Acro Color

victorcan

Member
Quick Question:

I have 4 Acros in my tank
1 Blue 3 Greens...

I had 2 nassty Leathers in my tank that I was told were releasing toxins into my water column.. 2 acros Were just introduced yesterday and were bright green.. Upon getting up this am 1 of the 2 new ones had started to turn brownish in color.. Obviously whatever toxins that were present are still present even in the absense of the Leathers.. I am running Carbon via a Reactor and mesh filled bag in my overflow box (in sump between fuge and sump) how long will it take to remove the toxin in order for the zooanthol to be replenished in my acros and how long till the acros color comes back given perfect water conditions ?? Am I looking at months, weeks, or days?

Even while the leathers were in the tank the acros were growing and sprouting new branches just color was missing...
 
Color loss could be due to a lot of things including change in lighting, or just the move to the new tank. You should check all of your basic parameters including Alk, Ca, Phosphate, etc...
 
Agree with what willstien posted.If your water quality is good it shouldn't take long if properly acclimated ,ime.I try to put eveything on the bottom when first introduced and it does seem acros take better and less likely to brownout;moving them up over the course of weeks.

As I understand it,"color " is mostly related to nutrients,light,flow& food.In higher nutrient water /lower light -the coral increases its zoanthallae numbers given the brown look.In lower nutrient- higher light ,zoanthallae decrease in numbers and color pigments move to the front given the pastel colors.
 
Color loss could be due to a lot of things including change in lighting, or just the move to the new tank. You should check all of your basic parameters including Alk, Ca, Phosphate, etc...

As stated water is perfect: 500ca, 1380mg, .05phos, 0 -Nh3/4 - NO3 NO4
PH is slightly low @7.8 (morning reading) Lighting has brand new 400watt 20K radium SO 99% its the toxin left behind by the leathers :(
 
If it is the toxins, you'll never get a definitive answer about when they wil go away. Water changes and carbon is about all you can do.
 
Couple of things:

Zooxanthelae is brown so browning does not indicate the coral needs to replenish it; it has more when it browns . In some cases may have too much leading to the zooxanthelae breaking it's symbiotic role and becoming pathogenic as it overproduces oxygen which can harm the coral.
A coral may also brown up when it is stressed by interference with the calcification process from low alkalinity, calcium or high PO4; or when a metal toxin or allelopathic compound intereferes with normal processes. If your coral's are growing as noted this seems unlikely.
Terpenoids and other organics from leathers are long chains which may not have an affinity for gac, until they breakdown breakdown. So, if the leathers are gone for a couple of days with carbon running,I don't think left over toxins are a problem.
Color relates to lighting, and the development of protective pigments by the coral for the most part when other conditions are in place, including: the ability to calcify in steady alkalinity ,a good temperature range , steady sg,good flow , lighting, low PO4 and NO3,and so on.
If you think lingering leather toxins are a problem for some reason, you might want to run some purigen too since it may have an affinity for some organics that gac won't and vice versa. Poly filter could be useful too.
Personally if the coral isn't showing other signs of stress, I'd wait it out for a week or two and then if it was still brown , I'd get it into brighter light and flow. I'd probably recheck my : sg, alk ,PO4 and NO3 too.
 
I don't know if I am lucky or not. I always have leather in my tank for over 11 years. And I have 2 neon green acro and purple blue acro too. They stay nice and colorful. Of course, I have GFO and GAC running all the time maybe that is why.:rollface:
 
How about Alk? 500ppm Ca seems a bit high, but I'm not sure if it's a bad thing...

If it is the toxins, you'll never get a definitive answer about when they wil go away. Water changes and carbon is about all you can do.

Alk Is perfect as wll Just measured it @ 7.7 DKH / 2.74 meq/L
Just remeasured Ca @ 490
Phos is 0 according to my test (salifert) and it was the LFS that gave me a# of .05<
Been doing 30 gallon changes (150 tank)w/ oceanic every 2 weeks
salinity .026 via refractometer
I run carbon regularly via a reactor and in sump ( 6-7cups)
I mean heck my water looks crystal clear and everything is beautiful in the tank (w/ the exceptioon of the Acro which as I stated is growing great just no color?)


