DIY LEDs - The write-up

[Crazy35111]

On the Cree XRE-WH-Q5 do you want the 00D01 kit or the 00D02 Kit. The D01 encompasses the broadest range up to 10000K and the D02 Kit only goes up to 7000k?

 

[kcress]

"ENERGY STAR rated CFL lumen maintenance must be greater than 90.0% of initial (100-hour) lumen output @ 1,000 hours of rated life and greater than 80.0% of initial lumen output at 40% of rated life (e.g., @ 4,000 hours for a 10,000 hour CFL)." ( http://dremc.com/CFL_FAQ.htm )

Well.. Thanks for that! Sounds good but I don't believe it. None of the CFLs I've gone thru have followed that. I have a 110W CFL in my hallway. It used blind everyone with its output. Now my Better Half curses it and complains it's "worthless" and I would estimate it's burned for 200Hrs.

I would estimate that most meet that spec about halfway.

If they actually did, or one actually stumbles over a quality make, it's good to know what they're supposed to be good for. I wish someone would take them to task for it. I've never had one even make it near 10,000hrs without complete failure. I'd be interested to know if you have?

 

[kcress]

On the Cree XRE-WH-Q5 do you want the 00D01 kit or the 00D02 Kit. The D01 encompasses the broadest range up to 10000K and the D02 Kit only goes up to 7000k?

Crazy are you talking sump or display? Sump NOT the 10k.

Display, your choice. Most would probably go for the 10k.

 

[widmer]

Well.. Thanks for that! Sounds good but I don't believe it. None of the CFLs I've gone thru have followed that. I have a 110W CFL in my hallway. It used blind everyone with its output. Now my Better Half curses it and complains it's "worthless" and I would estimate it's burned for 200Hrs.

I would estimate that most meet that spec about halfway.

If they actually did, or one actually stumbles over a quality make, it's good to know what they're supposed to be good for. I wish someone would take them to task for it. I've never had one even make it near 10,000hrs without complete failure. I'd be interested to know if you have?

Yea the link says that those figures only apply to Energy Star certified CFLs, and I'm not sure what percent are Energy Star.

But I do know that there's ENORMOUS difference between manufacturers. I have some GE CFLs that seem to have been burning bright in my side table lamps for at least 4 years now, and meanwhile some of the offbrands (always the cheapest so I'm enticed to buy them) go dead after like 5 months.

Moral of the story, there's a good chance that LEDs will take over the sump too, but it's going to really take some experimentation for people to really know what the best intensity/color combination is as far as the chaeto goes.

 

[kcress]

Agreed! And I vote you, with your analytical skilz, to be the first!

 

[AndyReef]

Just an update...I haven't been on here in a while, I built an LED fixture with 96 CREEs half cool white half royal blue running on 8 meanwell drivers. I have a deep tank, 30", and so I added some pretty narrow optics. I actually have to dim the fixture down to the 20 to 25% range to keep my SPS from bleaching near the bottom of the tank. I haven't had a chance to measure the PAR output, but this thing is BRIGHT!

 

[kcress]

That's good to hear!!

Any chance for a picture or three?

What's the tank tank dimensions again?

 

[widmer]

Agreed! And I vote you, with your analytical skilz, to be the first!

Hey I appreciate the thought. I'd love to go side by side with some red/blue mix, some warm whites, and some cool whites. Intensity would also be an interesting thing to test, as I'm not sure if there is an upper limit for what the macroalgaes like. As it turns out, I am a poor pharmacy student...

Any sponsors out there?

 

[L98-Z]

Just an update...I haven't been on here in a while, I built an LED fixture with 96 CREEs half cool white half royal blue running on 8 meanwell drivers. I have a deep tank, 30", and so I added some pretty narrow optics. I actually have to dim the fixture down to the 20 to 25% range to keep my SPS from bleaching near the bottom of the tank. I haven't had a chance to measure the PAR output, but this thing is BRIGHT!

Any pictures? How big is your tank.

 

[der_wille_zur_macht]

I actually have to dim the fixture down to the 20 to 25% range to keep my SPS from bleaching near the bottom of the tank. I haven't had a chance to measure the PAR output, but this thing is BRIGHT!

I'm going to verge on assuming a hunch is equivalent to proof, but for the last month or two I've had the feeling that the "standard" approach to LEDs for display tanks is WAY too much light. Look at all the people who reported bleaching over the last few months, and the success of the one or two people who posted much-less-intense fixtures.

About a month ago I lent one of my nano fixtures to a local reefer for use on a frag tank, he recently reported that things were doing great and growing like mad. This particular fixture is probably about half the power that might be expected over a tank the size of his. It's a typical LED count, but running at ~350mA, no optics, and most of the LEDs are Rebels, which have a very wide field of view, meaning more light spill and less intensity in such a small tank.

Any sponsors out there?

Gimmie 6 months and I'll be running that sort of "test" on my in-progress 360g build, which I'm hoping to use a large 'fuge/turf scrubber on. It'll be worth $100 to test different color combos and see what's ideal. The tank won't be wet until the summer though, so if you beat me to the punch I'll just copy your best result though.

 

[L98-Z]

I'm starting to get some idea of how I want to do this.

