Warner Marine Now Has A Pellet Product

[tmz]

I test frequently for NO3 and PO4; just my nature.
Limitation of organic carbon vis a vie NO3 and PO4 is presumed as a basis for organic carbon dosing. Heterotrophic bacteria use all three( C,N,P) and can be limited by a lack of any one of them.The commonly referenced ratio is the Redfield ratio based on measurements Redfield performed on phytoplankton at 116parts C to 16 parts N to 1 part P. This exact ratio varies from organism to organism but the Redfiled ratio provides a good perspective on relative concentrations of these 3 nutrients in marine life.

In a fed tank there is little chance for a P limitation. Surface reef waters hold only about .005ppm . Nitrogen deficiencies may occur with carbon dosing but again in a fed tank it's unlikely since the food will add it as it breakdown and surface reef waters hold only about .2ppm. Some dose amino acids like aspartic acid as an extra nitrogen source and other percie ved benefits..

 

[DJREEF]

I dont even test for P04 or N03. I stopped years ago. The tank tells you what you need to know

absolutely. "Reefing by feel" is what I used to call it years ago. Others have called it "zen" reefing, or "zone" reefing - but it's all the same thing.

DJ

 

[swissgaurd]

Yeah not everyone agrees that adding N03 is a good idea. It worked for me.

This is what happened to my tank.
I started vodka dosing and the hair algae died, so i thought "great, more is better!". After awhile my corals started to look pale. Blastomussa wasn't opening much, SPS were pale. I posted photos and someone stated that i should add amino acids to the tank. Every time i added amino acids i would get this ugly black slime algae so i stopped.
I started getting Cyano bacteria on the sand in thick mats and my corals became more pale.

I started noticing that all the nicest tanks seemed to have N03 at somewhat higher values (5 - 20 ppm) then my undetectable values.

I added Potassium nitrate and within a few days all the Cyano was gone and my corals started coloring up.

some of us believed at the time that amino acids are really just a shot of Nitrogen for our corals.

Ive maintained my tank like this ever since. Ive had incredible growth.

Cyano thrives in a Nitrogen limited environment.

ive got cyno on my sand bed and was wondering where i can obtain potassium nitrate,id like to give it a try

thanks

vic

 

[Zedar]

ive got cyno on my sand bed and was wondering where i can obtain potassium nitrate,id like to give it a try

thanks

vic

as always in reef keeping, go slow. A little is all you need

http://cgi.ebay.com/1-lb-pound-Pota...228?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item439b4b54d4

 

[swissgaurd]

thanks
i should be able to obtain this from my pharmasist.

do you dissolve it first
also how much and how often did you add the potassium nitrate

the tank ill be adding this to is 9 yrs old eb pellets since august 19,
approx. 100 gals of water

sps dominant.

thanks

vic

 

[Zedar]

Yes dissolve it. I added 2 tbl spoons to an 8 ounce bottle of DI water. Ive added 20ml when i notice cyano on the sand. Not very scientific but its been effective.

 

[jsdancer]

as always in reef keeping, go slow. A little is all you need

http://cgi.ebay.com/1-lb-pound-Pota...228?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item439b4b54d4

Hey how old is your tank?
Why are you getting cyno?

 

[swissgaurd]

Yes dissolve it. I added 2 tbl spoons to an 8 ounce bottle of DI water. Ive added 20ml when i notice cyano on the sand. Not very scientific but its been effective.

thanks

whats the size of your tank

vic

 

[Zedar]

Hey how old is your tank?
Why are you getting cyno?

4 years old

I don't get it too often. But when i do, its probably from N03 limitation. I feed a few times a day. Plenty of P04 entering the system. :sad2:

 

[Zedar]

thanks

whats the size of your tank

vic

65 gallon. But i have 120 gallons of water volume.

 

[platax88]

So let me see if I have this right. If you dont have nitrates, then this is good for Cyano growth? Yikes how things change. I always thought Cyano was contributed to high nutrient levels.

 

[Zedar]

Cyano can get nitrogen from the atmosphere in a N03 limited tank. In this environment, nothing else competes with Cyano so it thrives. By adding a small amount of N03, algae will out compete Cyano. Then that small amount of algae can be consumed by snails etc.


check out this post

http://www.reefcentral.org/forums/showthread.php?t=1422666&page=6

second post Marklu

 

[hunkafish]

Warner Vs BP

Warner Vs BP

I've been tagging along both the B/P and this thread and am posing the question, are there any numbers pointing to the benifits over one or the other? Im sure some of you pioneers have tried both and would love a breif overview for a new particapant, in search of lower nitrates,phosphates and less water changes.

 

[nadking]

I've been tagging along both the B/P and this thread and am posing the question, are there any numbers pointing to the benifits over one or the other? Im sure some of you pioneers have tried both and would love a breif overview for a new particapant, in search of lower nitrates,phosphates and less water changes.

