Advice Needed - LED Upgrade

[dkeller_nc]

Guys - I've a dilemma that maybe you can offer an opinion on.

I've currently got 2 color AI Vegas over a 50 gal cube. The lack of UV/Violet in these fixtures is one factor that I attribute to poor SPS survivability/growth in this tank, and I need to make a change.

I've several possible routes:

1) Change 2 of the outer "blue" pucks in both Vegas to ones with a warm white, royal blue, UV, violet and deep blue. Total of 4 pucks, for a total of $200.

2) Buy the Hydra 52 upgrade kit for both fixtures - $600 total. The only thing I don't like about this option is that most of the components of the Vegas are throw-aways (seems wasteful).

3) Build a DIY fixture from multi-LED all-in-one chips, such as the LED Group Buy Lumia 5.2 pucks.

4) Build a DIY fixture from discrete but common-mount LEDs, such as Reef LED Labs pucks.

The first two options makes control easy - I've an Apex Neptune, and can simply buy the AI module, or I can just use the AI controller that I currently use with the Vegas.

For the second two options, things are more complex. The Neptune has 4 variable voltage outputs, and most recent driver boards from LED Group Buy, Reef LED Lab, Rapid LED, etc... need more than 4 channels and require PWM inputs. That means purchasing an extra couple of VDC to PWM converter boards, and an extra Neptune expansion module to provide additional channels.

Or... I can accept not integrating the lights into the Neptune, and set up a dedicated Arduino to control the lights. I'm fairly adept at programming, particularly PLCs, so this doesn't concern me. And it appears that the Arduino Mega board has 14 channels of PWM output, so I'd just need PWM driver boards from one of the DIY LED vendors.

All in all, it seems like the total cost of the Vega-to-Hydra 52 and DIY LED route will be about the same, with perhaps a couple of hundred extra for the DIY route depending on options and how much control I want. The Vega puck upgrade's definitely the cheapest option, but I'm concerned that having only 4 UV and 4 Violet diodes over the tank might not be sufficient to get the low-end spectrum.

Opinions welcome....

 

[zachts]

Before you go spending money and swithching things up hoping its the lights......

My first observation and opinion is that if you are not able to get SPS to grow, let alone survive with two AI Vegas over that tank then you have other problems. That is more than enough LED power to grow a successful SPS tank. (color is another matter and adding more violet would improve some areas of coloration, different issue)

I have a few questions for you:

1. how long has the tank been up and running? (post a full tank shot please).
2. what are your water parameters?
3. are you doing regular waterchanges?
4. what supplements do you dose?
5. other tank inhabitants, fish and the like and how often are they fed?


And probably the first question you should answer is:
6. Do you have access to a PAR meter to make sure you are not cooking your corals, especially new additions? Those optics can easily burn things and that is usually the biggest down fall with them when people state that they cant get coral to grow if no other factors are out of place.

Cheers!

 

[Amoo]

I personally would go with option 1. If things start to improve but not as significantly as you like, then look into option 2 If things don't improve at all, you still got a decent upgrade for the cost of 1 nice fish and can spend the money you saved hoping it was lighting, possibly chasing something else.

If you do decide to ditch your AIs and go more customizable, look into having a custom layout installed in a Reefbreeder Photon (It's what I did with mine and it was like an extra $10.) They carry pretty much the entire range of LED colors and you can pick and choose exactly where you want them and what optics. When I sat down and priced everything out this was the cheaper option for me then going full DIY.

 

[zachts]

I personally would go with option 1. If things start to improve but not as significantly as you like, then look into option 2 If things don't improve at all, you still got a decent upgrade for the cost of 1 nice fish and can spend the money you saved hoping it was lighting, possibly chasing something else.

.......ruling out everything else should be free (or mostly free)......as long as you know a local club member or hobbyist with a PAR meter anyway. the rest is simple to eliminate.

If SPS won't live it's not the lights, off the rack home depot shop lights will keep SPS alive (just an ugly shade of slow growing brown, all other factors in check)

 

[dkeller_nc]

I personally would go with option 1. If things start to improve but not as significantly as you like, then look into option 2 If things don't improve at all, you still got a decent upgrade for the cost of 1 nice fish and can spend the money you saved hoping it was lighting, possibly chasing something else.

If you do decide to ditch your AIs and go more customizable, look into having a custom layout installed in a Reefbreeder Photon (It's what I did with mine and it was like an extra $10.) They carry pretty much the entire range of LED colors and you can pick and choose exactly where you want them and what optics. When I sat down and priced everything out this was the cheaper option for me then going full DIY.

Yeah, I think option 1 might be the better one, since I definitely don't need any additional power out of these lights, and a planned larger tank will have a completely different lighting setup. Thanks for the note about reefbreeders - I wasn't aware they'd do a custom lighting layout.

 

[zachts]

there is also www.buildmyled.com if you want customizable apex compatable linear lighting that is built to high quality commercial standards.

Could just buy one supplemental strip with lots of 420nm LEDs for your $200 price point (420nm is by request they are not on the diy configuration tool yet)

Easily mounted between your AI lights for a very clean upgrade.

I still think it is not strictly your lighitng but more violet only helps out coloration.

 

[kk818]

if you end up changing out your vega units please pm me id like to purchase one from you.

 

[kenman345]

havent read through everything, but I was definitely thinking about this stuff myself. I think that with the impending announcements we may see at MACNA and how LED's are constantly becoming more common and invested in, that at this time, at least for me, I think it's a good idea to wait till after MACNA to see if anything is on the horizon that you might like better than anything else you might be considering. I know virtually every company I follow for supplies in this hobby is teasing special announcements at MACNA, or at least shooting for being able to be ready to give those announcements about future products.

 

[dkeller_nc]

if you end up changing out your vega units please pm me id like to purchase one from you.

Thanks for the offer, but for now I'm going to keep them. I would note that while growth is very much slower than the same fragged colonies under flourescents in my systems, LPS and "MPS" species such as turbinaria seem to do OK under these lights. Just not SPS, in particular acroporas.

The BuildMYLED units are definitely something I've considered. But for the price, I think I'd rather simply upgrade some of the Vega pucks. Other than the poor growth/survivability issues with SPS, I do very much like the AI lights - the spectrum controllability and built in timers are definitely helpful. Perhaps I should simply switch out all of my LPS corals to the LED system and all of my SPS corals to the fluorescent tanks - that'd be an easy solution, but I'm much more stubborn than that.