Robb in Austin
New member
Oops. My bad.
Triple-S Fish Ranch - 1700gal 164†x 48†x 56†SPS peninsula build
- Thread starter pmrogers
- Start date
Oops. My bad.
Aquascape tweaking, in tank flow
Aquascape tweaking, in tank flow
As last seen in post #431, the central arch wasn't really an arch, more of a straight line diagonal ramp between columns, the problem being that the lighter left side kept sliding outward under the weight of the arch rocks. Timfish proposed a simple fix in the form of 2 acrylic tabs glued to the bottom of the tank, and it worked out perfectly to maintain the arch shape.
Sea Swirls
What should have a been a straightforward 1 or 2 hour plumbing job to install the sea swirls turned into a day and half while I battled my OCD trying to get to an acceptably neat and tidy setup.
Sea Swirls Installed
Still need to hit the side outlet 90's with a coat of black Krylon Fusion. I'm a bit disappointed that side outlet 90s are required: was hoping there'd be a way to mod the Sea Swirls for 180 degree rotation. Original plan called for each swirl to continuously receive ~3250gph and sweep 180 degrees, but they are locked in to 90 degrees rotation. Now, with flow spread over two outlets each, I'm concerned there may not be sufficient flow to agitate all of the water surface area. Backup plan is to install an actuated ball valve on the return pump and alternate directing all 6500gph of return to one swirl at a time. Very much hoping this isn't necessary since I like the idea of the swirls crossing paths and creating especially chaotic flow in the middle of the tank.
Front Left Sea Swirl
Flex PVC to minimize use of elbows. Vacuum system 6' hose with quick release for vacuuming wand in upper left.
Sea Swirl Closeup of Plumbing and Power Cord finish out
Will apply a dab of silicone around the power supply plug before wetting the system.
Close Loop Output Manifold
I initially built the closed loop output manifold using standard PVC fittings. Even making a minimal loop of 90 elbows with holes tapped for loc line, it was huge, nothing that could reasonably hide in the aquascape. Timfish had the great idea to build a custom PVC manifold box to screw directly onto the bulkhead fitting. Much more discrete!
Manifold Close Up
Manifold will receive ~6000gph from an Abyzz 420 located under the tank
Manifold viewed from front
Relatively discrete. It should blend in fairly nicely after we glop a bit of aragacrete on it.
Manifold viewed from end of tank
Still to come in the flow department: 4 or 5 Tunze Streams mounted in a column on the overflow wall. May also add a Master Stream 6508 if the small streams are hopelessly inadequate for the 14' throw. Really hoping to avoid the Master Stream, though, as it is too huge for this style of aquascape. I'd feel much more confident about the smaller streams working out if Tunze offered a successor to the 6305.
Aquascape tweaking, in tank flow
As last seen in post #431, the central arch wasn't really an arch, more of a straight line diagonal ramp between columns, the problem being that the lighter left side kept sliding outward under the weight of the arch rocks. Timfish proposed a simple fix in the form of 2 acrylic tabs glued to the bottom of the tank, and it worked out perfectly to maintain the arch shape.
Sea Swirls
What should have a been a straightforward 1 or 2 hour plumbing job to install the sea swirls turned into a day and half while I battled my OCD trying to get to an acceptably neat and tidy setup.
Sea Swirls Installed
Still need to hit the side outlet 90's with a coat of black Krylon Fusion. I'm a bit disappointed that side outlet 90s are required: was hoping there'd be a way to mod the Sea Swirls for 180 degree rotation. Original plan called for each swirl to continuously receive ~3250gph and sweep 180 degrees, but they are locked in to 90 degrees rotation. Now, with flow spread over two outlets each, I'm concerned there may not be sufficient flow to agitate all of the water surface area. Backup plan is to install an actuated ball valve on the return pump and alternate directing all 6500gph of return to one swirl at a time. Very much hoping this isn't necessary since I like the idea of the swirls crossing paths and creating especially chaotic flow in the middle of the tank.
Front Left Sea Swirl
Flex PVC to minimize use of elbows. Vacuum system 6' hose with quick release for vacuuming wand in upper left.
Sea Swirl Closeup of Plumbing and Power Cord finish out
Will apply a dab of silicone around the power supply plug before wetting the system.
