What's the deal with anenome lighting?

[PiePuncher]

The coral had been touched before photo, u can see the zoas are still closed from being touched. That photo was taken under two pc's, am now running three. Also running tunze 6025 and koralia 1 along w return pump. I think lighting is fine, this is my frog when not being drown out by two sorry 10ks and one actinic. Lighting makes all the difference. I never said it didn't and not everyone will b successful keeping nem in such a small tank.
This frog started as three heads, now has well over twenty.
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v717/PiePuncher/?action=view&current=WP_000357.jpg

frog look bad to u too? Just an honest question
I thought the frog looked great along with the rest of my corals. This is same nem with actinics on
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v...hoto_025B961B-0A57-015A-338A-4A3FD8D78908.jpg

 

[BonsaiNut]

frog look bad to u too? Just an honest question

Pie you seem to be spoiling for a fight or something. I never said anything in your tank looked "bad". I simply said I would describe your tank environment as not enough light (based on that single photo).

Your argument was that you could keep a M. doreensis alive in your tank with PC lighting. Though there were some doubters, I think you've proven your point. I have seen tons of photos of people keeping reef creatures alive in tanks with sub-optimal conditions. I also know what these creatures look like in the wild, so I use that as a guide for what I would describe as "optimal". Your M. doreensis is partially bleached. It just is. It doesn't mean that it is "bad" or that it is dying - it just means that it probably isn't getting enough light to not be partially bleached

Your frogspawn looks fine to me for what it's worth. I was more interested in the M. doreensis since frogspawn are relatively low-light LPS.

 

[westohooligan]

I kept RBTAs under PC lighting and made a lot of money on the offspring. I now use t5s, much better lighting, IMO, but if you're going to use PC lighting; water quality and feeding is paramount. Do it right the first time; get better lighting.

 

[PiePuncher]

Not wanting to fight. I see so many people say u can't keep a nem in an all in one tank. It can be tough and is not for everyone but can be done. I appreciate the input and have no hard feelings. I try to provide as good of an environment as possible for all the little guys in my tank. Sorry for the conflict and i just wanted people to know it can be done. A larger tank is MUCH easier and i would never run PC lighting on a larger tank.

 

[BonsaiNut]

Not wanting to fight. I see so many people say u can't keep a nem in an all in one tank. It can be tough and is not for everyone but can be done. I appreciate the input and have no hard feelings. I try to provide as good of an environment as possible for all the little guys in my tank. Sorry for the conflict and i just wanted people to know it can be done. A larger tank is MUCH easier and i would never run PC lighting on a larger tank.

I will say this - you have been successful where many others have failed. M. doreensis is not a particularly easy anemone - even in a large tank with tons of lighting.

You also did something else that was very smart - you decided to keep an anemone and that was about it - with only a few other corals and inverts. I think many people see these big 300 gallon tanks and try to replicate that look in an all-in-one. You can do something SIMILAR if you are careful with your invert selection, but clown anemones by their very size and sting are tough to keep in tight quarters.

 

[Toddrtrex]

Thing is, you mentioned that your anemone has moved from rock to rock -- M. doreensis is a sand bed dwelling anemone. IME, the only time they will go onto the rocks it to get higher = closer to the light.

Plus, I think we all need to remember that we could give them an environment where they can thrive and not just survive.

 

[hypnoj]

man.. u guys are harsh. I have a condy and a sebae in my deep 60 gallon tank under PC's for 3 years. I know that neither of them are what you're referring to, but from my studies as long as anemone's have a food source (albeit bright lights or direct feeding) they can survive just fine. For those saying "ya, but they're not thriving.." that is 100% subjective. You could argue that because all of my fish aren't breeding and populating like crazy that "clearly they aren't thriving". How much thriving do you really want? Once again, it's all subjective. This reef exists because I want it to exist to my specific parameters. I don't want my anemone's taking over. I don't even want them to get much bigger. I don't want any of my corals to get much bigger; after 3 years of growth for everyone, with very little fragging, things are getting tight. My condy is at the very top of the tank and has been that way since the first month I got him, and my sebae is at the very bottom in the sand (24+ inches deep) and has been since I got him. The sebae gets fed 2 x per week freeze dried krill from Walmart.
I have 18 BTA's in my 80g cube under LED's (just wanted to let you know I still have some knowledge of BTA's) and I'm thinking about putting a BTA in a 5.5g pico cube under LED's with a single clown (not sure I'll attempt that though). Anyways... Take home message, anemone's require a lot of research before going into a tank. Continue posting questions and reading past experiences from reefers, loads of information to process here.

