The Ultimate DIY Rocks!
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jasonh
New member
Wow, I can't believe I'm at the end of the thread...almost makes me sad, lol. I've just spent the last week and a half reading all 131 pages of this thing, and I must say, I've learned a lot.
I'm going to make my first batch of rocks soon I think. I was at HD yesterday, and they have portland type I-II-V Low alkali (5 is sulphate resistant I think? Good for marine environments?), but I think I might want to try the Quickwall stuff. I would rather have white, and a quicker cure/kure is ok by me. Being in an apartment, it's pretty tough to do these DIY things sometimes. I would like to try the Jiffy Rock method, but I don't know if my wife would like that very much...
I am going to use Perlite as one aggregate. I'm not sure what else I'd like to use. I'm in the middle of the city, so finding a feed store is quite a drive. I'll eventually get to one to see if I can find some OS and/or calcium carbonate. I do have some lighter colored pool filter sand left over from some planted FW stuff (about 25lbs), but it's silica based, so I don't know about that. I haven't decided on if I'll use salt or not. It's really a great idea, but I don't know how easy the release would be in a little apartment.
great thread everybody, keep up the good work
I'm going to make my first batch of rocks soon I think. I was at HD yesterday, and they have portland type I-II-V Low alkali (5 is sulphate resistant I think? Good for marine environments?), but I think I might want to try the Quickwall stuff. I would rather have white, and a quicker cure/kure is ok by me. Being in an apartment, it's pretty tough to do these DIY things sometimes. I would like to try the Jiffy Rock method, but I don't know if my wife would like that very much...
I am going to use Perlite as one aggregate. I'm not sure what else I'd like to use. I'm in the middle of the city, so finding a feed store is quite a drive. I'll eventually get to one to see if I can find some OS and/or calcium carbonate. I do have some lighter colored pool filter sand left over from some planted FW stuff (about 25lbs), but it's silica based, so I don't know about that. I haven't decided on if I'll use salt or not. It's really a great idea, but I don't know how easy the release would be in a little apartment.
great thread everybody, keep up the good work
Insane Reefer
New member
Welcome to the thread, Jason!
If it helps, Travis was in a small apartment (with wife and rug-rats) when he made his first salted rock. Put something like an old pair of nylons/pantyhose in the bath-tub drain to prevent crap going down the drain helps, or you can go with the boiling route - I find with boiling that I can release the salt in 12 hours or so. But that was one bonus with using salt - at worst, if it doesn't all release upfront, it is just salt - just might mean we have to keep an eye on salinity for a while.
You're in Phoenix, man! You can't tell me there aren't half a dozen feed-stores within a stones throw of you, lol.
JK, but really, make the trip, you'll be happy for the oyster shell and calcium carb sand. Added to the perlite, it makes a great, porous rock.
The cement you've found sounds great. I've not tried the Jiffy Rock method with the fast set cements, as there isn't much point - the fast sets pH balance pretty much in the same time-frame as the Jiffy Rock (with traditional portland) does. If you do decide to try a batch of Jiffy Rock, PM me a email addy and I will send you the info. If you need an argument to sway your wife, tell her it will allow you to clean her oven spotless (and do so once the oven is cool to the touch!). The moisture loosens any baked on grime and it wipes away just like you used harsh chemicals.
Good luck, and keep us posted with what you do and post some pictures
If it helps, Travis was in a small apartment (with wife and rug-rats) when he made his first salted rock. Put something like an old pair of nylons/pantyhose in the bath-tub drain to prevent crap going down the drain helps, or you can go with the boiling route - I find with boiling that I can release the salt in 12 hours or so. But that was one bonus with using salt - at worst, if it doesn't all release upfront, it is just salt - just might mean we have to keep an eye on salinity for a while.
You're in Phoenix, man! You can't tell me there aren't half a dozen feed-stores within a stones throw of you, lol.
JK, but really, make the trip, you'll be happy for the oyster shell and calcium carb sand. Added to the perlite, it makes a great, porous rock.
The cement you've found sounds great. I've not tried the Jiffy Rock method with the fast set cements, as there isn't much point - the fast sets pH balance pretty much in the same time-frame as the Jiffy Rock (with traditional portland) does. If you do decide to try a batch of Jiffy Rock, PM me a email addy and I will send you the info. If you need an argument to sway your wife, tell her it will allow you to clean her oven spotless (and do so once the oven is cool to the touch!). The moisture loosens any baked on grime and it wipes away just like you used harsh chemicals.
