my rice experiment

[HighlandReefer]

One problem is that I don't believe rice can be sold in the US without fortification. If one could find a source of plain rice without the USDA requirement, it may prove as a better source for use in reef aquariums.

I believe the fortification consists of the B vitamins and not heavy metals. The B vitamins are all water soluable, so I would think they can be easily rinsed away by triple soaking in rodi water.

 

[Du]

One problem is that I don't believe rice The B vitamins are all water soluable, so I would think they can be easily rinsed away by triple soaking in rodi water.

What concern about vitamin B? As i recall it called riboflavin?

 

[HighlandReefer]

duplicate.

 

[HighlandReefer]

It will be interesting to see what Randy has to say about rice when he comes back. His knowledge is far superior to mine when it comes to reef chemistry and he tends to be much more conservative then I. :lol:

I have been reamed out for being not conservative enough, but I believe that Guinea pigs are necessary to help advance our hobby since little research is actually done in aquariums. If hobbyists decide to try the rice they do have to understand that it is experimental and need to be willing to suffer the consequences if something goes wrong.

 

[HighlandReefer]

Concerns about any vitamins is that we don't know what the consequences are when dosed at higher levels. They do act like a carbon sources to increase bacterial populations. Hobbyists who have dosed vitamins have experienced bacterial blooms. Reef Crystals adds vitamins to their salt mix and some hobbyists complain of cyano increases when switching. Personally, I would prefer to rinse these added vitamins away first. There are all kinds of reef concotions sold on the market which add all kinds of vitamins and seem to have little effect.

If the rice are not properly soaked and these vitamins are not removed, one could get quite a one time dose when added to the aquarium since these vitamins are on the surface of the rice grain & are water soluable. I would suspect this could result in bacteria blooms in the tank which I don't believe is healthy for any tank.

 

[fishoutawater]

I added 1/2 cup to my filter sock in a media bag, I also only rinsed it off with tapwater for a few minutes. 3 days later my nitrates are elevated, from 20-30, to around 50. I think tonight I will start soaking another batch of rice for at least a day in rodi water.

To make matters worse, I have come to the conclusion that my live rock is a giant nutrient sink. I started a nano with some rock from my system, and some from a lfs. After about 6 months the only rocks with gha on them are the ones from my system, it has been that way in the nano from day one. In light of this, I am going to double the dosage of rice. For one, my rocks are a problem, and for two it will be in a bag, not a reactor. Unless somebody here has a reason for me not too.

 

[HighlandReefer]

Again, I would triple soak the rice in Rodi water. Perhaps soak one day, rinse and repeat two more days. Adding too much of the rice at one time may cause bacterial blooms. I would be carefull and slowly add more rice over a period of time. My two cents.

 

[Du]

again, i would triple soak the rice in rodi water. Perhaps soak one day, rinse and repeat two more days. Adding too much of the rice at one time may cause bacterial blooms. I would be carefull and slowly add more rice over a period of time. My two cents.

+1

 

[thebanker]

What about obtaining rice from an asian market? There are plenty here in so cal. Are they ALL fortified if sold in the US?

 

[HighlandReefer]

If the rice is legal it needs to be fortified, but I believe that you may find plain rice from some of these stores. :lol:

 

[DJREEF]

I added 1/2 cup to my filter sock in a media bag, I also only rinsed it off with tapwater for a few minutes. 3 days later my nitrates are elevated, from 20-30, to around 50. I think tonight I will start soaking another batch of rice for at least a day in rodi water.

To make matters worse, I have come to the conclusion that my live rock is a giant nutrient sink. I started a nano with some rock from my system, and some from a lfs. After about 6 months the only rocks with gha on them are the ones from my system, it has been that way in the nano from day one. In light of this, I am going to double the dosage of rice. For one, my rocks are a problem, and for two it will be in a bag, not a reactor. Unless somebody here has a reason for me not too.

Get the rice out of your filter sock. You're trapping the bio mass in the sock (where it dies) instead of skimming it out. The whole idea behind this is to grow bacteria for harvest (by the skimmer). That's how you export the nitrogen byproducts, by skimming out the bacteria while they are still alive. Put the bag near the intake for your skimmer where the live bacteria can get drawn in to the filter for export. Kick up you flow through the rocks, or pull them and dunk them a few times in NSW to get the crap outta them.

DJ

 

[tmz]

What about the starch likely dosed in uncontrollable amounts
and consequent fermentation process likely to occur in the tank; will it be harmful in the short/long run? I am not bashing .

auroratrdco, I find it funny that you want to bash on rice when you have no solid backing for it. even your theoritcal explanation was flawed. my backing is MY EXPERIMENT. which I have documented every single step of the way.


No one is bashing just by asking questions and examining assumptions . Conducting a "experiment" to prove using rice works would stifle productive discussion. I applaud your willingness to try different things but let's try to understand what's actually going on and potential pros and cons with some degree of rigor.

