A take on BB methodology.

[Johnsteph10]

I don't remember a single post where any of the BB "advocates" have ever said DSBs/SSBs don't work. They have repeatedly said they work..if you put the extra time and maintenance in to keeping them functioning properly.

There's too much of "He said, she said" going on here.

Much like sandbeds flux, so do the methods of keeping reeftanks. Those of us who have done it for a while can agree. I remember when CC was all the rage. And downdraft skimmers were da' bomb. :lol:

 

[Bomber]

Re: Re: A take on BB methodology.

Re: Re: A take on BB methodology.

Just for fun did anyone notice how Eric contradicted himself?

so no one caught it?

""they were a maintenance nightmare, were sterile, unstable, required regular siphoning of detrtius.""

They were a dirty maintenance nightmare, unstable and fluxing from all that dirt, and required regular siphoning to get all that dirty detritus out ----

and they were 'sterile' at the same time. :eek2:

Sounds to me like someone doesn't know how to operate pumps and a skimmer.

 

[photobarry]

Yes.

I'm assuming that by "sterile", he means lacking in microfauna. But it still is a bit of a contradiction. If the tank is that dirty, it should support plenty of small critters. I know there was a huge difference between my tank's microfauna when I switched from dsb to bb. In the dsb tank there were microbrittle stars everywhere. Once I switched, they all but disappeared. Even when I few more after going bb.

 

[Bomber]

All you need for "microfauna" is a pile of detritus. That's what they eat. The more detritus/dirt you have, the more microfauna you have.
That simple.

 

[kimoyo]

I don't remember a single post where any of the BB "advocates" have ever said DSBs/SSBs don't work.

Lol.

 

[G-money]

Barry,

That's interesting...I still find microbrittles all over my tank (yes brittles, not stars)
Truth be told, when I had a DSB, the vast majority of sand-dwellers were worms. I still see worms in my BB tank coming out of the rocks...as well as every bit as much "microfauna" as I ever saw in my sandbed tanks. Rocks harbor much more diversity than sand....perhaps less bacteria, but more life for sure - at least in my experience. Hardly "sterile"...

 

[SCARYBO]

I posted on this thread when it first started in the hopes of gaining knowledge. That hope has disappeared a long time ago. Why is it every topic discussed lately must become an argument. There are no exchanges of ideas.

DSB, SSB, BB, all work. We have seen successful tanks with each method. Is one method superior to the others.. NO! They all have risks and rewards. I love the way advocates of each system picks one point to argue and holds on like a dog and a bone. They refuse to even admit benefits to the other systems. Then they give backhanded praise and claim not to have any feeling about the other system (ie. DSB will work for you, even if you dont know what is going on..... or BB will work for you, even if they are not natural).

Where is the exchange of knowledge? Why all the name calling and bashing? The only thing I've learned on this thread is how to play word games. That is amazing since I sell stocks for a living!!:eek2:

Come on.. let's go back to the first few posts and make this a constructive thread.

 

[Bomber]

OK

DSB experts can't run a BB tank.

 

[Bomber]

Sorry it was there, I had to do it, I'll crawl back in my hole now.

 

[SCARYBO]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaargh!!!

 

[photobarry]

Barry,

That's interesting...I still find microbrittles all over my tank (yes brittles, not stars)
Truth be told, when I had a DSB, the vast majority of sand-dwellers were worms. I still see worms in my BB tank coming out of the rocks...as well as every bit as much "microfauna" as I ever saw in my sandbed tanks. Rocks harbor much more diversity than sand....perhaps less bacteria, but more life for sure - at least in my experience. Hardly "sterile"...

I just moved some of that rock to my home tank. Other than some tube snails, I don't see much "microfauna" on the rock anymore. Although that could be due to the fact that about 95% of the rock is covered in soft corals and they are blocking access to the rock.

