My journey using Chloroquine Phosphate begins...

[Deinonych]

wow thanks for that you're right I went by what the guy said that sold it but he did say approximately 2oz for 60g, I should have double checked. My original math I did was for 55g which came to 4.125grams so it was close enough to where I didn't check. I don't think it's quite at 83.3mg/g snice when you add 10g to the 4oz of water it becomes 4.35oz (I think) so 2oz has 4.59g which is 76.6mg/g(could someone check my math lol its been awhile) so it's not that far off but is over. sorry I started to type as I did the math.

OK. I didn't think about displacement. Your math checks out. As long as it isn't over 80mg/g you should be fine.

 

[i3oosted]

Right now I have a midas blenny and a powder blue in QT. With any tang, I treat proactively along with regular QT. I have experience with Quinine Sulfate and CP. I treat a one and done, 40mg/gal, lights off and that hasn't failed me yet. I have done some in 10 days but that is minimum and you are still taking your chances. Go at least 2 weeks, 4 being best.

I bought my CP from an ebay seller, selling extra stock of CP which I'm going to assume its from that place that only sells huge quantities of it.

Right now I'am on day 19 of CP treatment and everything is clear and healthy BUT for one bigger than usual white spot on my tang. I've seen it for a few days and I'm not sure if its ich or not, but I'm not taking chances. It stays until it goes away.

My question, is there an expiration date for CP?

I've had the package for awhile so I'm not sure if it's totally 100% effective right now.

Also, don't be afraid to try Quinine Sulfate, it isn't a one and done med and so it takes more effort and it is a little harsher on the fish but I haven't lost any from it. It's easier to get and cheaper to buy if you can't get CP.

 

[zland1]

Fish in

 

[Deinonych]

Right now I'am on day 19 of CP treatment and everything is clear and healthy BUT for one bigger than usual white spot on my tang. I've seen it for a few days and I'm not sure if its ich or not, but I'm not taking chances. It stays until it goes away.

It could be a scar of some sort if it has been there through 19 days of CP treatment.

 

[Arc Katana]

It's probably not a parasite if it's been 19 days, save if you've done water changes and not kept the level of CP constant.

 

[SantaMonica]

Well this CP seems interesting. Never read about it before.

 

[holdyourlight]

I've noticed an issue with Tangs and CP. I have a Kole that has refused to eat since dosing and we are at day 14 right now. He is acting fine otherwise. I've seen similar behavior with a yellow tang and CP. He just does not pick at the rocks since treatment and spits out any food i throw in. I think he has enough weight on him to make it to day 30, but i am actually concerned about only dosing for 30 days. I have had ich come back after 30 days without any new fish introductions or otherwise contamination @ the 40mg/g rate. I am dosing @ 80mg/g this time so fingers crossed i guess, as i'm not sure what else to do.

 

[Elliott]

I've noticed an issue with Tangs and CP. I have a Kole that has refused to eat since dosing and we are at day 14 right now. He is acting fine otherwise. I've seen similar behavior with a yellow tang and CP. He just does not pick at the rocks since treatment and spits out any food i throw in. I think he has enough weight on him to make it to day 30, but i am actually concerned about only dosing for 30 days. I have had ich come back after 30 days without any new fish introductions or otherwise contamination @ the 40mg/g rate. I am dosing @ 80mg/g this time so fingers crossed i guess, as i'm not sure what else to do.

I have had similar problems at 80mg/dl with poor appetite, however I have found it is unnecessary to dose that high, I've stayed at 40mg/dl, fish continue to eat and allows prolonged treatment if necessary.

 

[HumbleFish]

Thanks to this thread, we've pretty much figured out that 40mg/gal is the "standard" dosage for CP.

But perhaps we are seeing that 80mg/gal is too high for active infections? Maybe the ceiling should be more like 60mg/gal?

 

[holdyourlight]

I have had similar problems at 80mg/dl with poor appetite, however I have found it is unnecessary to dose that high, I've stayed at 40mg/dl, fish continue to eat and allows prolonged treatment if necessary.

I know that our local dealer has been testing 6 months on one of his main display tanks that has Achilles, Purple, Chevron and Yellow tangs, Blueface, Majestic, Chrysrus, Goldflake, Imperator, Flame, Lemonpeel and Flameback angelfishes besides 30 clownfishes, those guys eat like pigs. But then he's running at 60mg/gal.

I believe that the first sign of disease is fishes stop eating and usually when one uses copper or formalin, it stresses out the fishes even more and may keep them from eating. I haven't seen this happen with CP, even at 75mg/gal as our dealer is running for eradication and quarantine of mariculture fishes. Do you have a severe case of Ich and that is stressing them out?

The yellow had problems @ 40mg the first time through, but this time he is eating fine @ 80... interesting

Nope, definitely not a severe case, spot free for over a week.

Edit: Just to clarify my CP is from luis, not fishman

 

[Deinonych]

Thanks to this thread, we've pretty much figured out that 40mg/gal is the "standard" dosage for CP.

