why only 2 clowns?

[twelvejewelz]

I mean really in the wild you'll usually see an anemone with 100s of clowns sharing the same anemone. Why in the hobby and home aquarium do people usually suggest only 2 in a tank?There are 27 clowns in this persons tank,which by the way is one of my favorite tanks EVER!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OukzEoeGqJU&feature=related

 

[Chelsey]

That person's tank is the exception, not the rule.

In the wild clowns have significantly more room to establish territories, the anemones are usually MUCH bigger, and instead of the reef owner picking up a bunch of random clownfish and throwing them together hoping to end up with a male, a female, and juvies the clowns can sort things out for themselves.

Some large public aquaria have multiple pairs clowns per tank but the tank size is significantly larger than the average home aquarium.

 

[ctlegacy]

That's bunk. I have 20+ clowns in my tank too. Percs, Oscis, clarkii, cinnamins, picasso, and others. No problems. I found the trick to be add them in groups. I like to put at least 4 at a time in the tank. There is "confusion in numbers". The other clowns didn't really know how to react so they just do nothing. I have a ritteri that has 9 clowns in it at all times. It's awesome.

The only precautions I give are don't mix maroons with anything. That didn't go well for me. The clarki's are kind of pricks too, but the other fish learn fast and just avoid them. I only have 2 clarks. I figure that there are probably around 11 females in my tank. The females seem to be the ones that guard the anemone more than the males.

I have a 150 gallon tank with lots of anemones in it. No problem. Everyone told me that I could do it too, but it worked fine.

Good luck! Have fun!

 

[Toddrtrex]

How long have you had your tank like that?

Are any of them spawning?

 

[ocellaris123]

Usually they fight if you have more than two, however at the aquarium I work at the clownfish display has over 100 anemone fishes in the tank, ocellaris, skunks, tomatoes, clarkiis, fire, maroons, all which get along fine. A pair of skunks and tomatoes are even breeding in the tank, right next too each other. The reason I feel this works is because of the high stocking density which limits aggression and the 3000 gallon exhibit. If you want a stress free hobbyist tank than I would just look into getting a pair.

 

[ctlegacy]

If you're asking me, I've had my tank running for about 9 months now. I've made my fair share of mistakes and I wiped out an entire aquarium of clown fish because I didn't adhere to the quaranteen rule. That's a lesson you should learn RIGHT AWAY. Get a nano that you can keep fish in for 3 weeks before you add them to your main tank. Disease spreads QUICKLY and you can't treat it in a reef tank. It sucks.

Anyway, I think the more clowns the merry-er! I'm going to get some of the midnight (all black no stripes) clowns next.

 

[ducati2242]

Show us some pictures. Ive only got two maroon clowns and they were a nightmare . The little yellow striped maroon took some punishment before the much bigger white striped maroon accepted him. He was in a small net type holding tank for a fortnight before he was accepted.

 

[clowns101]

I have seen people in Home Aquariums keep more than 2 fish.However,they only kept a Trio.No more than 3.In the wild(some sp.)will live in larger groups.When the Largest dominate male dies,one of the smaller males will take place of the male who just died.When female dies,dominate male takes on female roll and chooses the best younger male.

Pretty simple.But I would say its hard to keep this going in the home aquarium.I have been wanting to try but wont get rid of my fish I already have.

P.S this is most commonly done with Saddle Back clownfish.Look at pictures of them in the Wild and tell me what you see.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xk0IXM7neJQ

Look at that!She has like 2 or 3 sp. together.Would I ever do this in my tank?NO!It is possible but needs to be done with much care.I mean MUCH CARE.It only take a few seconds for a female to decide she will kill him or not!

 

[Toddrtrex]

If you're asking me, I've had my tank running for about 9 months now. I've made my fair share of mistakes and I wiped out an entire aquarium of clown fish because I didn't adhere to the quaranteen rule. That's a lesson you should learn RIGHT AWAY. Get a nano that you can keep fish in for 3 weeks before you add them to your main tank. Disease spreads QUICKLY and you can't treat it in a reef tank. It sucks.

Anyway, I think the more clowns the merry-er! I'm going to get some of the midnight (all black no stripes) clowns next.

IMO --- Given how long clowns can/will live, and how long it can take them to start to spawn, I wouldn't call 9 months a success, and I have a feeling that in about another 9 months things are going to change -- for the worse.

And "more the merrier" is very bad advise.

 

[twelvejewelz]

I wouldnt mix maroons with anything ive seen some REALLY NASTY ones take over an entire 90 gallon tank. But im just wondering all the reasoning behind it cause like i said ive seen pics of the wild reefs and sometimes there are literally hundreds of them in 1 anemone.

 

[clowns101]

Ive never seen more than like 12 in a anemone.As I said above it was with Saddlebacks.Ive NEVER and doubt I will see,hundreds of Maroons in an anemone.