 

[attml]

I agree, there is more than one way to skin a cat, even when it comes to BB. I had the fortunate and unfortunate pleasure of a tank crash back in January in my 120g sps tank. I had a RTN event that would have made John Merick feel good about himself. Things that I didn't think could RTN like M. digitata and encrusting monti's were RTNing despite massive water changes polyfilters, carbon etc. I still haven't isolated what caused it; a combo of intercepter, kick ich and FW exit or the kids put something in the tank? Here is a picture of the tank a week prior to the crash-
Everything was growing and doing well (yes, even with sand in there, but I did have a macro algae problem I wasn't happy about).

I had a euro reef skimmer , plenty of flow and I kept on top of my tank's parameters and did regular water changes. As a result of the crash I decided to go BB and am very glade that I did! The way I cooked my rocks was a little different. Rather than take a chance of something toxic being in my rocks (Bomber no Phosphate jokes ) I decided to bleach my entire system. I bleached all of my LR, my tank, my overflows, my return lines all of my equipment and I swapped out my sump. I wanted to eliminate the source of my crash and any red bugs, flatworms and macro algae all in one fell swoop. So with about 10 gallons of bleach I went to work. After bleaching everything I literally started over with nothing. After I bleached everything I owned I had to de-chlorinate the water for about a week then it went in the tank and I added water. Here are some progression shots:

Starboard

My newly man made base rock (previously messy LR)

New Oversized ETSS Skimmer

New sump and additional return flow

The skimmer in action

The Skimmer's version of green St Patty's Day beer

 

[attml]

All of this work is worthless unless something is actually accomplished. While I am by no means at a Steve Weast level, all of my stuff is happy and healthy. After the tank was set up for a few weeks I very selectively bought a few small pieces of macro algae free LR from my LFS. Those couple of small pieces of rock have seeded my whole system and I now have a ton of coralline, pods, sponges and tube worms everywhere. Most importantly I have ZERO macro algae. I have also noticed with the BB tank I have crazy encrusting on a scale like I have never had in any of my previous tanks. My stuff in previous tanks would always encrust but not quite like this Here are a few shots:

These are not overly impressive but since I started over almost completely with frags that is as good I can do for now. BB definitely helps make life easier because my skimmer does all of the work. I clean my glass less (every 5 days). I do a little less water changes (because I can) and unlike the other guys I don't even siphon. I just blow everything off the bottom with a powerhead once a month and put a micron filter sock on my return for 1 hour which catches all of the free floating suspended detritus from my overflows. I also like the fact that I don't have sand storms due to trying to keep good flow. I definitely think BB is a good thing and the easiest tank to maintain, but haven't given up on sand beds completely. My 55 gal mixed SPS, LPS & soft tank has a MSB and shows no sign of any problems but I know it is just a matter of time. When it looks like it is beginning to struggle it will probably become BB also.

 

[Bomber]

You know, encrusting is a sign that they want to get really big, really fast. They have to lay down a big base to support them later.

 

[galleon]

You know, encrusting is a sign that they want to get really big, really fast. They have to lay down a big base to support them later.

A good example of this in the wild is Atlantic elkhorn. The stuff lays down a huge base before the little branches start popping up. A huge base that has to support branches like this at the highest energy zone on the reef:

 

[Bomber]

cow plops

LOL

 

[galleon]

cow plops

LOL

:lol:

Did I mention the part where once the branches show up they grow 10-25 cm a year?

 

[fishdoc11]

Nice shots attml. Glad to see things are looking up with the rebuild

 

[attml]

Thanks for the replies guys! I am definitely glad I made the switch!

 

[SERVO]

So I just made the switch as well. Reading over all of these posts, I have always had sucess with my other tanks, but the pictures really changed my mind. How many of you guys with BB/SPS tanks are running Ozone? I'd like to get Bombers opinion as well.

I just finally got my rock into my tank after starting this project on April 13th.

I need to find the patients to avoid running over to the store that has been storing all of my acro colonies and throwing them into the tank. They have been their for 8 months, whats a couple of weeks more? LOL

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