Butterflytown - 240 FOWLR
- Thread starter caribfan
- Start date
LargeAngels
Premium Member
IME Cupramine has never affected the bio filter in a negative way.
Fiish
Member
That's interesting, I'm about to build a QT tank but I want to add an established biological filter, like matt's, but I have no idea what to use, bioballs or marinepure blocks, although I hope that Matt will soon be able to show how his QT tank is instaled and of course see how those fantastic butterflies continue.
Hey guys, apologize it's taken me a minute to reply. I haven't really been active in a long time.
My QT is not currently set up, but when it was, I never noticed that the cupramine effected the biological filter.
My QT is a 50 gallon breeder with a piece of glass at one end with a small overflow notched out, the bio balls sit on the other side of the glass. There is also a return pump there.
One thing I have done in the past is left about half the bioballs that my QT filter can hold in the sump for the display tank. If I have to set up the QT, I just pull those active bioballs out of the sump and I'm ready to go. I'll typically use water from my DT to set up the QT too.
Hope that makes sense.
I'm quite surprised, extraordinary thread, I was able to read the whole thing in about a week but it was worth it. Matt, any update ?? It's been a long time since 4 months
I'm sad to say, I've kind of put the hobby in hold the past couple years. My tank is a shadow of what it used to be, although I've been toying with the notion of getting things going again.
My wife and I started a small produce farm in 2018 and most of my time has been dedicated to that.
The tank is up and running, although the only fish I kept were the dwarf angels. There is still a venustus, multi bar, lemon peel and like a 10 yr old Eibli. I think the futballer damsel is in there as well.
I love a butterfly tank, I'll do my best to help answer any questions. Not sure if he's still active on this forum, but SDguy is a wealth of knowledge too and has/had a great butterfly collection as well.
Fiish
Member
Hi Matt, of course your quarantine method makes a lot of sense, I'm just looking for options to configure mine in the near future. I learned a lot from this thread and I'm also reading Peter's thread, and gathering information. I hope you get back to work with the tank when you can, those angels that you still have are extraordinary, and of course I wish you the best of luck with the farm.
Quarantine is an absolute necessity IMO. My brother in law just added fish to his tank and didn't quarantine. Almost everything is gone now...ich.
What are your plans for a tank? You could probably do something less elaborate than my set up. I know some folks will just keep a sponge filter or two in their dumps and use those as cultured media when they set up a qt.
Another option is to just have a permanent quarantine tank and keep a couple damsels in there to keep the filter sustained. Kind of cruel to put the damsels through so much treatment though.
Fiish
Member
Well, I currently have a 79 gallon tank that continues to run after I lost my fishes last year. But I have not uninstalled it, and I'm getting ideas to configure the qt, I have several options, many say that it is not good to have the qt set, I'm only thinking of growing bioballs in the main tank and using them in the qt when new fish arrive. It doesn't fit much in 79 gallons anyway and when I'm successful with this tank I can start to think about a larger urn.
A 10 or 20 gallon would likely be all you need if your DT is a 79 gallon.
It's all about being able to keep the fish in an appropriate sized tank during the QT process. I wouldn't quarantine a show size Naso for a 300 gallon in a 10 gallon, but for a short period (4-6 weeks) that fish would do fine in a standard 55 gallon.
It's all about being able to keep the fish in an appropriate sized tank during the QT process. I wouldn't quarantine a show size Naso for a 300 gallon in a 10 gallon, but for a short period (4-6 weeks) that fish would do fine in a standard 55 gallon.
Fiish
Member
20 gallons do you think it's wise to treat a couple of butterflies or a couple of dwarf angels for 6 or 8 weeks? You could use rejilux to reduce aggression if there is one. These are the fish I have in mind.
aikenreefkeeper
Member
Matt,
So I was thinking about the four Butterflies for my tank:
1: Chaetodon kleini
2: Chaetodon ulietensis
3: Heniochus singularis
4: Chaetodon rafflesi
and with that some pajama cardinals
Your knowledge would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Dean
So I was thinking about the four Butterflies for my tank:
1: Chaetodon kleini
2: Chaetodon ulietensis
3: Heniochus singularis
4: Chaetodon rafflesi
and with that some pajama cardinals
Your knowledge would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Dean
Apologize I missed your question.
I treat for four weeks with cupramine, and I take 6-8 days to get to the effective dose.
Not familiar with rejilux.
Most fish will be fine in a 20 gallon for 6-8 weeks, as long as you don't overcrowd and have a suitable biological filter.
Those all seem like decent choices, just be sure to feed them a good quality food. I still use the LRS foods. For butterflies, a freshly cracked little neck clam will usually entice them to eat.
I think having a good skimmer is important too, for the waste removal but also oxygenation of the water.
What size tank are these fish going into?
Did a 60 gallon water change for the first time in forever, not proud of that. Nitrates weren’t too far off the chart, maybe 60 ppm.
The current stocking rate is not great, only one butterfly at the moment, and it’s scheduled for removal.
The existing list is:
-centropyge venustus
-centropyge eibli - going on 9+ years I think
-centropyge flavissima
-paracentropyge multifasciata
-zebrasoma flavescens
-chrysiptera annulata
-johnrandallia nigrirostris
On the short list for addition:
-dusky butterfly
-rainford butterfly
-pair of Bella gobies
-leopard wrasse trio (new territory here for me)
-second venustus angel
-second multibar angel
The tank is still a mess, I basically just put the rock in without any thought when I set it back up. If I get it aqua apes, I’ll try to post some pictures or a video..
The current stocking rate is not great, only one butterfly at the moment, and it’s scheduled for removal.
The existing list is:
-centropyge venustus
-centropyge eibli - going on 9+ years I think
-centropyge flavissima
-paracentropyge multifasciata
-zebrasoma flavescens
-chrysiptera annulata
-johnrandallia nigrirostris
On the short list for addition:
-dusky butterfly
-rainford butterfly
-pair of Bella gobies
-leopard wrasse trio (new territory here for me)
-second venustus angel
-second multibar angel
The tank is still a mess, I basically just put the rock in without any thought when I set it back up. If I get it aqua apes, I’ll try to post some pictures or a video..
aikenreefkeeper
Member
Matt,
My tank is a 60" x 15" x 30" tall tank with a Protein Skimmer, sock filter. I clean the sock filter 3/week and the Skimmer 1/week.
I have a 10 gallon tank that I use for QT. I use a HOB filter, PVC elbows for hiding and a heater.
I have a few questions if you don't mind. Who are you getting your fish from now? I have had very poor luck with anything staying alive. Do you quarantine and observe or do you assume that everything is infected and just start treatment automatically? Is a 10 gallon tank too small for the 2" to 3" butterflies? Maybe two fish at a time?
My plan this time is to use the water from my DT to start the QT with along with a couple of cups of sand from the DT. I have a filter for the HOB in my DT sump.
I appreciate the help. Hope you are doing well with the farm.
Dean
My tank is a 60" x 15" x 30" tall tank with a Protein Skimmer, sock filter. I clean the sock filter 3/week and the Skimmer 1/week.
I have a 10 gallon tank that I use for QT. I use a HOB filter, PVC elbows for hiding and a heater.
I have a few questions if you don't mind. Who are you getting your fish from now? I have had very poor luck with anything staying alive. Do you quarantine and observe or do you assume that everything is infected and just start treatment automatically? Is a 10 gallon tank too small for the 2" to 3" butterflies? Maybe two fish at a time?
My plan this time is to use the water from my DT to start the QT with along with a couple of cups of sand from the DT. I have a filter for the HOB in my DT sump.
I appreciate the help. Hope you are doing well with the farm.
Dean
Hey Dean,
I get most of my livestock from a good friend of mine in town. He's been in the hobby for 30+ years and doesn't really do retail, but still orders for his service accounts. I started working for him when I was 16 and I'm 38 now. Probably not a lot of help for you here.
Liveaquaria has been good for me in the past, but they are pricey IMO and I haven't ordered from them in some time. If there is no local option, they may be your best bet.
I DO assume everything his C. Irritans (ich), but I DON'T start treating right away, unless of course an outbreak shows up or the fish is obviously infected. I typically spend 1 - 3 weeks getting the fish used to captivity and recognizing me as a food source. If you have the choice, you want that fish eating and comfortable and not stressed out to begin with before you introduce medication.
A 10 gallon is fine, but a 20 would be better.
I don't love a hang-on the back filter, but if it's all you've got it will probably work. You want to set this tank up as though it's going to be up for several months (although it may not need to be). It's important to have a good biological filter going ahead of introducing fish. What type of HOB filter is it? What is the media?
I'd recommend a seachem ammonia badge when you first set up the QT. It sticks right to the glass and lets you know visually if you start to get into trouble on the ammonia. Ammonia will kill a fish a lot quicker than flukes or ich.
I would ditch the sand, ideally nothing calcium based in your QT, it can interfere with the medications. I'd just go bare bottom tank, PVC fittings for hiding spots, no lights, at least not initially and that hang on the back filter.
I'd use 2/3 DT water and 1/3 new water.
Farm is going well, dealing with this winter storm in Ohio at the moment, but it's mostly just slushy rain snow garbage at this point. I'll be starting 10,000 onions here in the next week. Spring is right around the corner.
Fiish
Member
Your cattle are still excellent Matt, thanks for answering my questions about the QT tank and the procedures, now everything is clearer thanks to you and Peter. Post photos as soon as you can, it's great that you can keep Multifasciatus and Venustus for a long time.
Got the QT set back up, it was a mess. I suppose that's what you get for leaving a tank in a barn. I'm supposed to have a new C. Flavirostris coming tomorrow, hope the weather doesn't mess with the shipment.
I'll try to get some pictures posted, I need to learn how to do that again.
I'll try to get some pictures posted, I need to learn how to do that again.
aikenreefkeeper
Member
Matt,
Thanks for the quick response. The HOB is one of the smaller Marineland units. It has the filter floss filter with carbon. It also has the bio-wheel. I did elect to ditch the sand. Instead, I took a piece of live rock out of the DT and put it in the QT. I live in Arizona, so if I have to medicate, I will take it out and let the Arizona Sun nuke it to kill off any pathogens.
Correct me if I am wrong, you keep bio balls in the sump of your display tank and then move them to your QT when you need to use it? Do they not absorb the medications?
Thanks for the quick response. The HOB is one of the smaller Marineland units. It has the filter floss filter with carbon. It also has the bio-wheel. I did elect to ditch the sand. Instead, I took a piece of live rock out of the DT and put it in the QT. I live in Arizona, so if I have to medicate, I will take it out and let the Arizona Sun nuke it to kill off any pathogens.
Correct me if I am wrong, you keep bio balls in the sump of your display tank and then move them to your QT when you need to use it? Do they not absorb the medications?