 

[Ben_Im]

I have 9 true perculas in my tank currently. All but 1 are from the same hatch and have never been separated (got them from a local breeder). My dominant fish is a wild caught percula I've had for a little over a year now.

So far so good. The female has been "picking" at a spot underneath the biggest anemone, so I assume she's getting ready to lay eggs. I don't see any aggression coming from the female. Most of the aggression is between the two smallest clowns. All the others seem rather happy... so far .....

 

[twelvejewelz]

sorry i didnt make that clear i did'nt mean i saw hundreds of maroons in the same nem. Ive seen lots of ocellaris and true percs all together . That vid you posted is cool to thanks. See now when the female dies there has to be a third male around so there can still be a pair or the fish would cease to exist. The fish arnt migratory nor do they really venture far from their territory so it would be impossible for them to find another mate no?That's what leads me to believe there should be bunches of them in a single anemone.Now in the wild how often do the fish add new genes to the mix? Are they constantly over hundreds of years mating with their offspring?

 

[adambirk]

i keep a trio of ocellaris and a pair of pink skunks. i have no nems in my tank anymore. the 3 occes host were i used to have the nem and the pink skunks host a green open brain. have had them this way for over 3 years. went from a 90 to a 150 gallon.

the ocellaris also spawn in my tank and have done so for about the last 8 months. the only time there is any sign of agression is when the ocellaris have eggs and the pinks wonder over too far. the female will bolt across the tank and quiver right in front of the pinks and they back down. never had any fighting between them i have seen in 3 years.

my father also keeps 7 ocellaris clowns all together in a lta at his house. has had them for about two years. but these all came from a mated pair that he raised the fry and keep them for himself.

also he has 20 to 30 at any given time in his grow out tank too. and these are all small juvenials. but has kept them for months at a time like this. and has not had any problems.

 

[Winwood]

I have tried this several times hoping to recreate that magical scene where several individuals of one species of clown inhabits one large anemone. My first attempt was with a group of 6 perculas in a large magnifica. The nem was around 14 to 15 inches across and I started with one large perc and five juveniles. It didn't take long before the dominant female selected her mate and violently drove the rest of the juveniles to the corners of my 6' 125. In an attempt to provide more living space for the outcasts I ordered a large gigantea on line. In a funny twist of events all the clowns took to the gig almost instantly. The dominant pair and the juvies all shared the anemone with hardly any problems. Unfortunately I lost that anemone after about two weeks in my tank. The pair returned to the mag and began chastising the juvies once again.

After another couple of weeks of violent rule by the dominant pair my frustration mounted to the point where I traded the whole group in for a group of 5 pink skunks. The skunks were all very small and ended up quarreling quite a lot. I believe they were sorting out the dominance hierarchy. This persisted for several days until I came across 1 giant pink skunk at my lfs. The new skunk was added and aggression between the smaller individuals almost ceased immediately except for the occasional spat which was usually broken up by big mama. This group lived together for about 5 months until I lost all of them a weird mystery disease.

Since then I have tried nigripes in the same mag, 7 to be exact, 2 wild and 5 captive bred, with very little success. My wild female was an absolute terror and chased 2 of the underlings right out of the tank. In my experience this species is far too agressive to attempt this again unless you have an extremely large tank and atleast 10+ individuals.

On a positive note a fellow reefer's father in my area has had a breeding trio of occellaris for over 5 years in a large crispa. I say trio because although the dominant pair lays the eggs and fertilizes them. The subordinant individual will actually assistin fanning the eggs! It's crazy! I guess what I'm saying is in my very limited observations and experience is that multiple clowns in one tank is not an impossibility but it is definitely not an easily replicatable situation for the average home aquarist, and too often results in unnessary loss of life for the subordinant individuals.

 

[elegance coral]

That's bunk. I have 20+ clowns in my tank too. Percs, Oscis, clarkii, cinnamins, picasso, and others. No problems.

The females seem to be the ones that guard the anemone more than the males.

I have a 150 gallon tank with lots of anemones in it. No problem. Everyone told me that I could do it too, but it worked fine.

If it "worked fine" and there are "no problems", who are the females guarding the anemone from? It's not like the females can guard their territory by politely asking others not to invade it. They guard their territory with violence.

 

[Brandon1652]

As for grouping clowns, I thought three was the no-no number, i.e., you should have 1, a pair, or an odd number greater than three. Am I remembering this correctly?

I have large groups of clown often, but with long term success rarely. I would not try it, and I would only suggest this to an experienced aquarist.