Close Loop Output Manifold
I initially built the closed loop output manifold using standard PVC fittings. Even making a minimal loop of 90 elbows with holes tapped for loc line, it was huge, nothing that could reasonably hide in the aquascape. Timfish had the great idea to build a custom PVC manifold box to screw directly onto the bulkhead fitting. Much more discrete!
Manifold Close Up
Manifold will receive ~6000gph from an Abyzz 420 located under the tank
Manifold viewed from front
Relatively discrete. It should blend in fairly nicely after we glop a bit of aragacrete on it.
Manifold viewed from end of tank
Still to come in the flow department: 4 or 5 Tunze Streams mounted in a column on the overflow wall. May also add a Master Stream 6508 if the small streams are hopelessly inadequate for the 14' throw. Really hoping to avoid the Master Stream, though, as it is too huge for this style of aquascape. I'd feel much more confident about the smaller streams working out if Tunze offered a successor to the 6305.
More fish room plumbing work
More fish room plumbing work
Got most of the perimeter plumbing installed, allowing me to move the reservoirs back into position. One observation from this: if you like nice neat straight lines in your plumbing, don't order 20' lengths of schedule 80 from a commercial construction supplier. This was the most warped, beat up and generally homely pipe I've seen. I'm pretty sure my blood pressure went up several points and/or I'm talking to myself even more than I used to after fighting to get 160' of it on the walls in somewhat straight lays. It boiled down to a laser level, pipe clamps, and brute force. I'm doubly glad I had the walls backed with plywood to allow for strong clamp mounts anywhere and everywhere.
Perimeter Plumbing Started
The especially crooked bits at the ends will be straightened out with additional clamps after the termination fittings are attached. A base cabinet with counter top will be installed on the right wall to hold all reactors and potentially a cryptic zone tank or refugium.
RO/DI and Salt Mixing Tanks
As a reminder, the small cone bottom tank is where I'll dump in the dry salt. This is to save me from having to schlep 60 pound buckets of salt up a ladder to pour into the 6" wide top opening of the saltwater reservoir. Instead, I will dump the salt bucket into the lower, wide-mouth cone tank in the middle, turn the valve below the cone to allow water to flow up into the mixing tank, then turn on the high power pump to draw the salt slurry and pump it up into the main reservoir through an eductor.
Unglued Prototype of Water Change Tank Plumbing
Starting trying to work out how the plumbing will work for the mixing station.
Things are going to be very tight, as this photo has only the pumps for the saltwater side. Plan calls for 2 pumps on each reservoir: one high power and one low power: high power will be used for mixing and for transport from RO -> Salt reservoir, low power to feed the UV reactor on each reservoir. Reason for the separate pumps is to reduce power usage and noise. Only the low power pumps will run continuously.
I wish I felt more confident that this will work as planned. I have a concern that the head pressure of the main reservoir tank will overcome the suction of the mixing pump: in other words, when I turn on the mixing pump, instead of drawing the slurry in and draining the cone bottom tank, it will just recirculate the main reservoir while the cone tank continues to fill and overflow. If this happens I will have to find a way to fit in another valve between reservoir and mixing pump, before the cone bottom input.
Close Up of Reservoir UVs
18 watt UV units for each reservoir tank. Valve and flow meter on each to ensure optimal flow rate for the sterilizers. These are fully glued, taped and siliconed, ready for water.
Return Pumps
More playing around with unglued plumbing to get a feel for layout. Large pump in back is the return pump for the display. 3HP Pentair Sparus variable speed, capable of ~160gpm into 34' of head and friction loss. Abyzz 420 in the middle for feeding the skimmer 70gpm. Abyzz 200 in foreground for feeding reactors and optional additional tanks (cryptic, DSB, fuge, mangroves, etc).
Need to find a way to squeeze in a bit of flex pipe or silicone on the Sparus. As pictured it will likely cause quite a vibration hum in the sump.
More fish room plumbing work
Got most of the perimeter plumbing installed, allowing me to move the reservoirs back into position. One observation from this: if you like nice neat straight lines in your plumbing, don't order 20' lengths of schedule 80 from a commercial construction supplier. This was the most warped, beat up and generally homely pipe I've seen. I'm pretty sure my blood pressure went up several points and/or I'm talking to myself even more than I used to after fighting to get 160' of it on the walls in somewhat straight lays. It boiled down to a laser level, pipe clamps, and brute force. I'm doubly glad I had the walls backed with plywood to allow for strong clamp mounts anywhere and everywhere.