 

[DJREEF]

One problem is that I don't believe rice can be sold in the US without fortification. If one could find a source of plain rice without the USDA requirement, it may prove as a better source for use in reef aquariums.

I believe the fortification consists of the B vitamins and not heavy metals. The B vitamins are all water soluable, so I would think they can be easily rinsed away by triple soaking in rodi water.

Which makes fortification with B vitamins silly, given rice is either boiled or steamed. Typical senseless government policy.

DJ

 

[thebanker]

Which makes fortification with B vitamins silly, given rice is either boiled or steamed. Typical senseless government policy.

DJ

Great point!

Plus, everyone knows you're supposed to get your B-vitamins from energy drinks.

 

[kkil4life]

Since I'm already a user (and big fan) of Microbacter7, I might combine rice with MB7, and see how it goes.

this would be interesting to see, since we dont get mb7 here I cant really try it out.

 

[kkil4life]

I wonder if heat up rodi water just hot enough to drive more phosphate out the rice.

You dont want to cook the rice...... i would not go above 100 degrees F

Just hot without cooking it 100 - 120 degrees soak it for just 10 mins instead soaking in coldwater for 24 hours. Rice can be cook or precook well I not going to get into make thing harder.

I would still let it soak for a day, its not that long. but a 10 min 100 degree presoak is not a bad idea

heating u rice might just cook it. I'm no chef so cant really say when the rice starts to lose its structure, but over its currently upto 52C during the day and even water out the taps its burning hot. when I was washing the rice to try the po4 test, I couldnt wash it too well because the water was too hot an it started to make the rice a little soft.

what I would suggest is that you dont just rinse the rice, WASH it (like scrubbing the dirt out of your socks when you wash ur socks), this way all the things which are on the outter layer of the rice is washed out. additional soaking will help leach out other materials as well, but I dont think this is necessary. a few scrubs till the water runs clear (about 5-10 times) should be good enough. basically like when ur washing used sand.

 

[kkil4life]

Tonight marks two weeks since I put in a tablespoon of white rice in a bag and threw it in a chamber of my aquapod 12. Algea growth on my glass has almost been non existant. I have yet to clean the glass, although the corners could use it now. There was a small amount of gha on the outflow of a pump which is now gone. I have two small patches of bubble algea that are still there and my grape calurpa in the refugium is still growing. So far nothing negative. This last week I have been feeding more than I have ever before just to see if I can stimulate some bad algea growth, but nothing yet. Corals look good, but hard to say since I switched from pc lighting to a 70w 20k mh 6 weeks ago and the sps looks very dull. Some zoas lost color as well, but I hope with a little time color comes back.

this sounds great. looks like u got ur bag in an area of good flow. as with all things placed in a bag, do clean out ur bag once a week to prevent detretius accumlating on the surface of the bag. this can lead to additional no3 and po4. do keep us updated on ur usage of rice.

 

[kkil4life]

OK so I been following and am wondering What reactor everyone is using and how much flow they think they are using to get the tumble?

any reactor for your tank should be ok. and any pump as long as u get a gentle tumble.

 

[kkil4life]

Somebody who has a meter, should do the following just for experiments sake. Take 1 cup of unwashed, one rinsed thoroughly, and soak in one gallon ro/di, and 1 gal salt mixed water for 24 hrs and do a reading. Total would be 4 experiments. Also check your plain water for control sake. Then extrapolate ppm to 100 gal as that is about what one cup would be good for. Thanks if you do this.

I've already done this for po4, what else would you like to see?
copper will be tested by icycoral soon.
silica will be tested by me soon (forgot to get it done).
if anyone has an iron or manganese test, that would be great too.

 

[kkil4life]

OP's are reporting that they end up with less phosphate and nitrate in REAL reef systems with beneficial effects after 2 weeks of rice use and some people here are wondering what rice will do in r/o water. Some of you are really missing the point here. How about soaking your fish foods in r/o water and do some analysis on it? I'd suspect that all values of concerns would be many times higher than rice but no one would consider NOT feeding their fish.

you are absolutely correct aurora.
infact a few washes and the rice is good to go.

This may be a dumb idea but why not just take the reactor and attach it to a bucket of your choice either salt water or RO and let it tumble the residue off of itself.

Might come a bit cleaner then trying to rinse it off by hand plus then you can adjust your pump flow without trying to climb under a stand.

Then when your rice is ready just take it out so you can give the reactor a good cleaning
before you put it back on the tank.

My reactor isnt in use yet so I am thinking of doing it this way.
Just waiting on a new skimmer pinwheel to come in before I join the club.
The wife thinks I am a bit nuts cause I am looking at the bag of organic rice we have in a whole new light

I have 2 days to kill so maybe I will let my rice cycle before use.

just throughly washing it a few times will be good enough.