 

[elegance coral]

If you're asking me, I've had my tank running for about 9 months now. I've made my fair share of mistakes and I wiped out an entire aquarium of clown fish because I didn't adhere to the quaranteen rule. That's a lesson you should learn RIGHT AWAY. Get a nano that you can keep fish in for 3 weeks before you add them to your main tank. Disease spreads QUICKLY and you can't treat it in a reef tank. It sucks.;

Our goal isn't just to keep our pets alive. It should be to keep them healthy. When we pack a large number of very territorial animals into a small space, stress levels can escalate, immune systems can suffer, and disease can spread with catastrophic results. I guess you've seen this for yourself though.

In less than 9 months, you have managed to accomplish something that most of us haven't done with years of experience. I've been at this for 20 some odd years, and I've never lost an "entire aquarium" to disease. LFS's across the globe bring diseased fish into their systems on a weekly basis. How often does this wipe out the entire system? What do you think could have weakened your fish to the point that they all fell victim to disease and died?

Anyway, I think the more clowns the merry-er!

This is just horrid advice.

 

[ctlegacy]

Well.... for starters, at the time it happened, I had 7 clown fish. I bought 2 PNG clowns that appearantly had something called "clown fish disease". It only wiped out the clowns and nothing else.

As far as the females "guarding" the anemone. I am probably using the wrong word. I mean that they "stay" in the anemones more so than the males. I've actually never seen any variety of my clown fish get aggressive. EXCEPT A MAROON THAT WAS VERY AGGRESSIVE, and was removed from the tank within 24 hours (would have been faster, but he was a quick little bastard). I haven't witnessed the "territorial nature" that seems to be the "accepted" reality.

I think I take great care of my tanks and my fish. I've definitely made my share of mistakes, but I don't consider my clown fish dominated tank to be one of them. It's by far the most enjoyable tank that I've ever had, and I'd do it again and again and again. I would also recommend it to anyone who has the want or desire to do it. Why? Because it doesnt take a rocket scientist to IMMEDIATELY recognize a problem. If you drop a clown fish in your tank and something appears to be wrong, then you can take it back out.

By the way, the words....."I think" typically start an opinion....not advice. That being said, I still think the more clowns the merry-er-er.

Here's my advice...... You should do whatever makes you happy. You should do whatever you can afford, and you should do whatever YOU can live with.

If you can live with all the potential outcomes then you can add sharks and sea lions to your tank. It might work out, it might not. That being said, I'm pretty sure that if you want to add 4 more clowns to YOUR (it is yours in the end remember) aquarium, then you shouldn't even post it. You should just go down to your LFS and buy them. Otherwise people that are pretty sure they know way more than you are going to post a bunch of "opinions" that they've read about, heard about, but rarely have seen in person. Unless the response starts with the words....."WHEN I DID IT" then I would skip to the next post.

There are about a million people out there (probably more) who will tell you that you shouldn't have anemones in a tank less than a year old because it takes at least that long for the water to.......I don't even know what happens to the water or the tank. Here's what I do know.... I've kept 2 ritteri, and 19 BTA anemones in my tank since about week 2, and they have been thriving for 9 months. Some people with 20 years experience can't keep a ritteri alive for 2 weeks. Am I magic? I am the mistic ritteri keeper? Obviously no, but I did research and figured 400w metal halides (in pendants) and huge flow was a good starting point, and more important, I thought the potential enjoyment was greater than the risk.

Some people buy beautiful RBTA's and cut them up with scissors. Imagine the horror.

Do whatever makes you happy, and I wish you the best of luck! I will post pics shortly.

 

[Ben_Im]

Otherwise people that are pretty sure they know way more than you are going to post a bunch of "opinions" that they've read about, heard about, but rarely have seen in person. Unless the response starts with the words....."WHEN I DID IT" then I would skip to the next post.

There are about a million people out there (probably more) who will tell you that you shouldn't have anemones in a tank less than a year old because it takes at least that long for the water to.......I don't even know what happens to the water or the tank. Here's what I do know.... I've kept 2 ritteri, and 19 BTA anemones in my tank since about week 2, and they have been thriving for 9 months. Some people with 20 years experience can't keep a ritteri alive for 2 weeks. Am I magic? I am the mistic ritteri keeper? Obviously no, but I did research and figured 400w metal halides (in pendants) and huge flow was a good starting point, and more important, I thought the potential enjoyment was greater than the risk.
.

Well said :beer:
I added 2 BTAs to my tank at the 2 month mark and they've been thriving for the past year, almost quadrupling in size and splitting once. Also, I was told countless times that I couldn't keep more than 2 true percs. I'm seeing almost no aggression amongst the group (besides the two smallest ones, but they seem to be working it out).

I'm not saying those who say otherwise are wrong, I just think so much of this hobby is situational. So much "knowledge" is just regurgitated that it almost becomes a cardinal rule. Just do your own research, READ REEFING BOOKS , and make your own decisions.