Perimeter Plumbing Started
The especially crooked bits at the ends will be straightened out with additional clamps after the termination fittings are attached. A base cabinet with counter top will be installed on the right wall to hold all reactors and potentially a cryptic zone tank or refugium.
RO/DI and Salt Mixing Tanks
As a reminder, the small cone bottom tank is where I'll dump in the dry salt. This is to save me from having to schlep 60 pound buckets of salt up a ladder to pour into the 6" wide top opening of the saltwater reservoir. Instead, I will dump the salt bucket into the lower, wide-mouth cone tank in the middle, turn the valve below the cone to allow water to flow up into the mixing tank, then turn on the high power pump to draw the salt slurry and pump it up into the main reservoir through an eductor.
Unglued Prototype of Water Change Tank Plumbing
Starting trying to work out how the plumbing will work for the mixing station.
Things are going to be very tight, as this photo has only the pumps for the saltwater side. Plan calls for 2 pumps on each reservoir: one high power and one low power: high power will be used for mixing and for transport from RO -> Salt reservoir, low power to feed the UV reactor on each reservoir. Reason for the separate pumps is to reduce power usage and noise. Only the low power pumps will run continuously.
I wish I felt more confident that this will work as planned. I have a concern that the head pressure of the main reservoir tank will overcome the suction of the mixing pump: in other words, when I turn on the mixing pump, instead of drawing the slurry in and draining the cone bottom tank, it will just recirculate the main reservoir while the cone tank continues to fill and overflow. If this happens I will have to find a way to fit in another valve between reservoir and mixing pump, before the cone bottom input.
Close Up of Reservoir UVs
18 watt UV units for each reservoir tank. Valve and flow meter on each to ensure optimal flow rate for the sterilizers. These are fully glued, taped and siliconed, ready for water.
Return Pumps
More playing around with unglued plumbing to get a feel for layout. Large pump in back is the return pump for the display. 3HP Pentair Sparus variable speed, capable of ~160gpm into 34' of head and friction loss. Abyzz 420 in the middle for feeding the skimmer 70gpm. Abyzz 200 in foreground for feeding reactors and optional additional tanks (cryptic, DSB, fuge, mangroves, etc).
Need to find a way to squeeze in a bit of flex pipe or silicone on the Sparus. As pictured it will likely cause quite a vibration hum in the sump.
loweryster
New member
Following this fantastic thread. Where did you find the Abyzz pumps?
acesq
Premium Member
I haven't visited in a while and all I can say is NICE!!! Well thought out, well executed. With respect to your Sea Swirl issue, you might think about stepping down the T outlets a dimension (1.5" to 1") to create better velocity. I have 3000 gph coming out of a 1" Mocean and it is a pretty powerful flow.
Notjohnwayne
New member
Holy crap
Paul,
Remember you need to get at that lower UV bulb fairly regularly. Might be hard to get at behind that tank. Make sure you can drain the UV housings easily as well for cleaning the inner crystal sleave without making a mess
If there is any way to drill a new hole and bulk head in your sump so that the main return pump does not have those 2x hard 90's right in front of it, your pump will thank you
Remember you need to get at that lower UV bulb fairly regularly. Might be hard to get at behind that tank. Make sure you can drain the UV housings easily as well for cleaning the inner crystal sleave without making a mess
If there is any way to drill a new hole and bulk head in your sump so that the main return pump does not have those 2x hard 90's right in front of it, your pump will thank you
I think your salt mixing will work well. My plan was close to this, but had a few extra 1/4 turn valves to prevent the blackflow, like you said, and just recirculating the water.
Basically 1/4 vale off and the pump will suck in the slurry and push it, Then just open the valve back and continue to push the slurry with water. Just open the valve again and let the water flow back in to flush out any that is left over a few times.
Good documentation so far. Thanks and look forward to seeing what is next.
Basically 1/4 vale off and the pump will suck in the slurry and push it, Then just open the valve back and continue to push the slurry with water. Just open the valve again and let the water flow back in to flush out any that is left over a few times.
Good documentation so far. Thanks and look forward to seeing what is next.
