SPS Targeted Feeding Macro Video Experiment

[trueblackpercula]

Fair enough. Thanks.

Would you be kind enough to provide links to successful reef set ups, which you are aware of, in which various forms sugars is used to feed corals and bacteria?

Thanks for the advice well taken. As for tanks that use a carbon source, well ther are many around here on Reefcentral.

But here is the most recent one that comes to mind
http://reefkeeping.com/joomla/index.php/current-issue/article/140-tank-of-the-month

Enjoy

Michael

 

[DiscusHeckel]

Thanks for the advice well taken. As for tanks that use a carbon source, well ther are many around here on Reefcentral.

But here is the most recent one that comes to mind
http://reefkeeping.com/joomla/index.php/current-issue/article/140-tank-of-the-month

Enjoy

Michael

That's really great. Thanks. I only read this article two days ago. Clearly, information did not register. In my case, I am already dosing vinegar as organic carbon source. Using sugars may well complicate things for me.

:beer:

 

[trueblackpercula]

That's really great. Thanks. I only read this article two days ago. Clearly, information did not register. In my case, I am already dosing vinegar as organic carbon source. Using sugars may well complicate things for me.

:beer:

You can try this but let's try and get back on the main topic please. If you want more help with carbon dosing please send me a PM and I will send you what you need..

http://glassbox-design.com/2008/achieved-through-observation-and-experimentation/

 

[martinphillip03]

I don't know why sugar is in the recipe but somebody thought it was necessary for feeding the SPS. This recipe has been proven successful.
Looking at the amount made, and the amount you feed, I really can't see a tablespoon of sugar being a major player in this.

What happens if you added salt to the mixture to use as a preservative?


Marty

I used 6mls yesterday to feed the tank

***My only concern with the food is shelf life as I have it in the refrigerator stored in the little bottle that contains 6oz of food that the oyster feast originally came in.***

I would think that it can be stored for at least 30 to 40 days before it expires. ( Does anyone think this is off let me know ) I don't want people to think that it last longer and start polluting there tanks and blaming me for something that was not noted.


***WARNING: KEEP REFRIGERATED AT ALL TIMES AS THIS IS RAW SEAFOOD AND COULD CAUSE HEALTH ISSUES***
Materials:
5 Oysters (NONE locally )
5 Mussels = YES fresh
5 Clams =YES fresh > if you can have the store you buy them from open them up for you have them do so as these things are hard to open up.
5 Shrimp= YES whole no heads or shells and I did not clean the vein left it in.
1 Tablespoon of Sugar (not corn syrup, etc.) = YES regular sugar
200 mL of RO/DI water =NO I added 250 ml RO/DI water because it was too thick and this appears to have a better consistency for feeding.
10 g of Algae = NO I used three sheets of seaweed NORI
" you use about 1.33 mg of somatropin, which corresponds to the 4 unit vial." = NO not in this batch but possibly in the next batch LOL pending my doctors approval.

 

[trueblackpercula]

I don't know why sugar is in the recipe but somebody thought it was necessary for feeding the SPS. This recipe has been proven successful.
Looking at the amount made, and the amount you feed, I really can't see a tablespoon of sugar being a major player in this.

What happens if you added salt to the mixture to use as a preservative?


Marty

The suger is a source of carbon to keep the nitrates and phosphates under control, but I am purly guessing here. But it sounds right.

 

[DiscusHeckel]

The suger is a source of carbon to keep the nitrates and phosphates under control, but I am purly guessing here. But it sounds right.

Yes, it is. It introduces monomers to feed facultative heterotrophic bacteria for inorganic nutrient reduction. I speculate that perhaps its purpose is to offset some of the nutrients, which the recipe introduces to the water column.

I will say no more in order not to lose focus from the main objective of this thread.

 

[trueblackpercula]

Yes, it is. It introduces monomers to feed facultative heterotrophic bacteria for inorganic nutrient reduction. I speculate that perhaps its purpose is to offset some of the nutrients, which the recipe introduces to the water column.

I will say no more in order not to lose focus from the main objective of this thread.

Yes all that is true and no worries , do you feed your tank? Post a video

 

[DiscusHeckel]

Yes all that is true and no worries , do you feed your tank? Post a video

I do not feed my corals directly at present. I feed my fish very heavily instead. However, I am considering feeding my corals directly, hence my subscription to this thread.

Thanks for your contribution.

 

[trueblackpercula]

Well here is a video I just made after feeding my system with the above mentioned food source that I made.

What ya think Sps overdosing on my food. Lol
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6H4yGGTDxBs

 

[Chriskid]

Well here is a video I just made after feeding my system with the above mentioned food source that I made.