 

[velvetelvis]

U can never learn anything new when u already know it all.......

Pot, meet kettle.

Lots of feisty people here lately...the heat must be getting to everyone.

ETA: It must be making me cranky, too. Sorry for the snarky comment, Pie Puncher.

 

[Toddrtrex]

...

Lots of feisty people here lately...the heat must be getting to everyone.

....

I hope that is it. I have been getting a bit fed up by it, and have soured on the subject of anemones and clowns because of it.

 

[velvetelvis]

I hope that is it. I have been getting a bit fed up by it, and have soured on the subject of anemones and clowns because of it.

It's a shame, because it inhibits more interesting discussion. I have sympathy for newbies who are genuinely looking for advice and answers--I consider myself an "advanced" newbie.

But lately it seems like nearly every new thread is from someone wanting to keep anemones in inadequate conditions, or the apparently deathless "Can I keep more than two clownfish/kinds of clownfish in my tank?" And the OPs (or other posters) are often defending or even advocating such practices and obviously spoiling for a fight. It gets real old, real fast. And it's too bad, because this is a great forum. I sometimes wonder if some topics should become off limits, just because they've been beat to death and usually lead to pointless arguments.

 

[Whip316]

Whip, I am glad your anemones are doing well, however there are a couple of things you are mentioning here that probably need some correction:

(1) BTA's of ANY color need the same amount of light. That's because it is the zooxanthellae (dinoflagellates) in the tissue of the anemone that need the light, and populations of zooxanthellae do not differ greatly between BTAs in terms of their lighting needs. The color of the anemone is determined by pigmentation (not zooxanthellae) - which in some anemones serves to help block excessive light (particularly UVA and UVB). You may be suggesting that to get an anemone to be vibrantly colored you need bright lighting - which is true.

(2) BTA's require the least light of any clown anemone.

(3) As you yourself mention, new bulbs (and changing bulbs) is critically important. A new bulb can deliver 2x the light output of a 2 year-old bulb (depending on make and type of bulb). You should replace bulbs at least every 6 months.

(4) I think you confused people by saying add the anemone when the tank is sparkling new, but only add it after the tank is 4-6 months old I think I understand what you were trying to say - ie only add anemones after 4-6 months, but keep new light bulbs (?)

I have seen BTA's kept successfully under NO actinic lighting with a few NO daylight fluorescents. Granted, they were hugging the waterline, but the anemones did get quite large, and split regularly. I don't doubt they can be kept in a nano as long as you don't feed them much and keep them really small

yeah, i was just paraphrasing mostly i hate typing alot of stuff. being dyslexic makes me stick to short and sweet. hehe

i change my bulbs earlier than most people. i change my PC in my 12g nano every 6 months and i am gonna add another PC to it for more watts per gal.


i just removed my purple lta from my 24g hqi nano cause it started walking. its in a 24g jbj nano with a 150mh so it had more than enough light. some nems just like to walk. i had bta's that walked for months in my hqi nano and others stayed put and never moved an inch.

 

[Toddrtrex]

... some nems just like to walk. i had bta's that walked for months in my hqi nano and others stayed put and never moved an inch.

