AEFW experiments and study

[trueblackpercula]

No need to argue guys.

The OP has a CLEAR idea as to what is going to be tested. The OP is assisted by Dr Kate Rawlinson. I highly doubt they would venture to test things just because someone mentions it here in this thread - unless it was well known to be a good weapon against AEFW. Furthermore, biological controls aren't suitable in our situation, in my opinion for two reasons:

1. Will not be easy for most hobbyists to get hold of unless the species can be EASILY bred.

2. Biological controls arent always 100% successful and usually more of a control than eradication.

What we need is something like a dip that kills eggs, or an in tank solution without damaging the other livestock.

At the start of the thread Tektite stated that a dip to kill the embryos inside the eggs has already been discovered! But that aspect will be experimented on later.

That itself is a big breakthrough.

The intended studies such as survival period etc of the AEFW's will help us understand and in turn we will be better informed as to appropriate measures to take.

In any event, having suffered from these pests in the past, and too scared to buy any further acros for my tank (have around 45 Acros all healthy) I am very grateful to Tektite for the time and effort she is putting into this. :beer:

Very well put

 

[ormet]

No need to argue guys.

j/k well put.

 

[trueblackpercula]

I am sorry

 

[sahin]

j/k well put.

I am sorry

My post wasnt meant to offend anyone; rather to simply explain that Tektite is following certain protocols etc.

:love1:

 

[SoloGarth]

I can't agree more. This thread should stick to scientific, verified information regarding AEFW and suspected chemical treatments that can be tested against them. Biological controls are always hit and miss and are rarely ever able to eradicate the problem entirely.

 

[trueblackpercula]

I can't agree more. This thread should stick to scientific, verified information regarding AEFW and suspected chemical treatments that can be tested against them. Biological controls are always hit and miss and are rarely ever able to eradicate the problem entirely.

Well I agree but also disagree, I am one that uses chemicals as an absolute last resort.
Why not include what eats them In nature?

 

[markalot]

Well I agree but also disagree, I am one that uses chemicals as an absolute last resort.
Why not include what eats them In nature?

No reason, IMO, but it may not be the subject of these particular experiments. In order to stay sane and within budget only a specific set of 'things' are being tested this time around.

Besides, I have added 3 different fish told to control the common brown flatworms and not one of them has eaten any. I get really weary hearing all these suggestions about what worked and what did not work for biological control. It's hit or miss at best, and without proper scientific documentation it may be just a coincidence.

I'd love to see a video of biological control of brown flatworms. If they eat them someone should be able to catch it on video. Anecdotal evidence, while well intentioned, just doesn't cut it in my opinion.

 

[tektite]

Well, this thread blew up today lol.

The purpose of this thread at this time is to study the AEFW lifecycle in depth. What is not being studied (YET) in this thread is ways of eradication. There are many other threads out there with different kill methods being experimented with, that for now are better sources of information for those looking to get rid of their AEFW. Lifecycle knowledge such as hatch time, time to sexual maturity, starvation periods of all AEFW sizes with no access to Acropora, are all very necessary pieces of information we need to know more about AEFW. For one, all those pieces of information are needed to know for certain how long quarantine periods must be. So much information out there is anecdotal, combinations of "I heard somewhere...", guesses based on casual observations, and extrapolations based on other kinds of very unrelated flatworm species. I know its boring for most people, but the end knowledge we'll all gain from these experiments will only help reefers in the future.

AEFW are spreading at an extremely alarming rate among reef aquariums, well over half the SPS tanks I've observed have them including well established systems of advanced reef hobbyists who didn't even know they had them, who frequently sell SPS frags to many others, in LFS...I've heard of or seen many more SPS tanks completely devastated by AEFW. we need to fully understand everything we can about these little guys. That's why I've chosen to begin this long-term experiment process, dedicate a lot of my own personal resources and time, someone needs to do it

Once more is known about AEFW in general, I'll begin eradication tests, but for now that is in the future. Despite very few posts lately, these current tests are taking a lot of my time, I simply don't have the time or resources to do every test I want to run at the same time, right now. I'll get there, it just won't be a fast process.