What ya think Sps overdosing on my food. Lol
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6H4yGGTDxBs

now here is my question, my acros also do this with feeding, however are they useing these stinging filaments for agressive defence or to feed. iv seen polyps eat but filaments just seem to neutralize larger food........ thoughts?

 

[trueblackpercula]

Here is A video I found on You-tube of the original recipe, I wont ruin the video but please check it out. If anyone can translate please do.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MfzYwE6lv8

this is what they have under the video, the only word I know IS vodka
la méthode papone vous conaissez ???

Le principe de la méthode papone vise à salir fortement le bac afin de favoriser son épuration par le biais d'une forte population en micro faune. Le but donc nourrir tout bac.

pour l'instant j'ai injecté 20 cc dans toutes l'installation et les lps/sps ouvert a fond et la méthode Papone permettrait donc de nourrir de façon optimale les coraux.

voici ma recette avec ce qui m'a permis de vider mes tiroir

5 coques
5 moules
5 huitres
5 gambas (crevettes roses)
1 Reef booster de prodibio
anchoie .trés riche en oméga 3
ultra lps marin fauna en granule
un demi sachet de Reef pearl
spiruline en poudre
250 g d'œufs de poissons
2 cuillere a café de cyclop eeze
250 g de mycis
250g artémias
2 ml de volka
1 cuillere a cafe de sucre en poudre

il faut que la mixture soit très liquide et de ne pas oublier de rajouté de l'eau osmosé soit l'équivalent de 200 ml et la melangé la plus fine possible a l'aide d'un blinder

le tout repose dans des sac pour cube a congelation et la distribution deux fois par semaine de 5 a 10 ml / 200 litres

http://lerecifdubelon.com/

 

[sahin]

Well done everyone for keeping this thread going. I am having good results with my SPS in terms of colour.

 

[slimm]

Thanks for doing this. Helps us new to SPS people.

 

[biggles]

Thanks for being the testing guinea pig with that food mix Michael and sharing the pics and videos. :beer: I agree with you guys that the sugar is probably just added to assist with nutrient control rather than aimed at coral nutrition directly. If you aren't having nutrient issues i'd give it a miss but as Allmost pointed out the use of sugar and other carbon sources does work if applied correctly. I didn't mean to indicate that dropping the sugar meant it was useless, i just don't need it but i do see its inclusion could be advantageous if required.

Tbh the only way i think we can see what's really going on with those long filaments is to stimulate them into extending and then macro film feeding the acros foods that i know are consumed by polyps directly to see if those filaments catch and then withdraw holding onto food particles. The other thought i have is that they are more involved with absorption of aminos etc and may be the acro maximising the area available for chemical absorption through tissue. If you tip 100ml of your skimmate into the tank after lights out you will see a great many acros extending filaments. There is no sliming when this happens just as when you add some of these targeted foods but if i go overboard stirring up too much filth from my sand bed i see filaments AND quite a few acros releasing slime - a very different and obvious reaction to something toxic the acros don't like. No idea tbh but i see these filaments on some acros when i feed reef roids and mysis pulp to the display - foods i have personally verified are actively consumed by acro polyps by watching the polyps catch, swallow and re open over 10-15 min periods. They're bloody slow eaters lol.
I do think they are a good reaction as long as they're not accompanied by sliming but how they function in regards to our feeding techniques is not 100% clear to me yet, need to make an SSC frag to use for macro feeding as they spit out filaments when i open the fridge door holding all my coral foods....... true stuff, would i lie......... :smokin:

 

[trueblackpercula]

Thanks for being the testing guinea pig with that food mix Michael and sharing the pics and videos. :beer: I agree with you guys that the sugar is probably just added to assist with nutrient control rather than aimed at coral nutrition directly. If you aren't having nutrient issues i'd give it a miss but as Allmost pointed out the use of sugar and other carbon sources does work if applied correctly. I didn't mean to indicate that dropping the sugar meant it was useless, i just don't need it but i do see its inclusion could be advantageous if required.QUOTE]

My pleasure Biggles and all the rest of the Feeding Fans of this thread.

