So you got a new fish tank Newbie

[WaterKeeper]

Just kind of push your LS to one side. Then add the new sand and push the LS over the top. Any aragonite type sand is OK IMO. A fine grade of beach (silica sand) will do in a pinch.

WaterKeeper's theory that aragonite helps stabilize pH is just that--a theory. I think having the proper depth, around 4", supercede the other factors in setting up the proper tank environment.

Wave action on a real reef causes "sand storms" all the time. Most of the critters you have in your tank should survive.

Crystal---go over and hold Danial's hand. Whoops---Crystal is married. :lol:

 

[Lofty]

The argonite is $17 a 20lb bag at Petsmart.... at that rat I would have to throw down $120 to get 120 Lbs to add to my 40 lbs. But you say that the silica sand is ok... what is the difference between southdown and your everyday playsand you can get at a hardware store?

 

[Lofty]

Bluesman check your PM

 

[WaterKeeper]

Danial,

Someshere in this post I threw out a little WaterKeeper theory on the activity in a DBS. In my own theory of a DBS, an aragonite sand bed, calcium carbonate, neutralizes volatile organic acids formed in anaerobic regions of a DSB. This stops the decline of alkalinity in the tank and maintains a stable pH.

You must remember that this is only theory and that WaterKeeper's ideas are usually classed as pure "bunk" my most people at RC. :lol:

In fact, I've been known to have an unhealthy mental attitude and a fixation on nitrogen fixation.:crazy1:

 

[Lofty]

Well the problem is I am getting conflicting information about the sand. This sand that I bought does not say if it is silica sand or not but I am assuming it is. If you are saying silica will do then that is my option. I do not get paid untill the 31st and this tank has put me in the poor house untill then. I'd use one of my credit cards but I am refinancing my house

 

[Lofty]

OK..I got argonite. all I could afford and get from the LFS was 60 Lbs So that will make me a 100 Lb sand bed.

 

[Lofty]

Well it looks like about a 3" SB. I am gonna run a whisper filter on it to clear the cloudyness as soon as I get the new water in.

 

[NUBIANTANGLOVER]

WaterKeeper,
I enjoyed reading through your series of posts. I would like you to help me if you could by giving me your BEST advice:

This summer I saved and saved until I purchased my baby, my DREAM WORLD: a 175 Oceanic RR Show Bowfront. I got it from a RC member here who relocated and thus, did not have the space to house it. -I am extremely LUCKY as it is practically brand new & in excellent shape. With it, I received some very expensive/excellent items---which paid for the purchase itself. Although I am not new to saltwater---I have been successful with my 55 FOWLR, I have been reading many books and RC posts to further my knowledge on reefkeeping. I am a firm believer that Knowledge is Power! My plans are to turn my new "baby" into a REEF tank. The tank is 6 feet long and approx. 26- 28inches deep. I will be doing a 4" DSB with Southdown and I have a BioRocker Deluxe w/acrylic sump to serve as my filter. My question for you is could you please help me with a lighting situation. I also received free (2) 72" 160 watt per bulb VHOs with an Ice Cap 430. I realize that this is not enough wattage for my tank (reef speaking). But, it's a start. I would like to continue using VHOs and I want to add 3 additional VHOs with the purchase of an Ice Cap 660. This will allow me a total wattage of 800 watts. I want to know if this would be okay for me to have a "Reef World." I understand that MH are excellent for the reef. But, economically, I want to save, if possible. And, adding MHs would mean that I would need to pay to get a specially designed canopy for my 175 bow (as the current "cap" biult by Oceanic to outfit this system is made of a hard type of plastic and certainly not suitable for MHs.) Also, I don't want to "HANG" MH's from my celing as I have a 10 month old who is already fascinated by my 55 gallon and I do not want to risk the chance of ruining his eyes from constantly starring up at the MHs. Please tell me what you think. Although I am not new to saltwater---you can never get enough info in regards to upgrading to a REEF tank. Thanks. I LOVE MY NEW TANK---and I can't wait to start.

 

[tuckz]

i would like to ask, how do we actually tell rthe difference between all this types of sand/gravel
theres this crushed marbles which is whit and quite fine
and also how to tell the difference between aragonite and crushed corals?

 

[tuckz]

i'm also trying to start using DSB
but the prob is that i have a aquarium with fishs and corals now
if i use DSB now, how do i add the sand?
or even worse, how do i leave the water and stuff to let it cycle
i know we need toio keep it free from livestocks while cycling

 

[Lofty]

OK... so heres how I'm doing it....

Get a large sterilite or rubbermaid container (enough to hold all of your rock and corals)

Use a power head and a hose to fill the container with your tank water. (not all the way)

As the container fills carefull start removing rock first (you may have to move around your corals to get to them)

Once you have all the rock in the container and it is fill so that it is covered, you can start moving equipment (powerheads, skimmers and such)

Leave the water thats in your tank there (it counts as a huge water change)

Get your choice of sand (south down or argonite) Make sure you rinse the argonite before you put it in or you will get something that looks like this (I have no idea how long this will take to clear up)
BTW sorry about the pic quality its a cemera phone

Here is my Temp setup

 

[tuckz]

how long must i let it cycle?