 

[AndreMF]

Thank you for your continued effort Tektite, it is much aprechiated. I have "request" in regards to life cycle research. My tank was heavily infected And I dipped corals weekly, seeemingly to no avail(?). Then my LFS ran out of "revive" from two little fishies and somehow I deceided I would see how long it would take before I noticed bite marks again when not dipping. It is now just over two months with no dips and no sign of AEFW. There are two options: 1)My tank is AEFW free. 2) all the larger individuals has been killed and the AEFW still present are too small to leave visual bite marks/cause local tissue loss. Hence my "request". Would it be possible to include in your study: Transfer of eggs (chop off a piece with eggs and superglue close) to a healthy acro and measure time from infestation(by eggs) to symptoms? Pretty please with sugar on top?

André Of Norway.
Disclaimer: all spelling mistakes copyright iphones autocorrect, not my norwegianess.

 

[reefwiser]

Article. On AEFW in the wild.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/04/140411091721.htm

 

[tektite]

Would it be possible to include in your study: Transfer of eggs (chop off a piece with eggs and superglue close) to a healthy acro and measure time from infestation(by eggs) to symptoms? Pretty please with sugar on top

Hi Andre, I would love to test something like that, but unfortunately I couldn't come up with anything conclusive for you. Too many variables. It can vary drastically from species to species. Thin skinned acros like echinata or caroliniana show bite marks fairly quickly. Other species take longer to show bite marks even with the same number of AEFW on them. Most of all, millepora are amazing at living with AEFW and showing no signs. They can be heavily infested and show no bite marks and have have great polyp extension.

 

[tektite]

Update:

Dr. Rawlinson is down here in Texas right now, we're beginning some more in-depth studies of the AEFW. Currently looking at answering how long it takes for eggs to hatch and how long it takes for newly hatched larvae to die with no access to food. Also whether or not early hatching AEFW are still in the larval stage or if they all hatch as juveniles (would affect how they might be able to travel once hatched, if they just crawl as juveniles or swim as larvae). Planning other experiments as well.

 

[flamron]

I have found AEFW again...

:/

 

[ritter6788]

Thin skinned acros like echinata or caroliniana show bite marks fairly quickly. Other species take longer to show bite marks even with the same number of AEFW on them. Most of all, millepora are amazing at living with AEFW and showing no signs. They can be heavily infested and show no bite marks and have have great polyp extension.

I'm having the exact opposite experience in my tank. My millis were devastated by AEFW. Heavily infested with eggs and flesh was being eaten off the millis in places. I could see bite marks and PE was horrible. The smooth skinned Acros are not showing any signs of AEFW.

 

[tektite]

That's interesting! Hm, I wonder if some populations of AEFW develop species preference for food.

 

[flamron]

That's interesting! Hm, I wonder if some populations of AEFW develop species preference for food.

My first go around with them saw my tricolor largely affected and my milles were completely unaffected.

 

[ritter6788]

I discovered I had AEFW by removing a pink milli that was loosing color. I ended up loosing the whole colony. It looked like the color was being eaten off the coral from the bottom up.

This is my blue milli I recently removed, fragged and dipped.

This is how bad it looked before I removed it.



This is the same milli remains now dried out.


You can see the dried AEFW eggs and the path they were eating through the milli flesh.

I have several smooth skinned Acros in my tank that are not showing any sign of AEFW.

 

[Finland]

I'm having the exact opposite experience in my tank. My millis were devastated by AEFW. Heavily infested with eggs and flesh was being eaten off the millis in places. I could see bite marks and PE was horrible. The smooth skinned Acros are not showing any signs of AEFW.

When I had aefw, I was in the same boat. Millies seemed to be the snack of choice. Lost 3 colonies, while smooth skinned were unaffected.

 

[tektite]

I'm having the exact opposite experience in my tank. My millis were devastated by AEFW. Heavily infested with eggs and flesh was being eaten off the millis in places. I could see bite marks and PE was horrible. The smooth skinned Acros are not showing any signs of AEFW.

When I had aefw, I was in the same boat. Millies seemed to be the snack of choice. Lost 3 colonies, while smooth skinned were unaffected.

To be clear, I was saying that if both colonies are infested at the same time with the same number of worms, millis will show signs later than smooth-skinned acros. AEFW LOVE millis, that's for sure!

I am curious, for both of you, how far apart physically were your milli and smooth skinned acros?

 

[tektite]

Interesting update: Preliminary study indicates that AEFW juveniles die within 24 hours of hatching with no access to food.