity for a long period of time months / years? any drawbacks I've missed (below)?

local LFS said LR wont have any real benifits in a FO with lower salinity killing most of the good critters with the lower salinity while introducing some potentially harmful critters .. they recomended going with wetdry only.

They also reccomended a very thin layer of sand for a FO tank.. like 1/3 inch & said in a FO a deep bed is a good place for ich spores and other nasties and since I won't have any inverts eating/stiring it up..because of the lower salinity.. would just be a place for detritus to build up and cause water probs.
(they could have made some $$ on sand and rock so I believe they are sincere.)

From what I've been reading, going wet dry only isnt the best solution but dont want to waste $$ on LR if they are correct.

They have also mentioned a product they have used to jump start the cycle that they say has worked well for them in the past

<b>second and third question</b>

If I put marine safe rock .. prefrebly something that will also buffer the water in with LS, live culture, and dead shrimp wont I eventually have LR? or is this really a recipe for a nasty alge mess?

opps almost forgot.
Is the 1/3 inch of sand on the mark for a FO?

lastly.. If the whole idea is wrong feel free to save some time and say <b>kennethl return to page one of this thread..do over</b> I'd rather ask now while its easy & cheap to re stratagize then after a failure.

K

 

[Paul Pos]

Waterkeeper,

From the bottom of my future 120g tank, thank you for all you do for us newbies. If you had a nickel for every fish/invert/coral you've saved with this thread you could afford an extreme makeover for your Avatar

On page 1 of this thread you write: I did leave one thing out that any Newbie should do when installing a new tank in a permanent location. If you have carpeting you may want to spray the area around the new tank area with a carpet water proofing material. If it is on hardwood or tile a good coat of wax is a great idea. New or old to the hobby you will find it comes into use at some point in your reefing experience.

I plan on placing my stand on a hardwood floor (waxed, of course). I'm concerned about the floor vibration being transmitted to the tank and stressing the fish.

Any ideas on how to dampen the vibration? Am I worrying unnecessarily? I just know that if I screw this up, I'll never be able to fix once the tank is filled.

So far the only advice I've gotten was to put mouse pads under the stand. I seriously doubt mouse pads will isolate the vibration after being compressed to oblivion by 1 ton of weight.

Thanks for pandering to my neuroses. :mixed:

 

[Paul Pos]

DOH! Double post...my bad.

 

[Scuba Oz]

I build sound booths sometimes in my business, so vibration is the MAIN concern. You could go the right way and buy vibration cups that attach to the 2x4 on the bottom of your stand (dont know how your stand is built) they look like rubber "U"'s, they are about an inch to two inches thick, and install them every two to four inches. Inbetween the joists (again I dont know how your stand is built) the cheap and effective route is use egg crate foam or just plain old foam (real cheap way, but works) We use sand as our base the the cups, but it does cost a little, I do 10x10 or 20x20 rooms though, under a stand your not talking that many SF, so cost will be minimal. Here is another route you could take. Go to Home Depot, or Sears Hardware and buy those garage floor mats that go together like a puzzle, they are over buy the tool boxes, they are for in front of the work bench area so your feet and back dont hurt from standing on concrete. Lay that down and put your stand there, trace around it leaving about an inch, and cut. Hope this helps

 

[Scuba Oz]

Forgot to tell you where the cups can come from. Usually your local Guitar Center can order them, bring your checkbook though. The foam, I would look in your local yellow pages, there are usually tons of foam places out there, they usually have a minimal order though, like two 4x8 sheets (way to much for you) so ask for some scraps. Worst case senerio you could use insulation, but thart really is not a good vibration deadner, good luck:thumbsup: