carb850
New member
Agreed. :bounce3:
What do you expect for ARS?
- Thread starter Kung
- Start date
Agreed. :bounce3:
baldwinaquaman
New member
It was a joke. I guess Jo's pet club doesn't have those....
carb850
New member
A spy would be peaking in a window, not reading a internet message board. :strooper:
phljess
New member
Actually there is no Jo's pet club I know of so I dont know if they have jokes or not. We have a club made up of hobbyists just like you guys are trying to start. I really think the funny part of it all is the division of the people in the area which keeps anything worthwhile from happening around here.
baldwinaquaman
New member
actually, I hope that the club we start is NOTHING like the one you have, so really it's irrelevant.
phljess
New member
Is'nt this the same thing your against, trying to keep people from being heard... Ridiculous.... I guess you thought I would just stand by and let you guys bash, slander and distort what our group stands for, well your wrong. If you dont like the club fine make a club you want to create but keep us out of your discussions and keep discussion of your club out of our board and chat line. I did not say anything on here for months, until you guys started bringing up the past.
I guess you are right to some extent on your club not being anything like ours. Our club was born from original work, is somewhat organized, actually has enough intiative to start a member base, promotes itself, has a mission, has a governing body with open voting, helps each other when people need it. Has actually done things to promote conservation and propogation.-Not just talk about it online. So I am sure with the way you guys are approaching this, your club will be nothing like ours.
It sounds like to me some people wanting to start this club are not for free speech or democratic ideals at all. Myself I dont agree with everything that has happened in the past but I am very happy with the vision and strides that we have made in our club to make it better. I also really hate the division that has been created. I think some people here are talking out of both sides of their mouth. They want a club that has for the most part the same mission/objectives we have already established. They want to have an open governing body which we already have.
But they also want a system with closed voting/elections? - Isnt this the reason you did not like the original.
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baldwinaquaman
New member
Thanks for your posts. I am afraid I cannot reply though, Everyone who is interested in the new ARS, I hope to see you at the meeting, and I hope we can have a good time, and get to know eachother. I know that if we can get enough members, we can really make strides in helping eachother learn about thi great hobby. I hope I see you all at the meeting!
rsuplido
Member
This thread is a mess but a good example of what happens when there are no officers exercising order. There's not even a member that is a moderator that can split and move posts so a new thread which is aptly titled gets created.
Phil, I respect you man, but it is unfair for you to charge here at ARS and lecture everyone. If ARS starts posting uncontrollably at CVRC, what do you think will happen? First thing probably is that you or any other moderator/admin will immediately delete the posts and probably start banning. You know that no one can do that here. And do you want that happening there at CVRC?
As for the others, stop talking about CVRC already. I'm an active member there as well and while I can really claim that they have made strides to improve their by-laws, unfortunately, it is still far from being a purely member-run organization.
This is where ARS can excel but note however that it is not a competition. It's all about doing things right, and learning from our mistakes and mistakes of others.
Phil, I respect you man, but it is unfair for you to charge here at ARS and lecture everyone. If ARS starts posting uncontrollably at CVRC, what do you think will happen? First thing probably is that you or any other moderator/admin will immediately delete the posts and probably start banning. You know that no one can do that here. And do you want that happening there at CVRC?
As for the others, stop talking about CVRC already. I'm an active member there as well and while I can really claim that they have made strides to improve their by-laws, unfortunately, it is still far from being a purely member-run organization.
This is where ARS can excel but note however that it is not a competition. It's all about doing things right, and learning from our mistakes and mistakes of others.
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phljess
New member
I dont want a competition either I am for promotion of the hobby and enjoying time with others who like the hobby.
phljess
New member
I have not made my mind up yet. The way it looks to me it would just be joining a club that is actually the same as the club I already belong to. I do not like the way some people have painted a picture of our club as an oppressive regime. I always thought it was fun myself. I also do not agree with people expressing what they feel happened without having any hard evidence.
I am not trying to stop anyone from doing anything. As I do not have any power over what people do. However, I would suggest to people to make their decisions wisely as they may be creating something that could be worse than what is already available but time will show what will come to fruitation.
Yes, I am defending the CVRC. As I have heard numerous stories that I believe are based on opinions/hearsay and have no shred of evidence. Especially how founders have used the club for their own benefits. If this is true, why not have them come out of the woodwork here and tell you what they did. As some of your member base here were founders and council members. I think I was the only elected officer in the club and since I was elected there has been numerous changes in the club for the better. After I was elected I pushed for the governing body of the club to be voted in through the vote of long term members. Of course that is my opinion so take it with a grain of salt.
carb850
New member
Who would decide when and were for these 3 meetings a year? What if disagreements? Can the community in our area take another split?