Couple of things:

Zooxanthelae is brown so browning does not indicate the coral needs to replenish it; it has more when it browns . In some cases may have too much leading to the zooxanthelae breaking it's symbiotic role and becoming pathogenic as it overproduces oxygen which can harm the coral.
A coral may also brown up when it is stressed by interference with the calcification process from low alkalinity, calcium or high PO4; or when a metal toxin or allelopathic compound intereferes with normal processes. If your coral's are growing as noted this seems unlikely.
Terpenoids and other organics from leathers are long chains which may not have an affinity for gac, until they breakdown breakdown. So, if the leathers are gone for a couple of days with carbon running,I don't think left over toxins are a problem.
Color relates to lighting, and the development of protective pigments by the coral for the most part when other conditions are in place, including: the ability to calcify in steady alkalinity ,a good temperature range , steady sg,good flow , lighting, low PO4 and NO3,and so on.
If you think lingering leather toxins are a problem for some reason, you might want to run some purigen too since it may have an affinity for some organics that gac won't and vice versa. Poly filter could be useful too.
Personally if the coral isn't showing other signs of stress, I'd wait it out for a week or two and then if it was still brown , I'd get it into brighter light and flow. I'd probably recheck my : sg, alk ,PO4 and NO3 too.

TMZ thanks for jumping in...
I have extreme adequate lighting no doubt
1 400 watt 20 radium (via blueline ballast)
6 T5 w/ 4 Actinic (2 blue 2 purple) 2 14k superdaylight
12 Hi-Intensity LED fixtures

I was running all full blast for 8-9 hrs a/day but have recently(last 2 weeks) reduced to alternating cycles throughout the day 1st 2 hours warm up w/ LEDs then the Halide and 2 actinic T5 come on then 4 more T5's for like 2 hours (my high noon lighting) then all off but leds for last hour
ie: 3:30pm LED on
4:30pm Halide comes on w/ 2 actincs T5
7:30pm 4 T5's come on (14k superday & 2 more pink)
9:30pm 4 T5's Shut off
11:30pm Halide and 2 actinics off
12:00am Leds Off
Prior I had the lights all on @4 and all off @12:30 so its only been 2 weeks scaled back (and all bulbs are new or under their respectable lives.

So I think the lighting is optimum?
Is there a means by which I can measure the amt of Zooxanthelae in the system?? with the volume and frequency of water changes I just think that is highly unlikely but not ruling it out?

Additionally I run 2 vortech mp40W's mainly in reefcrest(yellow) in anti sync but regularly change the flow at least 1x p/day for at least 2 hours just to keep it changed up sometimes pulse long / or short or lagoonal but always back to crest
Temp is always 75-76' ( that may be a lil low?? ) but keeps nuisance algae from going bonkers
 
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never before this thread have I ever heard any allegations of allelopathic compounds being cited for turning any coral any color.

Allelopathic compounds can inhibit growth/health in competing species.

Maintaining colorful Acropora is definitely possible while maintaining softies in the same aquarium..............


intoduce new Acropora low (bottom of aquarium) and gradually raise them up.
 
Well that sux, i then just sold $140 worth of leathers for a 1/4 of what I paid for them believing that was the problem and I really liked the toadstool ! oh well .. I just talked to someone else said might be low alk? I have had my alk @2.7 for solid 6 months ? I just boosted it to 3.1 via drip line using soldium bicarb PH is stable @ 8.2 not sure if this is a waste of time or going to throw off the rest off my system now but I just want it right so my acros can flourish Think it will help??
 
there's a lot of variables!

there's a lot of variables!

especially when it comes to Acro coloration.

fwiw my aquarium normally runs at pH 7.8

I notice a loss of coloration when alkalinity gets above 11dKH
 
Just called ARC where I got all of em and they keep theirs @ like 9+dkh Ive always thought to keep it as close to natural as possible but he said if it drops its better to be at normal seawater than below which made sense to some degree.. I had it as high as 12 when I first set it up 7-8 months ago but vinager helped slowly bring it down over a month+ Too bad your in Rochester :)
 
FWIW, I run mine at 9.6dkh with calcium at 490ppm and mag 1480ppm. Ph 8.15 to 8.30. PO4 <.05ppm, NO3<0.1ppm. Temp 77 to 79,sg l.026. 250 l4k with vho actinics and a few leds. Halides run 7.5 hours per day, actinics 11 hours . Tanks are 24 inches deep. Colors and growth are good, imo. I keep sacrophyton, lobophyton, singularia and nepthia in the same system with lps and lots of sps..
 
