Too many ball valves?

[don_chuwish]

So I have a dilemma. Putting together this return manifold I can't decide if I really need all three of the 1" Cepex ball valves. Maybe eliminate the two on right and left and replace with unions? Or keep them and skip the one at the bottom of the Tee? Pump is a Waveline DC-6000 so I can adjust total flow with the controller.
Opinions? Thanks!

 

[iced98lx]

Personally I wouldn't have any ball valves in that setup- going to turn off hte pump let it drain back and go dry before you work on the pump anyway right?

Only reason for right/left is if you felt you'll want to adjust flow to each differently, or to create some back pressure for the items on the manifold...

 

[cilyjr]

Only reason for right/left is if you felt you'll want to adjust flow to each differently, or to create some back pressure for the items on the manifold...

this.

 

[don_chuwish]

Thanks much! I see your points. I may have 4 valves up for sale when I'm all done. I'd originally planned on having 3 on the drains and just the one on the return but I've cut down to just a gate on the full siphon and now maybe zero on the return.

 

[Jade5051]

I had a setup like this on a previous system. My pump powered the manifold and the main return to the tank. I never adjusted the valves on the left/right of the manifold. They always stayed wide open. You probably don't need the the one on the left because you have a controllable DC pump. The one on the right is nice for back pressure.

 

[reefer1970]

That's what she said?

 

[Zwickm]

FYI - on my 150, I have 5 x 1" cepex ball valves in my return manifold that power my reactors and two for spare so I can add equipment as needed. It's powered by a DC Waveline 10000 which pushes 2850gph. I always think it's better to add more then you think you'll need because it's hard to add after the fact. I also put 2 Spears true union check valves on my return to stop back flow.

 

[don_chuwish]

Check valves, check.

The two 1/2" valves on the manifold are for 1) carbon & GFO canisters, and 2) to feed a low flow section of the sump. I don't see that I'll need to create back pressure for those, but I have no experience with this stuff so I could certainly be wrong!

 

[RocketEngineer]

Check valves do not function well in a reef aquarium because the critters that grow in the system also grow on the seat of the valve, preventing it from sealing. This can occur at just about any time which means even cleaning them regularly doesn't ensure they will work properly. Given this, I recommend you remove them.

In your original picture, the one valve at the inlet is not needed. The two valves going back to the sump are definitely necessary as with them the water will try to go through those instead of fighting up 3-4 more feet of vertical head pressure. On my setup, the valves to the refugium and GFO reactor are almost closed in order to send the majority of the water to the display. If I open them all the way the water doesn't make it to the display at all. The two valves going to the returns are optional IMO.

HTH,

 

[don_chuwish]

Thanks Rocket - yes the 1/2" valves must stay for sure, I need to adjust flow rate no matter what the pump is pushing.
I understand what you mean about the check valves but I think I'll keep them - I've got a union and MPT adapter glued on to both of them at this point so I'm sure BRS doesn't want them back! I'll just have to clean occasionally. Also good practice to keep the inlet tubes at waterline so the back siphon breaks quickly. I like redundancy.
So it seems the consensus is lose all three of the 1" Cepex valves though. Which is fine, I'm pretty sure they can be sold easily enough.
Hopefully I get this put together today. Will post pics later!

 

[ca1ore]

Other than providing no reliable back flow prevention, check valves put unnecessary back pressure on your pump. Perhaps you have headroom to spare, but I'd get rid of them.

 

[hllywd]

Other than providing no reliable back flow prevention, check valves put unnecessary back pressure on your pump. Perhaps you have headroom to spare, but I'd get rid of them.

Ditto. IMO you're better without. They're a point of potential failure from day 1.

 

[don_chuwish]

Hmnnn, making me think. There's other reasons to redo the legs from return manifold to bulkhead, but it'll mean scrapping some fittings and buying new. Of course it's always better to make that choice now than after the tank is stocked!
So thanks to this thread I'm finding over $170 worth of plumbing parts I never should have bought! Live and learn.

 

[don_chuwish]

On to some progress pics. Everything is put together in a way that I can get it apart and move the whole thing. I know making "exact fit" holes in the back of the stand can be trouble prone but it's going to be seen, so I want it tidy.

Manifold installed and secured. Drains were fun to get "just so".

 

[don_chuwish]

OK, so after some water tests over the weekend I think I'll ditch the check valves after all. Means redoing everything from the manifold up, but better now than later. Two things I realized over and above the good advice here: a) they're loud, when the pump shuts off they CLUNK! closed annoyingly and b) I don't need them - the siphon through the returns will break before the overflow is done draining. So another $20 or so worth of fittings & pipe is sitting in a box waiting for me.
My sump design changed a little too, so my carefully placed Tee for the pump is now not quite right. Rather than redo it all I just put in a 45 and called it good.

 

[don_chuwish]

Return bits redone.

I had the hardware store cut threads into some 3/4 pipe so I could use threaded unions. I actually used 2 threaded and 2 slip - trading halves.

Spray painted some street elbows:

Assembled the transition from manifold to risers:

Then put it together:

Much more tidy, thanks for the tips!