Name this chalice?

[Jeff]

Ok Israel, I agree that the discussion belongs in the thread you provided. It's in the Reef Discussion forum, not a club forum. I do like what you said in there:

A legal precedent may need to be set as I'm not sure anyone has ever tried to sell a "Limited Edition" animal before...

There are laws specifically governing the use of the term "Limited Edition", though not specifically addressed towards corals.

Although not at all what you said in this thread, I agree. You said it was law and implied that Tyree, ORA and Fox had broken laws.
When you state that "Calling something Limited Edition has a very specific meaning" I totally disagree and thats what this whole thing is about which you do not seem to get. Interpretation is freedom. If we didn't have that we would have grounds to sue people over literally everything. Why not let the businessmen run their business they way they see fit? Although raising the price on something based on a fancy name may not be morally right, I doubt Izod, Dior, and Gucci have been sued because a guy thinks they shouldn't have the right to charge a certain price.

 

[israel.kendall]

Ok Israel, I agree that the discussion belongs in the thread you provided. It's in the Reef Discussion forum, not a club forum. I do like what you said in there:

Although not at all what you said in this thread, I agree. You said it was law and implied that Tyree, ORA and Fox had broken laws.
When you state that "Calling something Limited Edition has a very specific meaning" I totally disagree and thats what this whole thing is about which you do not seem to get. Interpretation is freedom. If we didn't have that we would have grounds to sue people over literally everything. Why not let the businessmen run their business they way they see fit? Although raising the price on something based on a fancy name may not be morally right, I doubt Izod, Dior, and Gucci have been sued because a guy thinks they shouldn't have the right to charge a certain price.

I thought I said pretty much the same thing but in different words in both threads. Perhaps I worded it better over there. Sometimes I don't have time to proofread my posts as well as other times.

If Izod, Dior, or Gucci sold something as Limited Edition, then it was found that the merchandise was not Limited Edition a class action lawsuit would result.

Companies are sued all the time over false use of the term "limited edition" in their marketing of products. The laws Ford, Mattel, Louis Vatton (sp?), and others were sued under I'm sure are federal, not the little California Civil Code I quoted. I just can't seem to find the laws on google. But from reading the stories on the cases, there are definitely rules in place strictly governing the use of the term "limited edition" in commercial marketing.

If we agree to disagree on this then so be it. Regardless, I would not want to be Tyree or WWC or anyone who ends up having to be on the defense side of a class action if some lawyer gets a wild hair and files suit over illegal Limited Edition coral marketing.

 

[Jeff]

You should sue them.

 

[israel.kendall]

You should sue them.

LOL I don't care THAT much! I think they are lucky because they aren't a big enough fish for most class action lawyers to go after.

 

[SkullV]

LOL I don't care THAT much! I think they are lucky because they aren't a big enough fish for most class action lawyers to go after.

Just as an aside, I'm assuming you are an attorney or at least law student (or looked on wikipedia for class action) by your statements about class action lawsuits and California Penal Code. If that is the case I would really watch saying you found your sources through google as opposed to Lexis, Westlaw, or other respected secondary resource. It really hurts your credibility in a discussion of this nature.

 

[israel.kendall]

Just as an aside, I'm assuming you are an attorney or at least law student (or looked on wikipedia for class action) by your statements about class action lawsuits and California Penal Code. If that is the case I would really watch saying you found your sources through google as opposed to Lexis, Westlaw, or other respected secondary resource. It really hurts your credibility in a discussion of this nature.

Aaaand you would know the difference between civil code and penal. Google coulda taught you that.

 

[SkullV]

Aaaand you would know the difference between civil code and penal. Google coulda taught you that.

You got me, just got done writing a paper for Criminal Law class (model penal code). I did mean civil (although by the way you describe them you would think we are talking about criminals).

The fact is though, they are Limited Edition no matter what you want to say about them. In fact I have a Limited Edition SkullV Purpleonicus chalice in my tank. It is the only SkullV Purpleonicus chalice out there since it is the only one that ever came from my tank. There may be other Purpleonicus out there but not any other SkullV Purpleonicus. Only frags from this mother colony can EVER be called SkullV Purpleonicus making it a LE coral. Now whether or not you care about SkullV corals or would pay anything extra for them is up to you, but it is 100% without a doubt a limited edition coral. People are just more willing to pay for a name sometimes. Consider Old Navy vs. Gap jeans. They are exactly the same (same company), but one says Old Navy and one says Gap. The gap jeans are $20-$30 more. You pay for the name.

 

[israel.kendall]

You got me, just got done writing a paper for Criminal Law class (model penal code). I did mean civil (although by the way you describe them you would think we are talking about criminals).