But perhaps we are seeing that 80mg/gal is too high for active infections? Maybe the ceiling should be more like 60mg/gal?

Everything I have read from "trusted sources" like Advanced Aquarist and Bob Goemens recommends 40mg/g for general quarantine and 60mg/g for active infections. The only time 80mg/g is advocated is for Uronema marinum infections. This same treatment protocol was confirmed by Matt Wandell from the CAS Steinhart Aquarium as well (I asked him after his lecture at MACNA this year). In the end, I think it depends on the amount of infection and how sensitive the fish is. I am hesitant to run at 80mg/g since that is considered to be the "maximum" dose, and there haven't been any serious studies on CP toxicity in fish to my knowledge.

Also, it is absolutely critical to ensure you are using pharmaceutical grade CP without fillers, binders or other impurities. Pharmacies can confirm the purity by looking up the assay record, and the chemical supply companies that sell it online also provide this information.

 

[rog2961]

I've noticed all my fish in general are much more shy than usual. my anthias are taking the biggest hit hiding in rocks and not coming out. when I mixed cp with the food I had one anthia die.

 

[Deinonych]

I've noticed all my fish in general are much more shy than usual. my anthias are taking the biggest hit hiding in rocks and not coming out. when I mixed cp with the food I had one anthia die.

I am currently treating a P. filamentosus wrasse. He acted somewhat catatonic (swimming in place in the lower left side of the QT) almost immediately when I started treatment @ 60mg/g on Sunday. I did a 30% WC to bring the concentration down to 40mg/g yesterday evening. Today, he's swimming around actively and annoying the royal gramma in the same tank.

 

[Deinonych]

I've talking to my local dealer every month about CP and his normal dosage for quarantine is 60mg/gal although he's testing at that same level on one of his display tank with no disease for 6 months now and no adverse effects are noticed.

When he sees any signs of disease in his quarantine system, he's up to 75mg/gal. He told me over the weekend that a breeder friend of his broke out in active brook and was loosing hundreds of clownfishes daily at 60mg/gal, so after 4 days, the breeder up to 160mg/gal and death rate dropped to less than 20 for 2 days and then stop, the brook was in control. The breeder exact words were "I had nothing to loose by overdosing as I already lost over a thousand clowns before double dosing the system."

Does your dealer treat only clownfish, or has he used the treatment on other fish as well? IME, clownfish can tolerate high concentrations of CP (I'm about to finish 4 weeks at 75mg/g on my two ocellaris clowns), but other fish species may not.

 

[i3oosted]

I've noticed all my fish in general are much more shy than usual. my anthias are taking the biggest hit hiding in rocks and not coming out. when I mixed cp with the food I had one anthia die.

DO NOT mix it with food. I know they sell food with CP in it(Dr. G's) but they have done the testing to have the right amount in the food to not kill.

Just add it to your tank water, not food... unless it's very minute but you really dont have a way to measure how much each fish has taken in...

*NM, I think your treating in a reef tank which it would be the appropriate way but still can't accurately measure whats getting to the fish.

 

[holdyourlight]

Everything I have read from "trusted sources" like Advanced Aquarist and Bob Goemens recommends 40mg/g for general quarantine and 60mg/g for active infections. The only time 80mg/g is advocated is for Uronema marinum infections. This same treatment protocol was confirmed by Matt Wandell from the CAS Steinhart Aquarium as well (I asked him after his lecture at MACNA this year). In the end, I think it depends on the amount of infection and how sensitive the fish is. I am hesitant to run at 80mg/g since that is considered to be the "maximum" dose, and there haven't been any serious studies on CP toxicity in fish to my knowledge.

Also, it is absolutely critical to ensure you are using pharmaceutical grade CP without fillers, binders or other impurities. Pharmacies can confirm the purity by looking up the assay record, and the chemical supply companies that sell it online also provide this information.

Did Matt Wandell happen to discuss how long treatment should be?

 

[Deinonych]

Did Matt Wandell happen to discuss how long treatment should be?

He said they treat for 21 days. He also said they don't proactively treat for disease, which surprised me.

 

[Louis Z]

So, I found another source to order CP directly: Alfa Aesar (http://www.alfa.com). Alfa is a chemical supply company, and I was able to order 25g of CP with no problem. I just created an account and placed an order on 5-Sep with my credit card. My order shipped today.

Hey Deinonych did they give you any questions on who you were. I was going thru the questionaire to set up an account. What did you write under the compliance section. You can PM me if you want. thanks Louis

 

[Deinonych]

No, I just signed up for an account as an end user. Didn't have to fill out any kind of compliance statement as far as I can remember.

 

[rog2961]

Im one of the few that got a ammonia spike from CP. Did two 30% water changes and its still sitting at .25. Does anyone know how to combat this? Running out of options, it isn't rising which is good but having it in the system at all is bad.