B-ionic in SPS coral systems

penfold2 said:
There are tons of extremely successful SPS tanks that have been using DIY 2-part for years, so it is also a proven method. And there is quite a bit of money to be saved on a tank filled with fast growing SPS. If you have modest calcification requirements and feel better about commercial 2-part then use it. It certainly won't hurt. But for many people DIY 2-part is the no-brainer. From the coral's perspective, it makes no difference which you use.
Click to expand...

Agreed.........I didnt mean to imply that DIY 2 part is not proven. It clearly works well also. But, what I was thinking is there may be a consistency problem with the DIY route. Something can always go wrong when mixing stuff yourself. Mix up 50 batches of the DIY 2 part, and there is probably going to be a little inconsistency amongst the batches. I doubt that the comercial mixes would vary in chemical make-up too much, which would equal to better stability.
My opinion could also have something to do with the fact that I would prob. just prefer to buy the B-ionic gallons, drop the dosing pump tube into the gallon jug, and I am good to go, lol. :lolspin: Easy and proven to work.
The b-ionic prob works well and is more cost effective for smaller tanks, say under 100 gallons, where as the DIY 2-part savings would prob come into effect when dealing with larger tanks. I dont think I would consider b-ionic if I was dealing with hundreds(or more) of gallons. The DIY route would be the logical choice then.

Herbie
 
So, I am thinking of going with the ESV. Its proven and easy. Money isnt a concern, so what other reason should I be thinking of going with a DIY 2 part over the ESV b-ionic? The small amount of money saved using the DIY 2-part doesnt seem cost effective in the grand scheme of things really. I mean, for all the money we spend on our tanks, does saving a small amount of $$$ on a DIY product vs a proven commercial product really seem like its worth it ???
Hey, I am all for saving some money (I use Mrs. Wages too ), but for the ease of use, and proven results............the ESV B-ionic really seems like a no-brainer.
If the only concern is a small amount of monetary savings in the DIY vs the ESV, well for my tank........I am willing to spend a few more bucks.
Click to expand...

Just some FYI..........

It costs me 60 cents to make a gallon of Alk soulution. A gallon of Bionic is approx. $14 without shipping costs.

A gallon of Calcium is even less to make. So basically it cost me less than $1.00 for both solutions, to $28 for Bionic.

Baking soda has to follow certain quality parameters to be labeled as pure and sold.

Manufacturers of the Calcium Chloride have MSDS sheets and list everything that is in the ingredients. Here Randy tested Dow Flake against ESV and they are very similar.

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2004/3/chemistry

Ultimately any bad mixing comes down to human error, so that's not a factor either way.

As far as reliability, Randys two part has been around for 9 years.
 
I wasnt knocking the 2 part, just debating the difference between the b-ionic and DIY 2 part..........if the money savings was not a factor. It just comes down to saving some money vs. ease of use........OR is there something extra in the b-ionic that is a mystery to everyone ??? :reading: .

My main display and frag tank are small, and combined are not more than 100 G. So $30. for the b-ionic every few months is not going be a factor. Thats what I was getting at.

Guess I will have to find the link to Randys 2 part.
If I make it in bulk, is there a shelf life I need to worry about ?

Herbie
 
The annual costs for B-Ionic are a bit exaggerated in the article. Based one what people with heavy sps loads are dosing, I estimated an annual cost of ~$150. Which is around 50-70 dollars more than the annual cost of my calcium reactor. As I stated earlier with no evidence, it seems B-Ionic is very concentrated.
 
the great part about this hobby is that we have so many choices when it comes to equipment and methods. Results achieved by some might not be the same that are achieved by others following the same procedures and methods. There will never be a definitive answer as to which one is better as this all comes down to personal preference. I know that after trying BRS, DIY, Ca Reactor and ESV my personal preference is using the ESV. I like the way my tank looks and how my corals have responded to me going back to ESV. Based on my current stocking levels the bulk buckets will last me almost 9 months. Im ok with the added cost because of the results that I have experienced when using ESV.

I do love these types of threads though because there is a wealth of knowledge available to hobbyists on this site and its always great to hear someone else's opinions and experiences.
 
Steve, it was your posts that convinced me to give dosing a try on my 180. My 70g softie tank has been running flawlessly with a dosing pump, so that helped as well. But my biggest holdup with my 180g sps was the concern of cost. I assumed it would take a lot of two-part to replace my calcium reactor. Seeing your posts about the B-Ionic buckets lasting you almost 9 months on a 300g helped sell me. Last week, I disconnected the Ca reactor after the CO2 was exhausted. I added a dosing pump with ESV. I'm not sure what my daily dose needs to be yet, so I'm testing every few days and dialing it in for now.
 
In my situation the money savings would be dramatic. I would be dosing about 1 gallon of DIY 2 part every 10 days or a gallon of B Ionic every 17 days. That is several hundred dollars per year, to sink into this hobby in other areas.:fun2:

Manufacturers of the Calcium Chloride have MSDS sheets and list everything that is in the ingredients. Here Randy tested Dow Flake against ESV and they are very similar.
Click to expand...