The fact is though, they are Limited Edition no matter what you want to say about them. In fact I have a Limited Edition SkullV Purpleonicus chalice in my tank. It is the only SkullV Purpleonicus chalice out there since it is the only one that ever came from my tank. There may be other Purpleonicus out there but not any other SkullV Purpleonicus. Only frags from this mother colony can EVER be called SkullV Purpleonicus making it a LE coral. Now whether or not you care about SkullV corals or would pay anything extra for them is up to you, but it is 100% without a doubt a limited edition coral. People are just more willing to pay for a name sometimes. Consider Old Navy vs. Gap jeans. They are exactly the same (same company), but one says Old Navy and one says Gap. The gap jeans are $20-$30 more. You pay for the name.

Hey, you're a law student, you should know that anyone can call their coral a SkullV Purpleonicus unless you trademark your name. Or are you planning on using common law trademark rights? C'mon man.

 

[SkullV]

Hey, you're a law student, you should know that anyone can call their coral a SkullV Purpleonicus unless you trademark your name. Or are you planning on using common law trademark rights? C'mon man.

I never said you would get in trouble legally for calling something Tyree, Fox, Ora, or even SkullV. I just said it would be dishonest and the wrong thing to do.

Your argument was that their corals are not LE, but they did in fact become LE corals the second the colony touched their tanks and received their name.

 

[Jeff]

Israel, I think his point was that corals don't have trademarked names before hitting the tanks at ORA and Tyree and he can call them whatever he wants and charge whatever he wants as well.

 

[israel.kendall]

I never said you would get in trouble legally for calling something Tyree, Fox, Ora, or even SkullV. I just said it would be dishonest and the wrong thing to do.

Your argument was that their corals are not LE, but they did in fact become LE corals the second the colony touched their tanks and received their name.

They are not limited since they cannot control or "limit" the number of them in existence. You're acting like the words have no definition, they do, both literal definitions, and, once you start marketing with them, legal definitions. This is why there are lawsuits over things that were sold as LE.

 

[Jeff]

This thread is a Limited Edition thread.

 

[SkullV]

They are not limited since they cannot control or "limit" the number of them in existence. You're acting like the words have no definition, they do, both literal definitions, and, once you start marketing with them, legal definitions. This is why there are lawsuits over things that were sold as LE.

You don't get it though, a Tyree coral IS limited edition no matter how many are propagated from it because Tyree himself only sold a limited number.

For instance the Long Polyp Toadstool. Once he felt there were a sufficient number out there he stopped selling it. It would be such an easy case to litigate for his attorney. Once the coral is fragged through another tank it is no longer a "Tyree" coral. Only corals that originally came from Tyree are Tyree corals. It would be like you cutting up a coach purse, sewing the ends together and selling the 2 halves as Coach wallets. Only the purse is Coach, the other pieces are Israel.kendall wallets with coach print.

 

[Jeff]

You don't get it though, a Tyree coral IS limited edition no matter how many are propagated from it because Tyree himself only sold a limited number.

For instance the Long Polyp Toadstool. Once he felt there were a sufficient number out there he stopped selling it. It would be such an easy case to litigate for his attorney. Once the coral is fragged through another tank it is no longer a "Tyree" coral. Only corals that originally came from Tyree are Tyree corals. It would be like you cutting up a coach purse, sewing the ends together and selling the 2 halves as Coach wallets. Only the purse is Coach, the other pieces are Israel.kendall wallets with coach print.

Exactly: http://www.reeffarmers.com/limitedsarchophyton.htm
I have this coral and I have fragged and sold it. The frags are still Tyree Toadstools.

 

[franklypre]

at his point you should give up, those wallets would be LE coach wallets. reefing is all about demand, there are no "rare" corals in the hobby due to the laws restricting indangered species. Aquaculture should carry a higher price but to me the linage should carry on with the coral.

 

[tiababygirl2]

LOL !!!!
I can't believe where this has gone ,Just call the coral "Amazing". no I mean everyone here is Amazing .LOL.

 

[SkullV]

at his point you should give up, those wallets would be LE coach wallets. reefing is all about demand, there are no "rare" corals in the hobby due to the laws restricting indangered species. Aquaculture should carry a higher price but to me the linage should carry on with the coral.

Wait, you are being sarcastic about the wallets right?

 

[Cubbies]

Wait, you are being sarcastic about the wallets right?

That's what I was thinking. . .

 

[israel.kendall]

Even if you think it's limited for whatever reason, even though they are perpetually propagated, they still aren't "Editions" either, they are friggin' animals guys.

I give up, if you guys think they are special LE corals, then have at it. I stated my opinion.

 

[mdefo25]

My Chalice Under L.E.D.s!!!