 

[tuckz]

i have nearly 130 pounds of LR
i will need a really big container
but i guess this will be the only way?

 

[Lofty]

You sshould not have to go through a cycle.... if the rock stays in the water from your tank its just like doing a massive water cahange, only you are shifting stuff around so that it won't be affected. What you saw in my container was 72 lbs... so if you gate two and put a power head in both and run your skimmer on one and then the other... you shoudh be fine. I am gonna keep it like this untill it settles. Make sure you do your tests though before you go putting stuff back in just as a precaution in case somthing silly happend. hope this helps.... I'm going through it right now so PM me if you ahve any questions about prgress or anything else

 

[Arachnidacolyte]

whats your next topic going to be on waterkeeper? I am on the edge of my seat wating!

 

[WaterKeeper]

Methinks I had better tackle all the sand bed retrofit topics first.

Danial is right on the money when he says you don't have a cycle when adding inert sand to the bed. Cycles are only caused by die off of critters on the LR and LS. If you are adding Southdown then there shouldn't be any effect other than the sand storm. After about a day the sandstorm will have abated to the point where it won't bother the creatures in your tank. In the real reef storms and tidal events create sand storms all the time. The creatures from the reef get through them just fine.

The only effect that you might see is if you have an actively de-nitrifying bed. If you rearrange such a bed you disrupt the anoxic and anaerobic zones that have formed. This can lead to an increase in nitrates for awhile. That is why when you read through threads on RC you see people warning about messing with the bed. In a new, lightly loaded tank it should not pose a problem.

In a pinch you can slope the bed. Say make it 2" up front and 4" in back. It decreases the available surface area but in most cases it is not a major drawback.

When choosing sand you want a fairly fine, "sugar sized" sand. Crushed coral is too course for a proper sand bed. You see it used at the LFS but remember their tanks are only short term holding tanks so they don't worry about an active biological bed. As I stated earlier, silica sand, if it is fine enough, is probably OK to use. My own feeling is that aragonite is better due to the buffering capability of the calcium carbonate that forms it. There is somewhat of an urban legend that surrounds silica sands. It supposedly dissolves to form soluble silicates. There would have to be some pretty weird chemistry happening in one's tank for that to occur. I have heard some people mention that silica sand will react with fluoride in the water. That I guess is possible but it you are using RO/DI, like all good reefers then there shouldn't be any fluoride in the water.

NUBIANTANGLOVER,

That sounds fine for the lighting. There are plenty of good tanks out there that don't use MH. You want to use at least some 03 actinic in your lighting plan. Of course, there are some that say that isn't even necessary with modern high K bulbs.

Arachnidacolyte

I am going to talk about lighting next but don't have time do it today. :lol:

 

[tuckz]

how can i tell the difference between all this kind of sand
the LFS around here dont know anything

 

[NUBIANTANGLOVER]

THANKS ALOT WATERKEEPER!!!

 

[Lofty]

Thanks WaterKeeper.

One problem that I ran into. (not reading directions) Just dumped the argonite into the tank and now I have an everlasting milk storm in the tank. I have a small bio filter runnning to try and clear it up but it is really cloudy. Is this gonna be bad or just wait for it to settle?

 

[WaterKeeper]

:lol: NUBIANTANGLOVER

Not being any relation to the Deity when I say, "Let there be light" it doesn't happen very fast.

tuckz,

The usual test for aragonite is the "vinegar test". If you pour vinegar on some it bubbles up and fizzes. Leave it sit in some vinegar and it will eventually dissolve. This only happens with limestone based minerals like aragonite and calcite

Daniel,

No matter how careful one is there is always a sandstorm when adding new sand. It will clear up on its own over a couple of days or you can speed things up by using a polishing cartridge in a canister filter. You'll need some vinegar here also to clean the filter cartridge. It will plug up very fast. Remember to rinse it well after soaking in vinegar.

In a new tank it doesn't take much to stir up the bed. I think someone already mentioned that, over time, a bacteria film forms on the sand particles. These bacteria secrete various polymers that act as a glue and keep the sand storms in check in an established tank. As I said earlier today. After about 24 hours you can put any critters you have back into the tank without harm. A good old turkey baster can be used to blow any sand off the rock etc. I never thought I'd have to say this but I recently saw a new reefer using a baster. He took it out of the tank and filled it with air each time he squeezed it. Fill it with water and the water stream will do a much better job at cleaning stuff.

Oh, by the way. If rinsing a fine sand like Southdown don't get too carried away. You'll lose most of it down the drain it you rinse it too hard. Some people say you shouldn't rinse it at all as the very fine particles are good for the bed too.