FWIW, I run mine at 9.6dkh with calcium at 490ppm and mag 1480ppm. Ph 8.15 to 8.30. PO4 <.05ppm, NO3<0.1ppm. Temp 77 to 79,sg l.026. 250 l4k with vho actinics and a few leds. Halides run 7.5 hours per day, actinics 11 hours . Tanks are 24 inches deep. Colors and growth are good, imo. I keep sacrophyton, lobophyton, singularia and nepthia in the same system with lps and lots of sps..

See thats what Im worried about... Only thing I have different is my DKH & temp I run carbon non stop??? Just bought the radium 20k but w/ all the T5's even if the origional halide was past its life(12-16 months old) they should have made up for the difference ?? Really bizzare..
I dose Kalk 3x weekly (1gallon drip method) Wasnt buffering w/ sodium Bicarb till yesterday so maybe getting the alk up will help.. I hate to turn up the temp just because everything else is doing so well and water is crystal clear..
I have Mag additive but never add either as 1380 I figured was good maybe I should push it up as well??
I do 30 gallon water changes every 2-4 weeks using oceanic and only opther additives I was giving was Lugols solution and occasional strontium and molybdate...
 
Numbers look fine. Mag is fine,. I don't think you need to dose iodine unless you are growing gorgonians and then iodide would be more useful and safe than elemental iodine like lugols. No need for strontium either,imo.None of that is likely to cause the browning.

I haven't used 20k nor t-5s on sps so I have no comment on your lighting . I do use 20k on my lps tank. I haven,t played with a staggered photo period either.

There is no way to measure zooxanthelae in a tank. Even if their were it would be hard to tell the specific clade(A,B,C,D and subsets) and whether it was useable by a specific species of coral as they vary by species and location.
 
Numbers look fine. Mag is fine,. I don't think you need to dose iodine unless you are growing gorgonians and then iodide would be more useful and safe than elemental iodine like lugols. No need for strontium either,imo.None of that is likely to cause the browning.

I haven't used 20k nor t-5s on sps so I have no comment on your lighting . I do use 20k on my lps tank. I haven,t played with a staggered photo period either.

There is no way to measure zooxanthelae in a tank. Even if their were it would be hard to tell the specific clade(A,B,C,D and subsets) and whether it was useable by a specific species of coral as they vary by species and location.


I have 1 Gorgonian and some xenia That would still consume iodine
and I Dispense it as instructed.
I was using a 14k Hamilton and just trying to simulate the most natural lighting possible?? Figured the sun doesnt go on full blast in the ocean so......

I gotta get over to your place one of these days you are the talk of the area bro :)
Im not 100% sure but I think my acro has gotten a tiny hint of flaurecent green showing.. I may just be dillusional from starring at it for hours on end hoping to revert to its origional luster :)
The new acros are looking good thought they were browning out but it was just morning yesterday they have since returned to their full glory once the lights came on. Just added a mantis shrimp to my fuge cant wait to see him come out :) Ill have to snap a pic when he does ..
 
I think it may be a light issue. Stop giving back your corals!

How close are the acros to the lights.? My milipora browned out when I put it in and one month later, it is red again.

How long have you had the acros?

How long has the tank been up?

Can we see a picture?




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My light schedule
120g- MH on 2pm off 12am
Frag tanks on a 6 hour cycle (on 12pm off 6pm, on 12am off 6am)


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I think he (tmz) means gorgonians in a plural sense ,then, Iodide maybe worth supplementing.
Water changes help maintain Iodide,food especially marine algae like Nori also add Iodide.I dont test for it but have in the past and really didn't notice any difference.Tend to look at others tanks who have regularly grownout frags of gorgonians without supplementing in a chemical form.Many in this forum that dont dose it have had good results.
From everything Ive read,its seams (other than certain marine algae and gorgonians)its used to make toxic deterants and growth inhibiting compounds by marine algaes ,sponges and others. Not something I want to influence in my tank.Just my opinion.
Just saying you might want to look at the overall picture before deciding to add it.Good luck with what ever you decide.
 

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