My Breeding attempt - Perculas:

[billsreef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12766855#post12766855 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by melev
On the feeding of baby brine shrimp, I was referring to adding phyto to their hatchery before they were harvested on Day 2. So they would have had 36 to 48 hours of hatching time. Are they still too young to eat at that point? Because they definitely did not look orange like unfed brine do.

Marc,

For feeding larger fish or corals in your tank, that is excellent. However, at the size of our fry, 2 day old nauplii are too large That's why we feed instar 1 at first hatch while they still have all that nice orange yolk

 

[Lifes A Beach]

ORA book

ORA book

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12771122#post12771122 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by dazed
The book that i have from ora states the same photoperiod being used as well.

Regarding your ammonia problem, since you're waiting for a spawn and have a little extra time, why don't you set up a larvae tank now and do the same things with rots, phyto, water changes and heater without fry and see what your ammonia readings are? Maybe you'll be able to figure out where your ammonia is coming from before your fry arrive. You may be having problems before the fry are introduced.

The photoperiod I use for my new fry is about 14 hours. I use indirect light (above and to the side) from a low wattage flourescent light (also lighting a few other tanks - saving power ). It's just enough to give the fry a small amount but enough light for them to see the rots. You can adjust the lighting depending on how the fry react to it.

BTW, what book from ora are you referring to???

--Barbara

 

[FB]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12771191#post12771191 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by dazed
FB; how long do you keep the tank operating at the 2.5g level?

I also think it was the ammonia spike at this point because looking back over my notes they seemed to stop progressing and then went downhill...

Also to expand on what Melev was saying:
How long do you run the light source on the larvae tank?

I have a sponge filter sitting in my sump for the last week so i think i will try that method next time and see if i can keep the ammonia in check.

No eggs yet but i think she is getting ready; her belly is full and she was cleaning the tile last night, hopefully today

My water level continues to go up as I add phyto to the tank. Currently all my phyto is pretty weak so I am adding more than normal. Today is day 3 and I have about 3 maybe 3.5 gallons.

My lights are on for 16 hours. 7:00 - 11:00.

I had ammonia problems on my first couple of batchs. However I do not clean my heater or airline off between batchs. It appears that my heater and airline may be holding enough bacteria to avoid ammonia spikes now as these are the only things that do not get a good cleaning between hatchs. If you plan on starting another tank for these new larvae and you already have another heater. Place the heater in the current tank. You probably don't need to turn it on but it is my understanding that bacteria can occupy anything with surface area. When your other tank is ready transfer the 2nd heater to your new tank. This should allow you to have a small bacteria culture started which can expand in the tank as the ammonia starts to increase on your next batch the same as your a sponge filter. Not really positive if this is what is happening to my tank but seems to be the only explanation.

Good Luck

FB

 

[dazed]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12771988#post12771988 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by billsreef
It does indeed sound like the whole issue goes to the ammonia spike.

With the BBS, you've been doing it right. Though the 2nd day left overs might be too large to feed to the larvae till the larvae get a bit bigger. I'd feed to those to the main tank

Guess i know what to try and avoid next time then, i think i may need to be a bit more proactive with the ammonia issue i was not adding amquel or prime until the issue came about and by then i think the damage was already done. It seems like it would be a better approach to just add a little bit each day regardless of what the test kits register.

Yeah the bbs grow quick i have some in the larvae tank now that are larger then the remaining 3 larvae that i have. I have been siphoning out the larger ones but can't get them all, lol

 

[FB]

Brine shrimp are more sensitive to ammoina I believe so they can be good indicators of increasing ammonia levels if left in the tank.

 

[dazed]

Re: ORA book

Re: ORA book

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12772054#post12772054 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Lifes A Beach
Regarding your ammonia problem, since you're waiting for a spawn and have a little extra time, why don't you set up a larvae tank now and do the same things with rots, phyto, water changes and heater without fry and see what your ammonia readings are? Maybe you'll be able to figure out where your ammonia is coming from before your fry arrive. You may be having problems before the fry are introduced.

The photoperiod I use for my new fry is about 14 hours. I use indirect light (above and to the side) from a low wattage flourescent light (also lighting a few other tanks - saving power ). It's just enough to give the fry a small amount but enough light for them to see the rots. You can adjust the lighting depending on how the fry react to it.

BTW, what book from ora are you referring to???

--Barbara

I might have to try that i do have an empty 10g & I currently have 3 larvae left and they are in 4g of water (2 of them do not look to be doing real well) but the one i think has figured out that the bbs are food. As i noticed this morning that his belly is orange not quite the bulge i saw in FB picture above but maybe some hope. His only problem is going to be not eating the bs in the tank that are larger than he is.

I must not have had enough coffee the other book i have been reading is by Frank Hoff CONDITIONING AND SPAWNING BOOK
FAF sent me a free copy; i am sure you have seen it. It's not straight from ora.

https://3kserver7.com/~frank/secure/agora.cgi?cart_id=2441737.3686*W18Hq1&product=BOOKS_MANUALS



See there i go again confusing you sorry....

 

[dazed]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12772355#post12772355 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by FB
Brine shrimp are more sensitive to ammoina I believe so they can be good indicators of increasing ammonia levels if left in the tank.

Well the tank must be ok at least for right now because the ones that are still in there are growing like crazy, lol....

It seems that my lighting period is close to or the same to what others are doing so that's good.

I will take your advice and not clean the heater or airline it does make sense to me that after a little time it could be growing bacteria that will help with ammonia in the tank.

If you start with around 2.5g of water and if by day 3 you have around 3-3.5g how much phyto are you adding?
Have you done any water changes yet?

thanks again for all of your help.

