What rare angel is the least owned?

[WayneL333]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7242504#post7242504 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by H.Tanaka
Hi All,
Here is a photo of Centropyge debelius, 8cm at a retailer in Kyoto. I have four shots but it is the best. The species commands a very high price of around US$600, and scarcely imported to Japan. It was doing well in a display tank there. It is almost restricted to Mauritius and Aldabra.

An additional shot of Centropyge potteri, 10cm at the same shop. I heard that two specimens were caught at the depth of more than 60 meters at off Kona Coast, and one of them was shipped to the US. This specimen also cots US$600.

The third shot shows a juvenile, 3cm long Apolemichthys griffisi. Now often imported but still rare in market.

Tanakasan,

Did you mean US$600 or US$6000? $600 doesn't seem to be that much for those rare fish. It's cheaper than Interruptus prices here in the US.

 

[NexDog]

That blue Potter's is awesome. Wayne - definitely not $6,000! The Interruptus is more sought after and retails at about $1000.

 

[LargeAngels]

Did anyone mention C. balina? Beutifull, but I believe now protected, fish.

Or Apolemichthys guezei.

 

[nbd13]

The cost for a Centropyge debelius in the US is about $5,000-7,000 i was quoted by 2 different dealers, one was $5000 and the other was $7,000....

Maybe the whole sale cost is $600? But i doubt that also... I am thinking more along the lines of $2,000 for wholesale cost in the US, probably more...

These were from 2 of the bigger vendors....

actually the Centropyge debelius is much more rare than the Centropyge Interruptus; most recently Interruptus have been retailing from 600-800 for wild caught specimens here in the US, actually phishybusiness is the only one that i know of bring them in a regular basis.

Interruptus are not very rare in the US market anymore... yes they are more rare than some angels, but the Debelius is much more rare in the US and for that matter the world. It commands a much higher amount than the Interruptus....

for any true rare angel nut, the debelius would be more a much more substantial find than an interruptus...

and yes i did mean $5,000-$7,000 for the cost of 1 debelius, i did not type it wrong... they do command this amount, well... this was 1 month ago, but i am assuming the price would not change over that time period...

Nick

 

[dvmsn]

Remember that much of your cost is in shipping. Japan is much closer to the collection points than the US

 

[NexDog]

Nick, I was thinking about the Potter's with the blue morph. Had no idea the debelius was so expensive!

 

[nbd13]

Large Angels,

The Chaetodontoplus ballinae angel is a some what deep water species ranging from 60m to 80m (197 to 265 ft.) where it was collected off northern New South Wales, BUT off of Lord Howe is was collected from 10 to 30m (33 to 98 ft.).

You are right that it IS protected; The Australian goverment issued this.

I guess the few that have kept it reported it to be easy to keep....along the same lines as the ever popular conspic...

HTH

Nick

 

[nbd13]

dvmsn- true, but it does not go to Japan for that reason...

I am sure Dr. Tanaka and NexDog can attest to this,

Rare fish go to Japan simple because of the fact that the Japanese are willing to spend much more money....

That's why rare fish do not often come to the US, the collectors figure they can get 2-3 times more in the Japanese market....

I am sure shipping is probably significant, but still it will not account for the price to sky rocket like it has with the debelius. I mean fish still have to come in to the US from other places throughout the world... Like Red Sea fish...they have to come a very long way to get to the US, but if you look at the price for Red Sea stuff, it does not even compare to this...

The main reason rare fish, heck even illegally collected fish go to Japan is simple because they will pay much much more than anyone in the US.

Nick

 

[SDguy]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7243994#post7243994 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by nbd13
Large Angels,

You are right that it IS protected; The Australian goverment issued this.


Nick

Pitty, since it is definitely along the lines of rare AND beautiful.

 

[nbd13]

SDguy- yes, it is a shame...

Maybe someday this one will be available along with the clarion...

What i wouldn't fo to get my hands on a clarion and a ballinae...maybe some day they will start coming in....of course legally.