Good luck, and keep us posted with what you do and post some pictures
jasonh
New member
Insane Reefer, yeah I'm in Phoenix, but I'm more in the central/richer area, so a feed store is a bit of a drive....probably 45min one way. I just need a chance to get over there. I'm hoping to find something similar to the "hard shell" that was posted by someone earlier, especially if I end up using the white cement.
Anyway, I will try the Jiffy rock method if I go with the plain portland. If I use the quick setting stuff, I don't think there would be much of a reason to. While I was typing my last post, my wife looked over my shoulder and said she didn't care if I used the oven as long as I don't set fire to the place
As for the salt soaks...we only have one bathroom and I'd hate for that tub to be out of commission, so I still haven't decided. If I can find a cheap stock pot for a couple bucks, I'll use the salt and boil it out.
Also, I haven't seen any updates from the person using the "glass block mortar." I'm curious as to how that went. I saw this stuff in HD, and on the back there are some lengthy cautions about not putting it cured or uncured in waterways with plant or animal life, etc. That does not look like it would be a good solution
Anyway, I will try the Jiffy rock method if I go with the plain portland. If I use the quick setting stuff, I don't think there would be much of a reason to. While I was typing my last post, my wife looked over my shoulder and said she didn't care if I used the oven as long as I don't set fire to the place
As for the salt soaks...we only have one bathroom and I'd hate for that tub to be out of commission, so I still haven't decided. If I can find a cheap stock pot for a couple bucks, I'll use the salt and boil it out.
Also, I haven't seen any updates from the person using the "glass block mortar." I'm curious as to how that went. I saw this stuff in HD, and on the back there are some lengthy cautions about not putting it cured or uncured in waterways with plant or animal life, etc. That does not look like it would be a good solution
Insane Reefer
New member
Living in a busy, but small city, I forget about urban commutes; if it takes more than 20 minutes to get someplace here, it is usually because some college student got into a wreck and snarled traffic.
Yeah, Sunkool found that. I've had chickens on and off for most of my life, and live in Missouri to boot, and I have never seen that stuff until he posted it. I've since called, and my 3 local (in city limits) feed stores were clueless.
Fire is not an issue, lol. You're no more likely to set fire to the place baking the rock then you are roasting a turkey. Plus, she gets a free oven cleaning - it is a win-win situation for herWhile I was typing my last post, my wife looked over my shoulder and said she didn't care if I used the oven as long as I don't set fire to the place
Az's idea is probably the best, as far as time verses effort goes - though Salvation Army and Good Will are also places to look, or garage sales, if you do those.
Also, I haven't seen any updates from the person using the "glass block mortar." I'm curious as to how that went. I saw this stuff in HD, and on the back there are some lengthy cautions about not putting it cured or uncured in waterways with plant or animal life, etc. That does not look like it would be a good solution
Agreed - though it is possible their mix didn't have the cautions on the bag, not all products are made the same, but that is just another reason to stick with traditional portland (or fast setting) - we know it is safe.
I get all excited for you noobs; I remember what it was like the first time I made rock, and how excited, but nervous I was. :mixed:
And back when I made my first rock, the only online help there was were the old BBS's - I used Genie at the time. And people didn't sit on them like we tend to do with the forums. If you got stuck, it might be days before someone replied to the post. Ah - those were the days...
Anyhoo, have fun with it, and keep us posted on what you do
Neptune777
Premium Member
Just a FYI everyone.....I have found Quikrete Quickwall to be very brittle compared to plain old Portland Type I/II from Quikrete. I have not tried straight plain white Portland Type I although it is available locally (much more expensive than standard gray). Quikwall does not seem to like the rocksalt (even when mixed a bit dry) or other aggregates like CC. The end product is just too crumbly (weeks later) no matter how wet or dry the initial mix.....has anyone else experienced this?
I made a batch last night using gray Type I and man is this stuff strong!!!!!! Huge difference from the Quikwall .....It is in the oven right now for a fast cure/Kure.
I made a batch last night using gray Type I and man is this stuff strong!!!!!! Huge difference from the Quikwall .....It is in the oven right now for a fast cure/Kure.