Randy actually ran tests on dow flake himself. The MSDS can not be used to determine if a product is reef safe. It doesn't have to list many contaminants that could be present in large enough concentrations to cause problems.
 
^that seems like a lot for the size tank you have. If I ever get close to that I'll have to come up with something more affordable. As of now, dosing 70ml of ESV a day isn't bad at all.
 
cFloor said:
^that seems like a lot for the size tank you have. If I ever get close to that I'll have to come up with something more affordable. As of now, dosing 70ml of ESV a day isn't bad at all.
Click to expand...

It's all SPS with very few LPS and a clam. Thankfully with my surface area the evaporation allows me to use only kalk. That costs less than $20 a year.
 
I go with a DIY 2 part. I used to use ESV products. However it's just to pricey and I didn't see the added value (in my tank). I've been using BRS pretty much since they first opened the shop but exclusively on my current system which is going on about 3 years in just a few months. If I felt I could achieve better results with ESV I would switch. As far as adding extras to the tank or raising salinity, that’s really only a concern if you are a part of the non-water change camp. I change my water every 2-3 weeks and I don't see any issues. Currently I'm using 210ml+ a day in about 80 gallons of water.

Because of my remote location I need to make sure I always have enough on hand which is why I like to go with the DIY method. It's easy to store powder and it ships cheaper.
I have thought about going to DOW flake + pool supply products, which would save me even more money, but even though everything I've seen says it's safe I can't bring myself to tossing ice melt in my tank. ;)
 
jerpa said:
4.3 gallons
Click to expand...

That's amazing for 200 gallons. 12 years ago, a friend maintained his Calcium/Alk on a 500-gallon reef with 5-gallons of kalk a day exclusively. It had the largest tabling Acropora I have ever laid my eyes on. Considering that your tank is less than half the volume, you must have a ton of clams and sps. Have you considered a Calcium reactor?

DSCN0046.jpg

DSCN0023.jpg
 
Mark said:
Considering that your tank is less than half the volume, you must have a ton of clams and sps. Have you considered a Calcium reactor?
Click to expand...

Only one clam, about 30 corals from small frags to small colonies. It's 2.5 dKh per day which doesn't seem too high to me. Before I added any corals the coralline algae alone was consuming almost 1 dKh per day. The clam increased the consumpion by .5 dKh on its own which was surprising considering its a 3-4 inch crocea. I haven't tried a calcium reactor and don't intend to. Kalk is as simple as filling my ATO reservoir once a week and adding kalk every few months.
 
Mark said:
Steve, it was your posts that convinced me to give dosing a try on my 180. My 70g softie tank has been running flawlessly with a dosing pump, so that helped as well. But my biggest holdup with my 180g sps was the concern of cost. I assumed it would take a lot of two-part to replace my calcium reactor. Seeing your posts about the B-Ionic buckets lasting you almost 9 months on a 300g helped sell me. Last week, I disconnected the Ca reactor after the CO2 was exhausted. I added a dosing pump with ESV. I'm not sure what my daily dose needs to be yet, so I'm testing every few days and dialing it in for now.
Click to expand...

It was a difficult decision for me to switch back to 2 part because I had invested so much in my Ca reactor. I will keep it and possibly use it some day if the demand warrants it.

jerpa said:
Kalk is as simple as filling my ATO reservoir once a week and adding kalk every few months.
Click to expand...

Sounds too simple but possibly worth a try at some point!
 
Well after much deliberation, I am going to start with the B-ionic. I will monitor my usage and if it gets to be more cost effective, I will switch to Randy's 2-part mix.
Just ordered 2 Drews dosers and gallon jugs of B-ionic from BRS. I will control the dosers via my RKL (had to add another PC4). I will start with the recommended 1 ml per 4 gallons, and adjust from there. This will be a trial run in my 60 cube to see if switching over from Kalk will be beneficial.

Thanks for the help !

Herbie
 
Herbie, if you can find the 5 gallon version it will be cheaper in the long run than buying the 1 gallon jugs of B-Ionic. They should be around $80 plus shipping if you order online. You just need to add RODI to it and mix it very well. I fill it up and roll the bucket down a hill a few times(seriously much easier than mixing it yourself). That one setup should last you about a year on a 60 thats decently stocked with SPS, I have a 57 rimless and its not packed with SPS but decent and I am about 14 months in on this set of buckets
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

K
Help: SPS peeling strangely.
Replies
5
Views
203
griss
griss
Mel-E-Mel
Time to retire the hobby
Replies
1
Views
83
nanoguy
nanoguy
cilyjr
Cilyjr 320 gallon on the central coast
Replies
12
Views
519
rogerwilco357
rogerwilco357
65madreefer
Not new just haven’t been in it forever
Replies
13
Views
574
65madreefer
65madreefer
Dr. Reef
Dr. Reef's XMAS sale 20% off
Replies
0
Views
79
Dr. Reef
Dr. Reef
Back
Top