From what Ive read, those using the ecobak have had less bacterial blooms and cloudiness overall. Ive added 1000 ml to my 210 gal tank with no ill effects, I have noticed my acans starting to color up of all things. It should be noticed these products are not miracle products, water changes should always be done cosistantly. Ecobak is just something to do on top of good husbandry practices for great results.

 

[platax88]

I've been tagging along both the B/P and this thread and am posing the question, are there any numbers pointing to the benifits over one or the other? Im sure some of you pioneers have tried both and would love a breif overview for a new particapant, in search of lower nitrates,phosphates and less water changes.

I have not tried the other pellets, but EB has been reported to be more effective at PH4 removal... Don't know if it's true but that's what i read and the reason i chose EB.

 

[MammothReefer]

I'm using WM pellets as well. I'm wondering though If I may have TO much movement in my reactor. Does anybody who is having success with the pellets have a quick video they can toss up to give a general idea of the amount of turn over in your reactor. I will post how mine is moving tonight, but since i moved my media from a bag to the reactor I've noticed decreased very slightly almost a "Grey hue" in terms of the visibility in the tank, increased algae, and my skimmer isn't doing much. Although that can be no-related. Tonight I plan to retest and see how my parameters are, as well as do a water change after the fact. The corals them selves seem unaffected.

 

[DJREEF]

I'm using WM pellets as well. I'm wondering though If I may have TO much movement in my reactor. Does anybody who is having success with the pellets have a quick video they can toss up to give a general idea of the amount of turn over in your reactor. I will post how mine is moving tonight, but since i moved my media from a bag to the reactor I've noticed decreased very slightly almost a "Grey hue" in terms of the visibility in the tank, increased algae, and my skimmer isn't doing much. Although that can be no-related. Tonight I plan to retest and see how my parameters are, as well as do a water change after the fact. The corals them selves seem unaffected.

You want them to percolate. Not too much, just enough to kind of jostle them around some.

DJ

 

[DJREEF]

So let me see if I have this right. If you dont have nitrates, then this is good for Cyano growth? Yikes how things change. I always thought Cyano was contributed to high nutrient levels.

It all depends upon the type of cyano. Some cyanobacteria grow in near zero nutrient environments, with only light as their energy source. Hell, there's a few the grow at the base of thermal vents where the water temps reach a few hundred degrees. You're up against a very wary adversary that has an evolutionary head start on you of roughly a few billion years.

DJ

 

[jsdancer]

From what Ive read, those using the ecobak have had less bacterial blooms and cloudiness overall. Ive added 1000 ml to my 210 gal tank with no ill effects, I have noticed my acans starting to color up of all things. It should be noticed these products are not miracle products, water changes should always be done cosistantly. Ecobak is just something to do on top of good husbandry practices for great results.

You are right nadking these pellets are not meant as a way to forego WC or good husbandry. In order to have a great eco system like some these guys who earn TOTM you have to work at it and just simply stay on top of your piece of the ocean.

I'm using WM pellets as well. I'm wondering though If I may have TO much movement in my reactor. Does anybody who is having success with the pellets have a quick video they can toss up to give a general idea of the amount of turn over in your reactor. I will post how mine is moving tonight, but since i moved my media from a bag to the reactor I've noticed decreased very slightly almost a "Grey hue" in terms of the visibility in the tank, increased algae, and my skimmer isn't doing much. Although that can be no-related. Tonight I plan to retest and see how my parameters are, as well as do a water change after the fact. The corals them selves seem unaffected.

Check on this thread in the earlier pages I think drummereef has a good one to see.

 

[tmz]

Some types of cyanobacteria can thrive anywhere there is light, moisture and CO2,even polar bear coats.
Cyanobacteria and diazotrophs like them are often credited with enabling life on the planet. Primordial slime ; they not only oxygenate via photosynthesis but they also uniquely fix nitrogen ,created in the stars, from the athmosphere and bring it into the food chain where it is used for creating proteins and things like dna.It helps to think of the nitrogen( nitrification/ denitrification cycle ) as a circle rather than a line ending with N2 ,nitrogen gas since the gas is drawn back in eventually via the action of the diazoroph's nitrogenase enzyme.
Cyanobacteria form heterocysts in their biomass. These are anoxic chambers where an enzyme uniquely produced by these bacteria called nitrogenase which does not work in the presence of oxygen , fixes the nitrogen to hydrogen bringing into the food chain. It does this by breaking the strong bond between the 2 nitrogen atoms that form N2, nitrogen gas and making N available which links up with H forming things like ammonia NH3/4 thus making essential nitrogen bio available.
So cyano not only consumes nitrogen and phosphate when it's available ; it can produce fixed nitrogen and add it to the system when its not readily available.
Having said that I suspect the cyano sometimes reported with carbon dosing has less to do with nitrogen deficiencies than it does with the by products of activity by other bacteria which may be feeding it or by less phytoplankton and other competitors for nutrients hanging around or upwelling on rock surfaces or substrates. .