Yinepu
Member
I couldn't find the quikwall, but did find the quikrete hydraulic water stop.
So I made my first rock with it yesterday. It seems as hard as the regular portland (i mixed it 50/50 with oyster shell). I'll know for sure in a couple of days. So no problems there as far as I am concerned.
So I went ahead and made two more today. the first one will be ready for a soaking & ph test tuesday afternoon... so I'll let you know how it goes.. so far I like the way it looks, though it was a little crumbly when I was working with it (the first batch needed a biit more water).
the second batch I made today. I added a little more water and it was better to work with. it does set up FAST though... I don't think it even made it to the two minute mark!
So I made my first rock with it yesterday. It seems as hard as the regular portland (i mixed it 50/50 with oyster shell). I'll know for sure in a couple of days. So no problems there as far as I am concerned.
So I went ahead and made two more today. the first one will be ready for a soaking & ph test tuesday afternoon... so I'll let you know how it goes.. so far I like the way it looks, though it was a little crumbly when I was working with it (the first batch needed a biit more water).
the second batch I made today. I added a little more water and it was better to work with. it does set up FAST though... I don't think it even made it to the two minute mark!
andbigdaddy2
New member
Not sure if this will work but i was at a LFS and they had some Feather rock that someone had drilled holes into and cut ledges and caves in to it looked pretty good it was way over priced a large piece was 80 bucks. A huge chunk of feather rock is like 6 bucks at HD. What i was thinking was get a piece sculpt it then use the salt and concrete method on the rock completely covering the rock the reason for this is less concrete = less curing time and you can make large custom rocks that weight almost nothing .
Insane Reefer
New member
What is Feather Rock?
EDIT:
Ah - I see with google (I love you google!).
Volcanic rock is odd and can be risky. Some, that is considered "safe", has been found to grow nothing on it, even when placed in the ocean for several years - not even coralline. Others, have too many heavy metal's, etc, making them unsafe, esp for a reef/saltwater environment.
EDIT:
Ah - I see with google (I love you google!).
Volcanic rock is odd and can be risky. Some, that is considered "safe", has been found to grow nothing on it, even when placed in the ocean for several years - not even coralline. Others, have too many heavy metal's, etc, making them unsafe, esp for a reef/saltwater environment.
andbigdaddy2
New member
Its a grey volcanic rock that is very lite its almost like holding a rock made of styrofaom http://www.kellermaterial.com/Feather_Rock.jpg
It's in the garden section of HD and Lowes
It's in the garden section of HD and Lowes
andbigdaddy2
New member
Has anyone cut open a piece of DIY rock and seen if there is any life in the rock its self after being in a tank or are all the benifits on the surface as unlike real LR where life is all through the rock?
andbigdaddy2
New member
if thats the case it wouldnt be a benefit to have a solid low weight core as it wont grow bacteria and small critters. So much for that.
Neptune777
Premium Member
I will now step upon my soap box............Wait...I think I hear applause....no it's just crickets:
IMO "Live Rock" is waaay overrated. Many of the macro organisms are dead upon arrival (questionably beneficial to begin with). What is most important is the bacteria that do all the dirty work in our reefs. DIY rock with the right porosity will have just as much good bacteria over time as "Live Rock" without introducing pests like aiptasia, majanos, red planaria, bryopsis, turf algae, etc. etc. etc....it goes on forever.
Personally.....IMO I think the reef industry (large "Live Rock" suppliers) perpetuate the "need" for rock out of the ocean because they can charge a premium for it and it funds the local economy where they reside (Fiji, Tonga etc.). There are only a few things I need in/on my rock that needs to be seeded from a small supply of ocean "live rock": 1) Bacteria....2)Pods.....3) corraline 'cause it's pretty....everything else is not needed in a captive reef (again IMO)......and they die off over time anyway because the captive reef does not contain all the needs of the the vast variety of organisms that hitchhike on "live rock".
The only caveat of using 90% DIY or base rock is you need to take more time to allow the tank to stabilize and mature.
Neptune777
Premium Member
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10494810#post10494810 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jasonh
If someone were to do this, I would just use styrofoam or great stuff instead. Easier to sculpt, etc, and less risky to the reef
Some.....again I say some not all....have experienced issues using styrofoam and great stuff because it breaks down over time in water. Also, making Portland cement rocks is a snap...couldn't be easier!
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