I think that this weekend I am going to make the next batch with oyster. From what I have been reading and the videos I have seen this is the key ingredient I left out because no one had any. When I was feeding oyster feast I was very skeptical and was under dosing from fear of over dosing, when I ramped it up is when I started to see major PE and extended filaments. This first batch of Pappone does not have the oysters in it and I am getting amazing results so I will be closely documenting what the outcome is for good or bad for all to see once I add the oyster feast. By the way this stuff is very inexpensive to make considering the amount you get from it.
I am very excited from what I am seeing in my tank right now, Not only has color improved but the life in the sand bed has really come to life. There are many more pods, worms ETC moving around and multiplying.
I am also seeing and it could just be me as I didn't take before and after pictures of my built in over flow area has an explosive growth of sponges, small feather duster worms and pods moving around. I will post a picture of that area soon for all to see, I am also going full blow with creating a cryptic zone area in my sump and possibly my very large area in the over flow. 31 x 4 x 4 will post a picture and always could use advice on this. 
I will first create a cryptic area in the sump by adding egg crates and live rock loaded with sponges ( The white ones) for them to attach to. Of course this area in the sump is dark and receives little to no light as it is below my tank. I have already removed my sponge filters and filter socks as they were causing more bad then good.
I have been doing a lot of research and all the tanks that I have seen that I really like are the ones with DSB, high lighting, large skimmers and very simplistic sump areas. Not to mention they have areas that are loaded with sponges, pods and worms alike.
This new venture is what I truly believe is what my system has been missing all these years. The food source that I made has fed the entire tank not just my SPS and I hope others learn from my learning experiences and failures.
**** NOTE: I have been adding about 4mls a day to about 115 gallons of water volume of this food and I am seeing not only explosive growth of life and extended PE but my glass on the tank gets algae haze every two days now more than ever before. So I know I have reached my tanks limit in nutrient import and export. This is something that will vary from system to system so please be careful if you use this food source or method.
My tank is 120 gallon cube and I have a 20 gallon sump and I have been adding 4 mls a day. But after you subtract 3 ½ DSB , live rocks and corals I think I am More at 115 gallons Total. I just wanted to state this so others can gauge what to dose in their tanks.
Enjoy everyone
Michael

 

[sirreal63]

Good job Michael. The hard part is always figuring out how much you can safely feed. I feed a lot more but it took over a year to get to the point that I am at. Starting slow is always advisable as it takes time for the life in the tank to catch up to the food import.

Here is an example of how much I feed, and I feed this every other day or so but have gone as much as a week or so between feedings. This is a 16 oz. Solo Cup and I add enough tank water to bring the level up to the line, (we called that the "shot line" when I was younger.) I add a teaspoon of this every hour or so throughout the day. The tank stays cloudy on feeding days.

I believe in the benefits of sponges, most are beneficial and their growth should be encouraged. My sump is unlit, no macro algae in it but I don't have much sponge growth there because I clean it frequently. All of the rock in the display is covered in sponge growth. You can turn any rock over and see mostly sponge.

You can even see them in shaded areas out in the open.

I don't really have documentation to back my own experiences with feeding the tank as opposed to just the fish, but the method isn't new and has been practiced in Europe for many years. My own experience shows a benefit but there is also a downside as you will have more detritus, more algae (though mine is limited to mostly the glass with the exception of a brutal strain of Valonia I am fighting) and possibly more cyano. None of those IMO outweigh the benefits.

 

[trueblackpercula]

Good job Michael. The hard part is always figuring out how much you can safely feed. I feed a lot more but it took over a year to get to the point that I am at. Starting slow is always advisable as it takes time for the life in the tank to catch up to the food import.

Here is an example of how much I feed, and I feed this every other day or so but have gone as much as a week or so between feedings. This is a 16 oz. Solo Cup and I add enough tank water to bring the level up to the line, (we called that the "shot line" when I was younger.) I add a teaspoon of this every hour or so throughout the day. The tank stays cloudy on feeding days.

I believe in the benefits of sponges, most are beneficial and their growth should be encouraged. My sump is unlit, no macro algae in it but I don't have much sponge growth there because I clean it frequently. All of the rock in the display is covered in sponge growth. You can turn any rock over and see mostly sponge.

You can even see them in shaded areas out in the open.

I don't really have documentation to back my own experiences with feeding the tank as opposed to just the fish, but the method isn't new and has been practiced in Europe for many years. My own experience shows a benefit but there is also a downside as you will have more detritus, more algae (though mine is limited to mostly the glass with the exception of a brutal strain of Valonia I am fighting) and possibly more cyano. None of those IMO outweigh the benefits.

First off amazing work you have there as your tank looks beautiful. Now that I got that out the way thanks for the complimet. So I see you have yellow sponge is that in your sump area or main display?

Also the food in the cup is it your own blend or is it Pappone? In any case it sure looks like it's full of nutrients that will feed your entire tank. Have you had in increase in nitrates and PO4? My tank is still reading zero for both and that makes me a little uneasy. I know the kits are good as I use two different types and get the same readings. But then again between changing 6 gallons of water weekly GFO and carbon maybe that's why. I also have some algea problems but it's starting to go away. I did have the bryops at one time but after maintaining my magnisium at 1500 plus for a while mocked it out. Please share more pictures of not only your tank but your sump as well.