Nick

 

[SDguy]

That's so funny...I worked at a LFS back when clarions were available. I have to tell you, they really didn't turn any heads. Frankly, we didn't stock them after sitting on one for over a year. No one would buy them, and they weren't that expensive. People preferred the passer, every time, especially after comparing pictures of adult colorations.

 

[nbd13]

I have a sweet spot for these guys...check out this photo i found...

I think this was an illegally collected one, that made it into captivity.

This clarion was brought in with 16 others...14 were confiscated, but 2 of them made it into the tanks at the Aquarium of the Pacific in Long Beach....

Nick

 

[copps]

I too remember those days... I'm 28 now and worked in high school at a place in Northern New Jersey... Red Sea stuff was much more expensive... asfur angels for $700 to over $1000 and clarions in the $300-$400 range...

Imagine conspics being in the $100 range in 15 years or so... We can dream...

I am amazed at the 10 fold price discrepency between Japan and the US for debelius... If this were the case retailers here could buy them from Japan and even after shipping and markup they'd be less than $2000...

Nice shot Nick...

 

[H.Tanaka]

WayneL333,
Oh, I am so sorry that I should have added one more 0 to &600,- for the Potter's. Also for Centropyge debelius, too.

A large adult Ballina Angel was once shipped to Tokyo over ten years ago but it already was DOA.

How about Genicanthus takeuchii ? It ranges the Ogasawara Islands and Marcus Island (Minami-tori-shima). First found and photographed by a famous diver Hiroshi Takeuchi and later ichthyologists from Oahu collected some in Ogasawara.
This is a tiny juvenile photographed underwater in Ogasawara (photo by a friend-diver Mori****a).

 

[nbd13]

Dr. Tanaka- Has the takeuchi ever been in captivity? Are there differences betweent he male and female of this species?

thanks

Nick

 

[H.Tanaka]

This species has never been collected for sale, and male, female and juvenile form are all greatly different. In Ogasawara it is prohibited to collect any aquarium fishes. I will show them soon.

 

[nbd13]

Thanks,

Well I thought Iw ould add a few more...

The Phantom Angel (Chaetodontoplus dimidiatus)

It's funny I found a picture on the internet and guess who it's from... haha Dr. Tanaka

all I know about this species is that is was once thought to be a color morph of Chaetodontoplus melanosoma, but it was recently classified as a new species...

Dr. Tanaka any info on this? Like have any been collected?


Vanderloos' Angel (Chaetodontoplus vanderloosi),

I cannot find any pictures of this, Dr. Tanaka do you have any?

All i know is it's jet black with a white face, with a hint of orange in it. The tail is yellow and black...

supposedly the Vanderloos' and Phantom is supposed to have the same care requirments as C. melanosoma....both reaching around 8 inches or 20 cm....

again Dr. Tanaka any info you have or pictures pelase share

Nick

 

[H.Tanaka]

This is a picture of Gencanthus takeuchii, male & female. Photo by the discoverer Takeuchi. It was first discovered in 1987 and the pic was the FIRST photograph ever taken. A copy from a book "Angelfishes" 2003.
This one loves a cooler water of temperature of 20 degrees C, and found at the deoth of 20-40+ meters on the reef, and forms a harem including a dominant male and several females.

nbd,
I noticed the thread by you just before posting the pic, and wait for a while; I will show Ch. vanderloosi here. It was only recently described by Allen & Steene.
Ch. dimidiatus was also recogmized by them at the same time, therefore the genus contains 14 valid species. Ch. dimidiatus ranges Indonesia and it was collected there but no detail is known. It did not do well or feed on nothing in my tank, and finally died without sign of eating. Larger specimens of the genus seem very difficult to feed on.

 

[H.Tanaka]

This Chaetodontoplus vanderloosi, adult (15cm) and juvenile (3cm, inset). A photocopy from aqua, Italy.
It is known only from easternmost area of Papua New Guinea, around Milne Bay. Adults have a white area on face and head and a black tail with yellow margin. Juveiles are very similar to those of Ch. melanosoma.
I have never sen it in the aquarium trade.

 

[SDguy]

OK, these fish are making the OP's list look as common as flame angels Thank you for the wonderful pics/info H.Tanaka