For the sake of argument, what if this setup was successful and the membership started to grow slowly. A few years later people might start making noises of organizing and voted to do so against your wishes? Eventually the 'need' will happen if successful and you never know what way it might go.
Same comment as above. What if you find the big pool isn't the one you want to be in down the road?
Do you think the meetings, swaps, and project tanks are things that can be done without officers? We have shown pretty clearly how divided we are just in a couple days. I don't know how anything other than a meeting could expect to be arranged without a council to call the shots.
As for sponsors, do you think a group our size could attract many? Personally, I'd rather avoid sponsors for awhile because they can come with strings attached. Funding as much as we can for ourselves would keep us free to answer to no one but ourselves.
One could argue that elected officers could come with strings attached also but my rebuttal to that is they can be voted out if you find that is the case. Also if a constitution was drafted in the beginning it should most certainly limit surprises.
I was hoping someone else would speak up. They didn’t, so I’m speaking for myself about The Old Club (TOC)
And Phlj - shame on you.
I never go to the website that was created by TOC, but too bad I missed that election thread. Why wasn’t that posted here if we’re supposed to be some sort of sister club? Perhaps if the existing members would have known about it, they could have talked to the governing board about their feelings and about how they should place their votes. Of coarse that would mean the board members would have to attend a member meeting.
When was "long term members" defined in order to be able to vote? That's funny! Exactly how long do you have to be a member to vote? How long do you have to be a member before your notified that a vote is taking place? It sounds like everyone met and voted each other in one day. That’s a good idea. Our club can do that.
Wow, I guess you can say anything. I can’t believe your trying to pass that off as anything like a member based election and expect anyone to believe it. That’s quite an event for you to announce late in this clubs forum.
If TOC is so organized and has changed to a member voting club, when’s the next election? Surely it’s scheduled.
IMO the recent rule changes and token appointments/elections were due to a failing membership base and lack of attendance. It would have never happened just because it was the right thing to do.
Truth be known:
If TOC members had voting rights along time ago, I wouldn't have changed a single member. Not even the president. (I may have voted against some non-attending board members (who are now the non-attending vote base)) go figure.
It was the arrogance displayed by a few who thought they owned the show, and could never be replaced, that drove all of this. I knew the thought of a vote would cause some to be more humble.
The final straw was when club funds were going to be used to buy frags and the president was going to give them to his most trusted members and everyone else was to just get on some waiting list and you may or may not be chosen at an undisclosed later date. This same president has complained about strangers buying and leaving with his rare coral from the swaps. It became clear why he had the pampas attitude towards newcomers.Yet, you all sell coral online to anyone that will pay.
You don't need a know it all for president, you just need someone that has a love of the hobby, has great organizational skills and can delegate.
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More about your last couple of post
I see no need to belong to both clubs either. Perhaps one shouldn’t burn their bridges.
I didn’t say regime, but monarchy is a better choice since you mentioned it.
If someone felt or was mistreated, what hard evidence do they need for you? I guess everyone imagined it. Who do you think you are? You and I personally have had many conversations about this topic. You yourself said you kept playing because it was the only game in town. You said you needed them and you had to keep going. If you say you liked it so much, why all the recent changes that you’re here bragging about? Both side of the mouth isn’t as two faced as both sides of the fence.
Now, It sounds like you’d stop us if you could and I’ll keep your advice in mind.
I don’t blame your for trying to defend TOC. You’ve worked your butt off for them. Less attendance at their swaps affects your pocket, but I don’t feel this forum is where you need to be selling TOC at. It’s almost sounding new and improved for those that don’t know the background.
How are the CD sales going? Need I elaborate?
President, Appointed Vice President, Elected Officer, Governing Body Member, etc, etc. I’m not up the latest name changes nor do I care. I’m still calling a spade a spade.
I certainly haven’t heard anyone else’s opinion that TOC held real elections. Of coarse you’d say an election was held - you won.
Personally I would have voted for you too, but not for VP.
This latest rhetoric is unlike the guy I new.
Oh, If you think I’m going to stand by, then your wrong.
And speechless? Ha Ha Ha Ha HA
And Phlj - shame on you.
I never go to the website that was created by TOC, but too bad I missed that election thread. Why wasn’t that posted here if we’re supposed to be some sort of sister club? Perhaps if the existing members would have known about it, they could have talked to the governing board about their feelings and about how they should place their votes. Of coarse that would mean the board members would have to attend a member meeting.