 

[FB]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12772487#post12772487 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by dazed

If you start with around 2.5g of water and if by day 3 you have around 3-3.5g how much phyto are you adding?
Have you done any water changes yet?

thanks again for all of your help.

What do you mean by a water change

I have siphoned the bottom of the tank once. I did not specifically add any fresh sw. I have just been adding Phyto. As I said my phyto is very weak right now I have been adding about 2 Litres a day. 1 Litre in the morning and Litre at night. 2 Litres = ~1/2 Gallon

 

[dazed]

I think rkelman was right you are a sorcerer

 

[dazed]

and then there was one.....
I guess i am looking for suggestions as to what to do i now have only 1 little teeny tiny larvae 16 days old swimming around in 4g of water that has rotifers & brine shrimp that he can eat and some that are to big for him to eat.

at this point it seems crazy to keep him in the tank but i don't really have anything else to move him into; maybe an empty 2l bottle.

and still no new eggs from orca so i am at a standstill for now.

 

[FB]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12778408#post12778408 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by dazed
and then there was one.....
I guess i am looking for suggestions as to what to do i now have only 1 little teeny tiny larvae 16 days old swimming around in 4g of water that has rotifers & brine shrimp that he can eat and some that are to big for him to eat.

at this point it seems crazy to keep him in the tank but i don't really have anything else to move him into; maybe an empty 2l bottle.

and still no new eggs from orca so i am at a standstill for now.

Well having one left on your first attempt is better than most, including me. Keep at it still lots to learn. Next you have to get him to start eating prepared foods.

Here were my results at the start.

1: 0 No food starved to death
2: 5 (almost 5 months old now) Had only 15 hatch, so more food to go around
3: 0 Killed all of them before they hatched
4: 0 Most died of starvation the rest because of a bad water change
5: 0 50 - 60 hatched killed all of them with bad water change

Keep at it it will get easier once you get a routine down.

Hopefully you will have some new eggs soon.

 

[agsansoo]

dazed, I think it's a Calif. thing ... LOL I have one that survived from my 9th hatch ! One from my 11th hatch. :lol: My hatches 1-8 were total loses.

 

[Lifes A Beach]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12778408#post12778408 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by dazed
and then there was one.....

Dazed, consider it an accomplishment to have 1 survive your first attempt! In my experiences, I went through a few hatches before I was able to keep "1" alive from an entire hatch as my first survivor and I still have him over 4 months later! We named him "Nemo" and if you've seen the movie, you'll know why! LOL

Since there was only one, I kept it in a small bowl with light aeration and food. I felt like a nurse maid, constantly checking on the little guy making sure everything was right (as far as I knew) to keep him going.

The next hatch produced 45 survivors which I still have and after several weeks, I finally introduced "Nemo" to that bunch. He mixed in with no problems.

Take notes of all you have done (and not done) with this first hatch and learn from those experiences. There will be more hatches and more tries at accomplishment. I'm still learning a little more with each hatch. Alot of experimentation! And patience - which you obviously have! I'm sure you will succeed!

--Barbara

 

[dazed]

I just wanted to thank everyone for their words of encouragement; and all of the helpful advice that i have gotten along the way, I knew when i decided to try this out it was going to be a roller coaster ride for sure as i really did not (& still don't) know what i am doing. All though i am disappointed with the current outcome i am not discouraged at all; as a matter of fact i have found a neat little new avenue to pursue as a reefkeeper.

I have found myself out in the garage at night with a magnifying glass counting rotifers, hatching bbs, culturing phyto, watching the little ones explore & learn to hunt, praying, swearing, drinking lol..

All i need now are some more eggs to try again with.

I need to try and get a picture of the last survivor so everyone can see how small he still is..

 

[kar93]

Good luck with the last one, there are many people who would have given up by now, but you've stuck by it and although there is only one left, I bet he's the best one out of the whole hatch. :thumbsup:

 

[dazed]

All right here i go again lol last night she (orca) laid a new clutch of volunteer's #2..:celeb1: I managed to get some video this time of the egg laying process but i can't find the cord to my video player, I will try and get the videos up this weekend. I have not counted this batch yet but i will but it looks to me to be the largest one yet; she did lay some of the eggs on the rock next to the tile; oh well.....

[/IMG]

And last night i got some shots of LUCKY so i thought i would share those as well just to show how little he still is (17th day) He is still a runt but alive, lol

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

I guess i now have 7-9 days to get the rotifers & phyto ready for round 2, today i am stopping by the lfs and switching 1 of my 10g tanks for a 5g for this next attempt.

Question on what to do with the rotifer cultures that i have now should i be harvesting them and i guess maybe feed them to my reef or let the culture expand to whatever and have a bunch to hopefully start the next attempt with??

 

[agsansoo]

I would put Lucky in a breeder net, that way he can catch the brine shrimp easier. He still small for 17 days old. He should be going through meta any day now. Good luck on hatch number 2 !

 

[kar93]

Good luck for the 2nd hatch, putting Lucky in a breeder net sounds like a good idea.

 

[FB]

Wow that is pretty small. That ammonia sure did a number on him.

Please don't take this as slamming you but here is one of mine @ 4 days for comparison purposes.

 

[Lifes A Beach]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12787218#post12787218 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by dazed

Question on what to do with the rotifer cultures that i have now should i be harvesting them and i guess maybe feed them to my reef or let the culture expand to whatever and have a bunch to hopefully start the next attempt with??

Keep those rotifers going! Yes, you need to harvest them and your reef will love you for it. I was amazed to see how my corals perked up when I feed the rotifers to the tank. Be sure to split your culture into maybe 2,3 or 4 in case of a crash.

--Barbara:fish1: