Cone or not to cone..., that is the question!

[GSMguy]

Alpha cones necks are too large. Very badly balanced skimmer. Warner marine and skimz are coming up imho. Can't beat ati and bk and deltec skimmers tho. You do not need a cone! This much debate, since cones came out, should tell you something. IT'S ALL ABOUT THE BALANCE PEOPLE! I believe ati just got lucky with that first cones success. Octopus cones are decent performers, but I'd bank on skimz and warner marines new design to make bigger waves in an ocean of bunk skimmers. Look for the ones with a, mortgage price tag, to fall in line soon. Watch

It was ATB not ATI that had the first cone.

 

[allsps40]

I switch to a cone skimmer and wow is there a difference.

 

[Drae]

Atb.Thanks for the correction. I twist them around sometimes. Great products from both.

 

[Reefnooblet]

Well I lied..

I ended up ordering the : Reef Octopus SUPER SRO 5000INT

 

[NyReefNoob]

and matching a proper sized skimmer for your tank will make more of a differance then design

 

[Reefnooblet]

Well my display will be a 300g with a 80-100g sump, I think I matched up to the right skimmer...

 

[lolgranny]

Hows the skimmer coming along? Did you recieve it yet? Im debating on that guy or the SRO XP5000 int or SWC 3000.... I have a poll up right now and its across the board. I think the SRO xp 5000 is my first thought. Its the cone version, but im not set in stone

 

[PJchicago]

I got the xp3000 ext about 2 months ago. I can't say how impressed I am with this skimmer. I added the auto neck cleaner and the collection cup with the auto shut off float switch. I drilled the bottom of the collection chamber, plumbed it to my drain and put a valve on it.

Cleaning my old skimmer was the thing I hated most. I now skim wet, about a gallon plus a day, drain it with a simple valve and have not cleaned it yet. I thought the neck cleaner was a little over the top when I ordered it, but this is the greatest thing so far. With the valve and float switch it can go crazy and no overflow at all. The pump, bubbles and performance are just sick. The pump is not the most quiet but no louder than the rest of my equipment. So far I think this is going to be cleaned quarterly which is crazy for a skimmer and since it is skimming wet I also have no stinky skimmer smell which I hate.

Best money hands down spent on my reef so far.

 

[tntneon]

Another reason that cones are more effective is the cone shape means the internal volume decreases as you go up the cone. this means less water and weight on the pump and this leads to a more efficient power factor and air/water mixture from the pump.

This is not true !
hydrostatic pressure is (pump pressure) only rises as the height of waterlevel rises , form doesn't make a difference .

greetingzz tntneon

 

[ksed]

Well said!
I had a cylinder as well as a cone skimmer with the 1500 Askoll pump. The power factor was the same for both at approx. .32-.34. That is fairly low.
A friend of mine has one of the new Deltecs which has hardly any cone on it.
When measure power factor it came in at an impressive .68. That is very high for a pinwheel pump.

This is not true !
hydrostatic pressure is (pump pressure) only rises as the height of waterlevel rises , form doesn't make a difference .

greetingzz tntneon

 

[Reefnooblet]

Hows the skimmer coming along? Did you recieve it yet? Im debating on that guy or the SRO XP5000 int or SWC 3000.... I have a poll up right now and its across the board. I think the SRO xp 5000 is my first thought. Its the cone version, but im not set in stone

No it is still on back order, Just as well as my tank still hasn't come in yet. :mad2:

 

[jamesdawson]

This is not true !
hydrostatic pressure is (pump pressure) only rises as the height of waterlevel rises , form doesn't make a difference .

greetingzz tntneon

Its a simple matter of physics. A cone with the same base as a cylinder will have less volume as you go up the cone. Less volume=less water.

Less water=less weight on the pump. Less weight (hydrostatic pressure) will lead to a more efficient pump to one degree or another. The effect might not be large, buts its there.

 

[sirreal63]

Interesting discussion on pressure...think I will keep using a recirc skimmer and skip the whole cone fad and not worry about head pressure. As has been said so many times, the correct balance of air to water in any container will skim efficiently. There has been no measurable advantage to a cone, and with the AA testing, it is funny how the worst performing skimmer was a cone yet so many people defend their purchase to the death, or maybe to justify falling for hype.

 

[mussel and hate]

I think Archimedes demonstrated that it's the column height that determines pressure as opposed to water volume. Cone/cylinder shape shouldn't have any impact on pressure.

 

[mkengr45]

I think Archimedes demonstrated that it's the column height that determines pressure as opposed to water volume. Cone/cylinder shape shouldn't have any impact on pressure.

Yes. Pressure is P=(density of fluid)*(gravity)*(height).....volume does not matter. The skimmer could be 50 feet wide but if it is only 20 inches tall it will have the same pressure at the bottom as a 1 inch wide 20 inch tall skimmer.

 

[mkengr45]

I forgot to add that this assumes a uniform density. So, we are not dealing with a constant density as you look at the fluid from bottom to top of the skimmer.

 

[mkengr45]

I am also interested in the cone or not to cone debate. I am usng an octopus 150 nw on a 30 cube...sized far too big I know. I wonder if I would be better off with a smaller cone skimmer like the Octopus 110 nwb?

 

[Kolognekoral]

Yes. Pressure is P=(density of fluid)*(gravity)*(height).....volume does not matter. The skimmer could be 50 feet wide but if it is only 20 inches tall it will have the same pressure at the bottom as a 1 inch wide 20 inch tall skimmer.

The formula does not aply to a cane shape! It is for a cylinder. For a cone we must consider the changing area of the base to calculate the average pressure. In a cone, the pressure will increase or decrease in relation to the changing volume of the increments of the cone in relation to gravity.

did I explain that right?

 

[mkengr45]

The formula does not aply to a cane shape! It is for a cylinder. For a cone we must consider the changing area of the base to calculate the average pressure. In a cone, the pressure will increase or decrease in relation to the changing volume of the increments of the cone in relation to gravity.

did I explain that right?

I believe you are incorrect! You may be thinking of calculating volume. Pressure calculation using the above formula does not depend on geometry of the container...only height and density.

 

[mkengr45]

It has been a while since I took fluid dynamics in college (BME and MME), but I am pretty sure I am remembering this correctly. I probably have an old text book lying around but am likely too lazy to dig it up.