When was "long term members" defined in order to be able to vote? That's funny! Exactly how long do you have to be a member to vote? How long do you have to be a member before your notified that a vote is taking place? It sounds like everyone met and voted each other in one day. That’s a good idea. Our club can do that.
Wow, I guess you can say anything. I can’t believe your trying to pass that off as anything like a member based election and expect anyone to believe it. That’s quite an event for you to announce late in this clubs forum.
If TOC is so organized and has changed to a member voting club, when’s the next election? Surely it’s scheduled.
IMO the recent rule changes and token appointments/elections were due to a failing membership base and lack of attendance. It would have never happened just because it was the right thing to do.
Truth be known:
If TOC members had voting rights along time ago, I wouldn't have changed a single member. Not even the president. (I may have voted against some non-attending board members (who are now the non-attending vote base)) go figure.
It was the arrogance displayed by a few who thought they owned the show, and could never be replaced, that drove all of this. I knew the thought of a vote would cause some to be more humble.
The final straw was when club funds were going to be used to buy frags and the president was going to give them to his most trusted members and everyone else was to just get on some waiting list and you may or may not be chosen at an undisclosed later date. This same president has complained about strangers buying and leaving with his rare coral from the swaps. It became clear why he had the pampas attitude towards newcomers.Yet, you all sell coral online to anyone that will pay.
You don't need a know it all for president, you just need someone that has a love of the hobby, has great organizational skills and can delegate.
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More about your last couple of post
I see no need to belong to both clubs either. Perhaps one shouldn’t burn their bridges.
I didn’t say regime, but monarchy is a better choice since you mentioned it.
If someone felt or was mistreated, what hard evidence do they need for you? I guess everyone imagined it. Who do you think you are? You and I personally have had many conversations about this topic. You yourself said you kept playing because it was the only game in town. You said you needed them and you had to keep going. If you say you liked it so much, why all the recent changes that you’re here bragging about? Both side of the mouth isn’t as two faced as both sides of the fence.
Now, It sounds like you’d stop us if you could and I’ll keep your advice in mind.
I don’t blame your for trying to defend TOC. You’ve worked your butt off for them. Less attendance at their swaps affects your pocket, but I don’t feel this forum is where you need to be selling TOC at. It’s almost sounding new and improved for those that don’t know the background.
How are the CD sales going? Need I elaborate?
President, Appointed Vice President, Elected Officer, Governing Body Member, etc, etc. I’m not up the latest name changes nor do I care. I’m still calling a spade a spade.
I certainly haven’t heard anyone else’s opinion that TOC held real elections. Of coarse you’d say an election was held - you won.
Personally I would have voted for you too, but not for VP.
This latest rhetoric is unlike the guy I new.
Oh, If you think I’m going to stand by, then your wrong.
And speechless? Ha Ha Ha Ha HA
Kung
Member
First off, enough with the attacking Phil. He's a good guy and has done too much to help his fellow hobbyists to deserve this level of skepticism. Don't forgive him. He's done nothing to require forgiveness. We read all kinds of rot about learning from other clubs. He had been through the fire, and has more knowledge, experience, and wisdome to offer than almost anyone else willing to post here.
There is no malice in this guy. He's here to help. If you don't believe that, oh, well.
Phil is a good guy.
And to be clear, there are no people in the CVRC that I have issues with. I do have a huge problem with the WAY things went on, with the infighting, back-biting, power plays, etc. It's happening already here, and I don't like it. I really don't want to be part of it. I do want to be part of a club that does good work. I am really nervous when people start trying to rush that kind of thing before we have even had a meeting. That is the type of thing to discuss at the meeting.
Feb 13? Where? I will be there, barring any freak occurences. As far as I am concerned, there is nothing more to discuss. I will discuss anything we want to discuss AT A MEETING.
There is no malice in this guy. He's here to help. If you don't believe that, oh, well.
Phil is a good guy.
And to be clear, there are no people in the CVRC that I have issues with. I do have a huge problem with the WAY things went on, with the infighting, back-biting, power plays, etc. It's happening already here, and I don't like it. I really don't want to be part of it. I do want to be part of a club that does good work. I am really nervous when people start trying to rush that kind of thing before we have even had a meeting. That is the type of thing to discuss at the meeting.
Feb 13? Where? I will be there, barring any freak occurences. As far as I am concerned, there is nothing more to discuss. I will discuss anything we want to discuss AT A MEETING.