That isn't true, they will move when conditions aren't correct for it -- we can't always figure it out -- but they just don't "like to walk"

 

[elegance coral]

That isn't true, they will move when conditions aren't correct for it -- we can't always figure it out -- but they just don't "like to walk"

Agree 100%. The life of an anemone is all about energy conservation. Moving around is a waste of energy unless the anemone is seeking greener pastures. If the anemone is comfortable, it won't move. Sometimes it can be difficult to determine what's making the anemone uncomfortable, and causing it to move, but something is, if it's moving around.

 

[hypnoj]

Agree 100%. The life of an anemone is all about energy conservation. Moving around is a waste of energy unless the anemone is seeking greener pastures. If the anemone is comfortable, it won't move. Sometimes it can be difficult to determine what's making the anemone uncomfortable, and causing it to move, but something is, if it's moving around.

I agree

 

[elixir]

hi all

i purchased my first clowns last week (7 small ocellaris) for my 90g bow-shaped FOWLR tank. i'm now wanting to add an anenome for them to hang out in, but am unsure about the whole lighting issue - i've only been in the hobby for @4 months and havent any experience with anenome.

the tank came with four roof-mounted flourecent tubes (PC lighting, right?); two long tubes are 30w and 8,000k and two smaller tubes are 15w (i assume the same "k" as the longer tubes as the writing is faded, whatever "k" means).

so the q is: is the above lighting sufficient for an anenome to thrive, or do i need to migrate to another technology before i buy the nemos a pad?

 

[Toddrtrex]

Those sound like Normal Output florescent bulbs, and for that sized tank they won't be enough for any hosting anemone.

So, yes you will, IMO/E, need to upgrade your lights. And be aware that those 7 clowns have a good chance of becoming 2 in time.

 

[hypnoj]

please take this advice kindly, I mean no malice by saying this. Please take back 5 of the clowns. The odds are great that they will fight and kill each other off if there is more then 2 in any given tank.
Also you'll probably need to upgrade your lighting to something a lot stronger if you want to successfully keep anemone's. T-5's at the bare minimum and preferably metal halides or LED's (as long as you get the right ones). Most reefers recommend waiting at least a year before introducing an anemone into a tank.

 

[elixir]

as the clowns are so small right now (about 1" long), do i need to worry about them killing each other off till 2 remain at this stage, or could i get away with waiting, say, a year, till they grow a bit bigger?

also, if i take some time out before adding an anenome - which i'll have to do anyway, now that its apparent i'll need to first upgrade my lighting - am i depriving the clowns in any way of a more ideal or protective/symbiotic habitat?

please take this advice kindly...

honestly, for me, there is no other way to take advice. i've nothing but gratitude for anyone taking the time to respond or comment to anything i might post. as far as i'm concerned, the more brutally honest and critical the feedback, the better.

my motto as a rookie aquarist: i'm resigned to learning from my mistakes, but would rather learn from yours.

 

[hypnoj]

i imagine that they will get a long for quite a few months before you'll notice a dominant pair form. Once that pair forms it's important to change things. If you plan to have a mixed tank ie sps, lps, softies etc, then I recommend keeping the dominant pair and getting rid of the rest. If you plan on having a 90 gallon anemone tank filled with anemone's, then you could probably find a way to keep all of the clowns peacefully.

 

[Toddrtrex]

as the clowns are so small right now (about 1" long), do i need to worry about them killing each other off till 2 remain at this stage, or could i get away with waiting, say, a year, till they grow a bit bigger?

also, if i take some time out before adding an anenome - which i'll have to do anyway, now that its apparent i'll need to first upgrade my lighting - am i depriving the clowns in any way of a more ideal or protective/symbiotic habitat?



honestly, for me, there is no other way to take advice. i've nothing but gratitude for anyone taking the time to respond or comment to anything i might post. as far as i'm concerned, the more brutally honest and critical the feedback, the better.

my motto as a rookie aquarist: i'm resigned to learning from my mistakes, but would rather learn from yours.

IME, you won't have a year before things turn. And part of the issue -- at least when it happened to me -- is that things go South very quickly, and could happen before you have time (( and means to deal with the other clowns )) to intervene.