STN No Apparent Reason...Please ask questions

[Stolireef]

This is going to be a long post because I'm going to describe everything. Hopefully, this will help with a good diagnosis.

Problem: STN affecting a variety of SPS including torts, stags and tables and some hair algae
Setup:
Age: 11 months
110 with a 30 gal sump.
2x250W HQI 14K Hamilton Bulbs, 2 months old. 8 hours/day
2x54W T5 Actnics, 2 months old. 10 hours/day
Lifereef CA reactor
RO Skimmer running slightly wet
2xMP40's running at 70% on Reef Crest
1xTunze Turbelle 1095
Sicce Return pushing about 1000 gal/hr.
5 Stage Spectrapure RO/DI using their autotopoff
NeoMarine Salt
Reef Matrix Carbon in high flow area in bag
100 Micron Filter Sock changed daily

Water Parameters (appears stable means weekly tests are consistent within 5% either direction)
Temp: 79-81 degrees checked against two thermometers
Salinity: 1.025 (calibrated Refractometer to 35 PPT)
PH: 8.1 appears stable
KH: 9.5-10 appears stable
CA: 430 appears stable
Nitrates: <5
Phosphate: Undetectable
MG: 1340 appears stable

Maintenance:
Filter sock changed daily
H2O Change 10% weekly

Feeding:
Appx 1.5 cubes mix of Cyclopseeze/Forumula One and Two/Frozen Mysis
2 sq. inches of Nori (Green Marine Ocean Nutrition)
A couple of small pinches of Dainichi Marine FX (baby sinking)
Selcon 2ML 3x/week
2ML Phytofeast and Rotifeast 4x/week.

Stocking:
Fish: PB tang (3"), Yellow tang (3"), Coris Wrasse (2"), 2xPercula's (1.5" each), 2xBangaii Cards (<1" each), 2xLyretail Anthias (2" each).
Many snails, hermits and 3xQueen Conch.
All fish are very healthy and eating well.
Large number of SPS frags and one candycane, hammer, scoly, torch, far away from all SPS.

No apparent bugs (checked with magnifying glass)

My first thought is that my lighting period on the Halides is too long.

Would greatly appreciate any ideas. Sorry for the long post.

 

[lowman31]

Looking at the info you provided, I would guess it is a delayed reaction to new bulbs. Did you adjust the photoperiod when you first changed the bulbs? Also, do you run GAC or GFO? You could of had a phos spike or some other contaminant. Everything else looks great.

 

[Stolireef]

In early August, switched from Radions to MH/T5 combo. Photoperiod may have been too long with new setup. Just reduced to 6 hrs. on MH. Fingers crossed.

 

[karsseboom]

Have used a Turky baster to blast your acros? You can't see Aefw since try blend in with the tissue color.

 

[Stolireef]

Do the baster thing about once each week. Hand gets tired after about fifteen to twenty minutes of it. That said, I've never seen AEFW. I know what red bugs look like and assumed that under a magnifying glass, AEFW would be visible. Then again, I think it's just that I haven't sacrificed sufficient Scotch to the reef gods. I usually consume it before it hits the tank. Live an learn...

 

[Acronic]

Then again, I think it's just that I haven't sacrificed sufficient Scotch to the reef gods. I usually consume it before it hits the tank. Live an learn...

Lol this is definitely the issue! Quickly go out and buy a bottle of Lagavulin 16 year old, place a frag of the coral in the middle of a circle of cash. Preferably 100 dollar bills. Pour the entire contents of the bottle on the frag and cash while chanting praise to the reef gods. When you feel the "chill" run down your spine, immediately set fire to the frag and cash. You now have the blessings of the gods to grow SPS. (keep this between us, i dont want to be ostracized by the gods)

 

[cbonito]

LOL Problem solved.

 

[jroovers]

Lol this is definitely the issue! Quickly go out and buy a bottle of Lagavulin 16 year old, place a frag of the coral in the middle of a circle of cash. Preferably 100 dollar bills. Pour the entire contents of the bottle on the frag and cash while chanting praise to the reef gods. When you feel the "chill" run down your spine, immediately set fire to the frag and cash. You now have the blessings of the gods to grow SPS. (keep this between us, i dont want to be ostracized by the gods)

That is too funny.

Could be light, but seems it would be a "delayed" reaction, unless you used something recently that enhanced water clarity (e.g. Chemi Clean). If I had to guess, sounds like an Alk issue possibly. When you say "appears stable", how confident are you that your parameters are in fact stable? What test kits are you using? How does the dosing occur and where in the system? Is it possible swings are occuring?

 

[Stolireef]

Jroovers:

Dosing is via CA Reactor. I have not tested Alk throughout the day and I think that's my next step. I typically complete a battery of tests including Nitrate, Alk, Ca, Mg, and Phosphates weekly and stability refers to the fact that these numbers stay very consistent.

