Long-term Ich Management

[newaquarist]

I would appreciate hearing from from those of you that have had Ich in your tank at some point and who have succesfully maintained the tank long term without ever leaving the tank fallow for 8 to 10 weeks.

I would appreciate not hearing from the many of you who rightly point out that there are only 3 ways to get rid of ich, etc., etc...

The reason i ask this question is that I did leave my tank fallow for 10 weeks and treated my fish with coper for 30 days... a couple weeks after reintroducing i had ich again... obviously, i screwed up somewhere...

i really do not want to repeat that exercise and want to get a sense of how many folks have been succesful with ich in their tank for long periods...

many thanks....

 

[HumbleFish]

While I don't suggest/recommend it, I have done it before.

Basically, you have to attack on two fronts. First, you have to bolster your fishes' immune systems as much as possible. This is mostly done thru proper nutrition, strengthening their immune system by feeding a varied diet (including lots of nori), and soaking the fish food in vitamin supplements (i.e. Selcon, Zoecon, Vita-chem). Paul B, whom I highly respect, advocates keeping his fish in "breeding condition" by feeding mostly live blackworms and soaking pellets in fish oil. I would search for threads written by him to familiarize yourself with his methods.

Secondly, you need to find ways to keep the overall number of parasites in your aquarium down to a minimum. Running a UV sterilizer is the most common way to do this. While it will never completely eradicate all the free swimming parasites, it has to eliminate at least some since it zaps anything passing thru it. Keeping the number of parasites down puts the odds more in the fishes' favor.

The thing is you can practice "Ich management", win many battles, but still ultimately lose the war. All it takes is one major "stressor event" to undo all the good you've done. What I mean by stressor event is something like rapidly changing temp, SG or prolonged power loss. Which I guess means Ich management is actually a three headed monster - it's important to keep all your parameters as stable as possible. Good luck to you!

 

[HumbleFish]

Another thing I might add is if you know you have Ich in your tank, it's best to only keep fish with thick mucous coats (like wrasses, anthias), and avoid fish with thin mucous coats (like tangs). Fish with thicker mucous coats have more natural protection from the parasites.

 

[snorvich]

Many of the folks who have tried "managing ich" have dropped out of the hobby so the number responding may be minimal. And, of course only wanting to hear from people that support your position . . .

 

[Allmost]

as stated above. it will work, till something out of ordinary happens, a long power out, storms, equipment dying on long weekends and so on.

then you loose a couple of fish you love, and dont have enough QT experience to save others, and as Steve pointed out ... ppl give up at that point with the hobby.

 

[newaquarist]

Many of the folks who have tried "managing ich" have dropped out of the hobby so the number responding may be minimal. And, of course only wanting to hear from people that support your position . . .

I don't have a position, but rather a predicament.

 

[MrTuskfish]

Many of the folks who have tried "managing ich" have dropped out of the hobby so the number responding may be minimal. And, of course only wanting to hear from people that support your position . . .

.......how are you going to knows the posts from those folks who mis-diagnosed and never had ich in the first place. This happens frequently.

 

[newaquarist]

What kinds of things are typically misdiagnosed as ich?

 

[newaquarist]

As an alternative, what if i remove all corals and inverts, how long would the tank need to be exposed to copper to kill all ich? Is it 30 days or 8 to 10 weeks?

I realize most folks will then say the tank (live rock and sand) would be ruined for use as a reef tank, but then i've seen numerous posts from folks that have run the coppersorb and polyfilter stuff and been ok afterwards... does this later approach make any sense? Assuming I could get all the cooper out, would i need to wait the full 10 weeks before returning the corals and inverts to the tank, given that they would be kept in a tank with no fish while out of the DT?

thx

 

[Allmost]

sorry doesnt make much sense. plus aragonite will absorb Cu [Copper] making your treatment useless.

if you remove all corals and inverts, why not remove the fish, and put them in an empty tank with heater, water and a power head, and treat that tank ? follow the instructions on the label. same time it takes to treat those fish, your main DT will be empty.

seems clear that you know the right and wrong way to go about this. So at some point you just gotta do what u want and forget others . u want to treat ure tank with copper while u know its wrong and can cause Issues ? then why ask ... just go ahead and do what u like ...

 

[Paul B]

I don't get involved in ich threads any longer but my tank used to be an ich farm. I used to keep copper in there continousely but there has been no ich in probably 35 years and I don't have to quarantine. I just keep my fish in breeding condition using live worms and whole foods like clams. No flakes or pellets.
Good luck

 

[HumbleFish]

As an alternative, what if i remove all corals and inverts, how long would the tank need to be exposed to copper to kill all ich? Is it 30 days or 8 to 10 weeks?

I realize most folks will then say the tank (live rock and sand) would be ruined for use as a reef tank, but then i've seen numerous posts from folks that have run the coppersorb and polyfilter stuff and been ok afterwards... does this later approach make any sense? Assuming I could get all the cooper out, would i need to wait the full 10 weeks before returning the corals and inverts to the tank, given that they would be kept in a tank with no fish while out of the DT?

thx

Personally, I would try chloroquine phosphate in a DT before copper. There is a 35 page thread about it in this forum, and some folks have begun using it in their DT. You would still have to remove all corals/inverts beforehand, but turning your tank back into a reef down the road would likely be easier/safer than using copper.

 

[newaquarist]

Thanks. The tip on cp sounds very interesting. I'll read that thread.

If I were to do that, how long would I have to keep my corals separate before I could confidently return them to the DT knowing they would not be carryng water with Ich? Thanks.

 

[HumbleFish]

Thanks. The tip on cp sounds very interesting. I'll read that thread.

If I were to do that, how long would I have to keep my corals separate before I could confidently return them to the DT knowing they would not be carryng water with Ich? Thanks.

72 days - same as going fallow - to be completely safe.

You would need to treat the fish w/CP for a minimum of 30 days. Then start running your lights again, running carbon, doing WCs, etc. to completely remove it. And even then, I would only try one or two corals at a time until you are completely sure the tank is safe again.

Honestly, it would probably be easier to treat the fish w/CP in a QT instead and just go fallow in the DT.

 

[newaquarist]

Well, the problem I have is that I can probably fit my corals into a 30 gallon tank... which i can accommodate... no way i can put all of my fish into a 30 gallon tank...

 

[agnes66666]

10 days ago I start adding Seachem Cupramin in my display tank. Cupramin is copper based meds which Seachem claims that can be removed by carbon or cuprisorb. At the start my live rock, live sand absorbed a bit of copper but now the level are stable, I don`t need to dose anything and Ich is gone! I removed my corals and inverts. I am hoping to put them back soon, after I remove copper using cupri sorb, water changes. I added cupramine to my tank as I did not wonted stress my fish, and also wanted to kill ich in my tank.

 

[HumbleFish]

10 days ago I start adding Seachem Cupramin in my display tank. Cupramin is copper based meds which Seachem claims that can be removed by carbon or cuprisorb. At the start my live rock, live sand absorbed a bit of copper but now the level are stable, I don`t need to dose anything and Ich is gone! I removed my corals and inverts. I am hoping to put them back soon, after I remove copper using cupri sorb, water changes. I added cupramine to my tank as I did not wonted stress my fish, and also wanted to kill ich in my tank.

The problem is your rock/sand will be leaching copper back into the water for an indefinite amount of time.

 

[ca1ore]

The problem is your rock/sand will be leaching copper back into the water for an indefinite amount of time.

Not doubting necessarily that this is true (and there are many good reasons to not medicate the display), but I wonder if there have been any studies on this? I always used to hear that tanks that had been used with copper were verboten for inverts, yet I have done it many times (tanks got a good cleaning though).

 

[syrinx]

as stated above. it will work, till something out of ordinary happens, a long power out, storms, equipment dying on long weekends and so on.

then you loose a couple of fish you love, and dont have enough QT experience to save others, and as Steve pointed out ... ppl give up at that point with the hobby.

This is a very true statement. You can have low level ich in a tank for years- 5-10 or more without any outbreak- but when you add a stress like a temp drop etc-It will be swift in overcoming the fish.

If one wants to take the risk, I would have a large UV on the system- as said before it will not kill everything- but it will help.

I tend to QT fish before they go into the display, and once a fish is on the reef-it does not get removed, or treated. I also follow Paul B in saying that keeping fish in breeding condition is key to health and fighting off parasites.

 

[125mph]

The reason i ask this question is that I did leave my tank fallow for 10 weeks and treated my fish with coper for 30 days... a couple weeks after reintroducing i had ich again... obviously, i screwed up somewhere...

Maybe the "screw up" part was the 10 weeks instead of 12 weeks... or maybe you don't have ich and have something else?

I had an ich problem about 12 months ago and went fallow for 12 weeks, all was good after that... until I brought home some clowns last month and was lazy, didn't QT.... now an ich problem again.. I'm doing tank transfer method this time as it seems to be much less stressful on the fish.. Will go fallow on the DT again for 12 weeks.