McGarnicle
New member
What an amazing tank and house, I can't wait to see future updates!
biodegraded
New member
When I saw the perimeter pipe I thought you had used flex pipe. I can't believe that is actually sch 80 hard line!
I second the thought to make sure you can easily get to the UV fixtures for maintenance. I have an Emperor Aquatics 40 W on my QT system and I did not make easy access. As a result I tend to service it less frequently than I should.
You're lucky to have Timfish as a wing man. He has provided a lot of good ideas. I have no idea what that closed loop manifold started as unless a plastic model of the Pentagon, but it looks like it'll do the trick for you.
Thanks for the update.
I second the thought to make sure you can easily get to the UV fixtures for maintenance. I have an Emperor Aquatics 40 W on my QT system and I did not make easy access. As a result I tend to service it less frequently than I should.
You're lucky to have Timfish as a wing man. He has provided a lot of good ideas. I have no idea what that closed loop manifold started as unless a plastic model of the Pentagon, but it looks like it'll do the trick for you.
Thanks for the update.
JGxIronman
New member
Amazing and mind blowing
leslie hempel
Member
wow great build!
dahenley
New member
suggestion for salt mixing tank?
(this is just me throwing out suggestions. they might be usable and might be crap….. but i just wanted to throw out some in case it helps????)
Why not have a pip going from the holding tank to a tee (pointing straight through with one portion pointing vertical)
on the straight through portion, have it going to the intake of the mixing pump (blue line)
with the portion of the tee pointing vertical, have a ball valve then the funnel tank.
The reason for this is you can have the circulation pump going at all times and when you add salt to the tank, you just open the ball valve and the salt falls into the flowing stream of water shooting it into the mixing tank. (the tee almost acts like a mazi/venturi and hopefully the salt gets sucked into the water from the velocity of the pump.)
you will just have to experiment with opening the valve and running the pump and pouring the salt into the container verses pouring the whole bag before opening the valve. only time will tell you which method works better for you???
plus after your done with the salt, you can pour a little water in the funnel container and rinse the crystals out and keep things clean??
just an opinion…
good luck and love the build.
(this is just me throwing out suggestions. they might be usable and might be crap….. but i just wanted to throw out some in case it helps????)
Why not have a pip going from the holding tank to a tee (pointing straight through with one portion pointing vertical)
on the straight through portion, have it going to the intake of the mixing pump (blue line)
with the portion of the tee pointing vertical, have a ball valve then the funnel tank.
The reason for this is you can have the circulation pump going at all times and when you add salt to the tank, you just open the ball valve and the salt falls into the flowing stream of water shooting it into the mixing tank. (the tee almost acts like a mazi/venturi and hopefully the salt gets sucked into the water from the velocity of the pump.)
you will just have to experiment with opening the valve and running the pump and pouring the salt into the container verses pouring the whole bag before opening the valve. only time will tell you which method works better for you???
plus after your done with the salt, you can pour a little water in the funnel container and rinse the crystals out and keep things clean??
just an opinion…
good luck and love the build.
Okay, now I'll catch up on questions and greetings. Meant to do this at the same time as the last status update posts but got pulled into a bit of a work and social schedule vortex.
Thanks, offroadodge. I'm hoping to be ready for a fresh water test in about 3 weeks, but this will just be a brief test and then dry again. Going wet for good will be quite a bit further out as it won't be filled with saltwater until after the QTs have been up and running with their first batch of fish and cleanup crew for 6 full weeks. The idea is to be ready with a full battalion of yellow tangs and hermits as soon as the display finishes cycling.
Thank you, loweryster. I got the Abyzz pumps from mr.wilson a few years ago. I'm not sure he is selling them any more, as I tried to contact him via email and PM to order a couple more this summer and got no response. I've heard that you can contact Abyzz directly to order them, though I didn't end up trying this.
Thanks, rbarn. Great points as usual. Though it doesn't look like it in the photo, there is room to slide the bulb out between the tank and wall, and it isn't too awkward to reach from a step stool. Draining the housing will require more work but shouldn't be too bad with just 2 Clic Clamps and 2 PVC unions to pop the UV housing off the board.