Michael

 

[sirreal63]

Sponges are in display, they start to grow in the sump but I end up cleaning them out before they get very big. The food is my own mix, it changes each time I make it based on what I find to put in it. The last batch I made lasted over a year and a half and was various fresh seafood items, various frozen foods, bloodworms, Cyclopeaze and a 64 oz pack of PE Mysis. It is a struggle to register nitrates as the tank processes them too well, the heavy feedings help but if I slow down on feeding I run undetectable with Salifert and the corals tend to lighten. I do use GFO to keep the po4 at about .02-.05 and haven't had to carbon dose in almost a year now.

The sump is an unbaffled 40 gallon tote from Ikea, it is nothing special but because of equipment choices it doesn't need to be anything specia. I took the CaRx offline almost a year ago and have been dripping kalk for alk/cal needs. The whole tank has pretty much been on autopilot for over a year now. I haven't added any livestock but have ripped out a lot of Caps, they grow like the plague for me, I tossed out a 5 gallon bucket of them in Sept. or Oct., the next plague to be ripped out will be GSP which spawned last year and it has been growing crazy ever since.

I hope to have a little more time to devote to the tank this year and plan on adding a lot more SPS, right now it is just a tank, nothing special and requires very little intervention from me. I don't mind, I have been too busy to mess with it much.

 

[trueblackpercula]

In love with Pappone this stuff is driving my SPS and everything else in the tank Crazy. We should call it Complete liquid Enhancement Juice for Reef Tanks.


Well I made the Pappone this weekend and you can get about 800 ML out of the mix and it cost less the $20 bucks. I have been feeding 4mls 4 to 5 times per week to see if it will increase PE and feed the the rest of the tank. To my surprise this food new food source is simple Amazing and I would recommend it to anyone with a reef tank. everything is responding to it at a rapid rate. I am also checking my Nitrates and phosphates and they still have been reading Zero. I need to mention that my skimmer is pulling out what looks to be nasty dark green/blackish color skim-mate and its very nasty.

My sps have colored up i also see a lot more PODs and my Sand bed is crawling with life during the day and at night i have many worms stretching out of the sand bed. The look like what one company calls as Mama Mia Wormsâ„¢ popping up everywhere. I am very excited to report this information to all so that it may help with raising SPS.

Also I have gotten explosive growth of sponges and feather duster worms on the glass and in my over flow box. I took a few pictures and will post before and after photos in about 30 days to show the difference and i am so Sure it will be a BIG difference at that.

**** Don't even think twice about using this food is better then anything on the market that i have tried. I think the only thing that could be added would be freeze dried cyclopez and of course one pill of somatropin but not likely to get this.****

Enjoy its freaking amazing and worth the $20 bucks.....Who knows maybe I will start my own SPS feeding company with this stuff. 800MLs at 4MLs is like 200 feedings that's a cost of .10 cents per feeding.

One more thing to add and maybe its just me but I have an abundance of asternia starfish now.....Very cool in deed

 

[sahin]

In love with Pappone this stuff is driving my SPS and everything else in the tank Crazy. We should call it Complete liquid Enhancement Juice for Reef Tanks.


Well I made the Pappone this weekend and you can get about 800 ML out of the mix and it cost less the $20 bucks. I have been feeding 4mls 4 to 5 times per week to see if it will increase PE and feed the the rest of the tank. To my surprise this food new food source is simple Amazing and I would recommend it to anyone with a reef tank. everything is responding to it at a rapid rate. I am also checking my Nitrates and phosphates and they still have been reading Zero. I need to mention that my skimmer is pulling out what looks to be nasty dark green/blackish color skim-mate and its very nasty.

My sps have colored up i also see a lot more PODs and my Sand bed is crawling with life during the day and at night i have many worms stretching out of the sand bed. The look like what one company calls as Mama Mia Wormsâ„¢ popping up everywhere. I am very excited to report this information to all so that it may help with raising SPS.

Also I have gotten explosive growth of sponges and feather duster worms on the glass and in my over flow box. I took a few pictures and will post before and after photos in about 30 days to show the difference and i am so Sure it will be a BIG difference at that.

**** Don't even think twice about using this food is better then anything on the market that i have tried. I think the only thing that could be added would be freeze dried cyclopez and of course one pill of somatropin but not likely to get this.****

Enjoy its freaking amazing and worth the $20 bucks.....Who knows maybe I will start my own SPS feeding company with this stuff. 800MLs at 4MLs is like 200 feedings that's a cost of .10 cents per feeding.

One more thing to add and maybe its just me but I have an abundance of asternia starfish now.....Very cool in deed

Thats awesome mate. I am being lazy and not going to the supermarket to buy the fresh stuff I need...but I will do that sometime this week.

It all sounds like its going well for your tank.

Can you turn down the level of the Royal Blue LED's and then take photos of the corals? This will help remove a lot of that overly blue cast.