The lighting switch is my primary suspect at the moment. At the beginning of August, I switched from a pair of Radions to an MH/T5 combo and thought that I could run the Halides for an 8 hour photoperiod. My suspicion is that the period was too long especially since the period for the Radions only ran at nearly full intensity for about 4 hours per day. I think I may have underestimated the strengh of the Halides with really good reflectors (Hamilton Belize unit).

I'm going to start testing Alk and PH about every two hours (at least while I'm awake) to see if there is any significant swing over the course of a day. I do expect some PH change but not very big.

Thanks for the feedback.

 

[jroovers]

Jroovers:

Dosing is via CA Reactor. I have not tested Alk throughout the day and I think that's my next step. I typically complete a battery of tests including Nitrate, Alk, Ca, Mg, and Phosphates weekly and stability refers to the fact that these numbers stay very consistent.

The lighting switch is my primary suspect at the moment. At the beginning of August, I switched from a pair of Radions to an MH/T5 combo and thought that I could run the Halides for an 8 hour photoperiod. My suspicion is that the period was too long especially since the period for the Radions only ran at nearly full intensity for about 4 hours per day. I think I may have underestimated the strengh of the Halides with really good reflectors (Hamilton Belize unit).

I'm going to start testing Alk and PH about every two hours (at least while I'm awake) to see if there is any significant swing over the course of a day. I do expect some PH change but not very big.

Thanks for the feedback.

In my experience negative effects from light happen pretty quickly and it is usually evident immediately... but what you described above could be a plausible explanation. If so, Lugol's (i.e. iodine) is supposed to be helpful for light shocked corals (follow dosing instructions carefully).

On the topic of testing - you are getting consistent results, that is good - however, it isn't much good if your test kits aren't accurate - maybe double check the reliability of the tests you use. Also, you shouldn't have different alk during the day compared to the night unless you are dosing large quantities of alk at only one point in the day - the parameters should be stable. If there is one pararmenter you want to know with as much certainty as possible IMO with keeping SPS, it is alk. pH will apparently swing from day to night and in your case sounds worth testing - I've never tested pH however so I can't help you there (I do keep my fug on a reverse light cycle however which is supposed to help minimize swings)

 

[tmb22]

Are you using calibration fluid to calibrate your refractometer? Using RO/DI water to calibrate will give you wildly inaccurate readings. This could be your issue if you're not using calibration fluid to calibrate the refractometer.

 

[Stolireef]

Jroovers:
Just picked up some new kits this weekend and the results haven't changed. I was using API so I figured I'd get a different brand (went with Elos, holy moly $$) so at least I can rule test error out. I started testing Dkh every two hours earlier today and so far so good. Dead on at 9.5 on every test so far (three of them). Although this tank is fairly new (8 months), I've been in the hobby for years and my experience is that a well dialed in reactor keeps things pretty stable unless there is a malfunction (and then, anything goes).

I'm trying to be very controlled about the diagnosis and so I'm trying to only change one thing at a time. I will say that my lighting diagnosis is at least suspect since the STN seems to be starting at the underside of some of the corals while it is on the tips of others. I would think that bleaching is a top down event.

TMB: Always calibrate with 35 ppt solution. I agree about the distilled water. I do use that as a second test but I've had this refractometer for several years and it's pretty reliable. I tend to go with higher end equipment for just this reason.

 

[Stolireef]

Oh, and I'm going to do the Scotch rites this evening. I figure it can't hurt and besides, it sounds alot like Vodka dosing when I explain it to my wife.

 

[acroholicreefer]

Any pictures of the corals? Just from looking at your parameters, I would say that low nutrients could be the issue but would need more info to be sure. What are you using to measure phosphates? Phosphates should be detectable to some degree, depending on how you are testing. Acros will live in higher nutrient environments, but they will brown out and stop growing.

I would remove the carbon and gfo if you are running it.

 

[hobbby3]

I'm workin on a similar issue. I'm on well water and suspect I have contamination that my RO/DI setup isnt able to strip out. Do you use well water?

So I'm getting a different RO/DI water source to test with. Starting with daily 20% water changes over the next 7 days starting Wednesday.

 

[Stolireef]

Hobby:

Use city water and 5 stage RO/DI with recently calibrated TDS at 0 on output.

I think I found the problem that correlates both in time and symptoms. About three weeks ago, I ran out of carbon and the store was out of my regular brand (Matrix). Instead, they sold me Carbonit X3. Turns out that this is meant for only very short term use (remove after 24 hours or only use 2 hours per day). My fault for not reading the label. Store's fault for telling me that this is a good/better replacement for Matrix (totally different use).

Lot's of water changes in my future and now back to Matrix. Hope this solves the problem but I'm still counting on the Scotch sacrifice as a backup plan.

 

[hobbby3]

Wow didn't realize they even had short term carbon (I'm still pretty new). I'll check my carbon when I get home as well.

 

[xxxduke62xxx]

if i were you to be on the safe side i would remove one of the frags and dip it just to see if any worms come off. in my expierence while you may see an adult worm swimming around after you baste your coral you might miss it since when you baste alot of debris flies off as well and there is no way you are going to be able to see any babies