Can someone tell me if I'm going the right way about this?
-I'm looking at a 50/50 mix of Royal Blue / Cool White Cree XR-E Q5 LEDs (Approximately 72)
-6 Meanwell Dimming Drivers, P/N: ELN-60-48D
-Use the Neptune Apex Controller to control dimming functions.
-Heatsinks will be from Heatsink USA
-Computer fans to provide air circulation

Is there anything I'm overlooking? Can the Apex control the dimming of 6 different meanwell drivers?

 

[swannking]

Just an update...I haven't been on here in a while, I built an LED fixture with 96 CREEs half cool white half royal blue running on 8 meanwell drivers. I have a deep tank, 30", and so I added some pretty narrow optics. I actually have to dim the fixture down to the 20 to 25% range to keep my SPS from bleaching near the bottom of the tank. I haven't had a chance to measure the PAR output, but this thing is BRIGHT!

I assume that you are using the 48V meanwell and you're driving 12 leds with each. So if you are runing the leds in full power, do you see any problem with them drawing almost 48V from the driver since most buckpuck users run a few less leds than their driver's max voltage. My second question is how are you dimming your maxwell, using the built in or external pot?

 

[der_wille_zur_macht]

I assume that you are using the 48V meanwell and you're driving 12 leds with each. So if you are runing the leds in full power, do you see any problem with them drawing almost 48V from the driver since most buckpuck users run a few less leds than their driver's max voltage. My second question is how are you dimming your maxwell, using the built in or external pot?

The buckpucks and meanwell drivers are very different products and have different requirements - it's important to understand whichever one you're using. People using buckpucks are leaving some "headroom" and a limit of 6 LEDs per driver because the datasheet calls for both of those restrictions. Meanwhile the meanwell's datasheet merely lists the max voltage, which means you should be able to use anything right up to that max. Depending on which LEDs you're using and what their Vf is, and what you have the voltage limit trimpot set to, you could theoretically get 13 LEDs on a 48v meanwell, but I don't see the point in pushing things that far.

 

[kcress]

If you look at the box your CFLs come in that's typically their stated life! You know, "10*** years!" (***5 minutes a day - base down)

They certainly lose output brightness in three months of running every day for 18 hrs. (That is the ones that don't fail utterly). And for the umpteenth time if you can see any difference in brightness then a large actual change HAS occurred.(100hrs)

Funny I just came across an article that stated:

If you check the DOE site for CALiPER test results, the DOE states that most of the bulbs(CFL) they test do not meet the manufacturers specs.

And further:

The DOE tests point out several products that didn't survive initial burn in.

Anyway, I just liked seeing someone else validating my suspicions.

 

[der_wille_zur_macht]

kcress, +1 to your comments about CFL life. I've used a few different CFLs on refugia and planted FW tanks over the last 5 or 6 years, and most of them have given marked drops in growth after only a few months. I have one in my garage that was brilliant when I put it in over the summer, but now barely illuminates the whole room. I have another light fixture out there with incandescent bulbs in it, so I've been able to do an unintentional side-by-side comparison of brightness over the last few months.

I'm wondering if it's heavily dependent on the particular bulb and the conditions it's run in, though. From time to time I'll pull one out that has obvious heat damage (discoloration) around the base. Maybe they'd last longer if cooled or not used in hot, tight reflectors.

 

[AndyReef]

Yes, I am using 12 leds per meanwell and I am dimming using the built in 0-10V dimming channel and an ALC module on my RKE.

Has anybody seen their corals recover their coloration after reducing the LED output?

 

[L98-Z]

Yes, I am using 12 leds per meanwell and I am dimming using the built in 0-10V dimming channel and an ALC module on my RKE.

You can dim each meanwell driver with the 0-10V dimming channel? I'm assuming the neptune Apex does the same thing. What is the resolution of these changes?

 

[jonewald]

Wow, this was a monster thread to read through! Incredibly informative and I look forward to working on 3 LED builds of my own in the next few months.

I have a Biocube 29, my 50gal anemone tank, and a friend's Fluval Edge (6 gal) tank to make lighting rigs for. I'm sure I will have build threads for all 3 fixtures soon.

DWIZM, do you think you could show us what you have planned for your DIY drivers? That is the route I'm considering and would love to compare notes.

That's all for now. I'm sure I'll be back with more questions and comments!

 

[AndyReef]

If the model number of the meanwell ends in a D, then you have the model with built in 0-10v dimming. In my experience with adjusting the internal pots in the meanwell I currently have it set where I can gets the LEDS to fire at 5% on the ALC. The ALC goes from 0 to 100%. Using a multimeter there is a big change in the current output and a small change in the voltage. The voltage is too low under 5% for the lights to come on, but if you had fewer LEDs per string you could probably go as low as 1%, I think about 9 or 10 LEDs for that, but haven't tried.

 

[L98-Z]

If the model number of the meanwell ends in a D, then you have the model with built in 0-10v dimming. In my experience with adjusting the internal pots in the meanwell I currently have it set where I can gets the LEDS to fire at 5% on the ALC. The ALC goes from 0 to 100%. Using a multimeter there is a big change in the current output and a small change in the voltage. The voltage is too low under 5% for the lights to come on, but if you had fewer LEDs per string you could probably go as low as 1%, I think about 9 or 10 LEDs for that, but haven't tried.

Thanks Andy. I just found this out a few hours ago as well. Looks like those are the ones to use for the Nepture Apex system as well.