Regarding the higher bulkhead, I go back and forth. In favor of it: less stress on the pump, and removing the elbows would allow room for a short length of silicone hose to isolate vibration. On the downside, I think the sump water level would need to be about 6" higher to avoid air suction, which would mean the bottom 6" of the filter socks are submerged. And I'm not sure how real the stress on the pump intake would be between it having a built in pre-filter chamber, the fact that it will be running it at only about 1/2 its capacity, and the sump water level being several inches above the top elbow.
Thanks again, worm5406. It does seem like it should work. I'll work on a video once I get the room a little further along.
Thanks, biodegraded. Yes, full accessibility is essential to maintenance, and that is one of the main principals of the fish room and sump designs. That said, things are tighter in the fish room than I'd hoped; it's amazing how quickly a nearly 40' long room has started to feel too small. I _think_ the UV is accessible enough; time will tell.
I am very thankful to have Timfish helping out! The tank is already much better for it.
Thanks for the suggestion, dahenley! I like it. Unfortunately, I don't have the space or I'd give it a try. It might be the case the such a large air intake would cause severe cavitation, but it would certainly be worth trying, and even if that didn't work the plumbing arrangement you suggest would still work for the slurry approach.
Thanks, acesq, I have a feeling I will need to step the outputs down to 1", possibly even one 1" and one 3/4".
I won't ever remove the entire cup, just the lid. The lid also had the same number of bolts, but I quickly pulled all but 2 of them and will likely not even use those 2, just let the weight of the lid hold it in place. And of course the auto wash down should keep down the frequency with which I need to manually clean the cup.
McGarnicle, JGxIronman, leslie hempel, aandfsoccr04, Reefcrazy85, summitwynds, rpscuba, Notjohnwayne, thanks for joining the thread!
Thanks, offroadodge. I'm hoping to be ready for a fresh water test in about 3 weeks, but this will just be a brief test and then dry again. Going wet for good will be quite a bit further out as it won't be filled with saltwater until after the QTs have been up and running with their first batch of fish and cleanup crew for 6 full weeks. The idea is to be ready with a full battalion of yellow tangs and hermits as soon as the display finishes cycling.
Thank you, loweryster. I got the Abyzz pumps from mr.wilson a few years ago. I'm not sure he is selling them any more, as I tried to contact him via email and PM to order a couple more this summer and got no response. I've heard that you can contact Abyzz directly to order them, though I didn't end up trying this.
Thanks, rbarn. Great points as usual. Though it doesn't look like it in the photo, there is room to slide the bulb out between the tank and wall, and it isn't too awkward to reach from a step stool. Draining the housing will require more work but shouldn't be too bad with just 2 Clic Clamps and 2 PVC unions to pop the UV housing off the board.
Regarding the higher bulkhead, I go back and forth. In favor of it: less stress on the pump, and removing the elbows would allow room for a short length of silicone hose to isolate vibration. On the downside, I think the sump water level would need to be about 6" higher to avoid air suction, which would mean the bottom 6" of the filter socks are submerged. And I'm not sure how real the stress on the pump intake would be between it having a built in pre-filter chamber, the fact that it will be running it at only about 1/2 its capacity, and the sump water level being several inches above the top elbow.
Thanks again, worm5406. It does seem like it should work. I'll work on a video once I get the room a little further along.
Thanks, biodegraded. Yes, full accessibility is essential to maintenance, and that is one of the main principals of the fish room and sump designs. That said, things are tighter in the fish room than I'd hoped; it's amazing how quickly a nearly 40' long room has started to feel too small. I _think_ the UV is accessible enough; time will tell.
I am very thankful to have Timfish helping out! The tank is already much better for it.
Thanks for the suggestion, dahenley! I like it. Unfortunately, I don't have the space or I'd give it a try. It might be the case the such a large air intake would cause severe cavitation, but it would certainly be worth trying, and even if that didn't work the plumbing arrangement you suggest would still work for the slurry approach.
Thanks, acesq, I have a feeling I will need to step the outputs down to 1", possibly even one 1" and one 3/4".
I won't ever remove the entire cup, just the lid. The lid also had the same number of bolts, but I quickly pulled all but 2 of them and will likely not even use those 2, just let the weight of the lid hold it in place. And of course the auto wash down should keep down the frequency with which I need to manually clean the cup.
McGarnicle, JGxIronman, leslie hempel, aandfsoccr04, Reefcrazy85, summitwynds, rpscuba, Notjohnwayne, thanks for joining the thread!
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