Newbie Corner Feedback-Reefkeeping 101

[wishfish]

cAN you folks recommend any reefkeeping videos for newbies just wanting to set up a fish only with live rock and maybe a fuge?
Thnaks a lot.

 

[SCReefAqua]

This is a really newbie question

This is a really newbie question

Can you put just 30 pounds of live rock in a 65 gallon aquarium?

Why do you need live rock?

I was wanting to do something like a half fish only half reef aquarium in a RSM250. I want to be able to put a lot of fish in there but if I put a lot of rock then I can't put as many fish.

My husband is new to reef aquariums too but has done a lot more reading on this than I have. Instead of telling me where I can find this information out for myself he just wants to tell me. I want to know all aspects. I want to know all opinions.

 

[SarahE]

I've only been doing this for a couple of years but my understanding is that live rock is most important to introduce and house beneficial microorganisms in your tank that will make it a healthier and more natural environment. It will also provide your fish with places to hide and a way to set boundaries on territory. Many fish will be unhappy without the live rock because they have nowhere to house themselves when they are not swimming around the tank.

 

[SCReefAqua]

How do they make a fish only tank then?

I am not questioning what you said I am questioning other metheds. My husband sat down and explained how the LR/LS works, since I have had FW fish for years I know the importance of a filter.

Why can't the filter do the work for the fish wastes and the LR/LS do the work for coral wastes that I put into a half/half? I certainly would only put fish into the tank that can get along with each other and make sure there are a lot of places in the rock I put into the tank for the fish to hide. I just want to put in less than 1 to 1.5 pound per gallon. I am thinking like .5 pounds per gallon. The reason on this is because without rock I can only put 28" of full grown fish in the 250.

Thanks for your help,

 

[Aquarist007]

cAN you folks recommend any reefkeeping videos for newbies just wanting to set up a fish only with live rock and maybe a fuge?
Thnaks a lot.

go onto Utube and do a search and you will find lots

 

[Aquarist007]

How do they make a fish only tank then?

I am not questioning what you said I am questioning other metheds. My husband sat down and explained how the LR/LS works, since I have had FW fish for years I know the importance of a filter.

Why can't the filter do the work for the fish wastes and the LR/LS do the work for coral wastes that I put into a half/half? I certainly would only put fish into the tank that can get along with each other and make sure there are a lot of places in the rock I put into the tank for the fish to hide. I just want to put in less than 1 to 1.5 pound per gallon. I am thinking like .5 pounds per gallon. The reason on this is because without rock I can only put 28" of full grown fish in the 250.

Thanks for your help,

Live rock is the key filtration in your tank. They full process ammonia(fish waste) from ammonia to nitrites to nitrates and then nitrogen gas which bubbles out of your tank completing the cycle.
There are basically two types of bacteria that do this--aerobic and anerobic.
Live rock is able to host both kinds of bacteria. The anerobic bacteria which do not like oxygen can live in the holes deep in the live rock.
Anerobic bacteria are responsible for breaking down nitrates into nitrogen gas

Most filtration systems such as cannister filters, bioballs etc can only support aerobic bacteria.Therefore ammonia is only broken down into nitrates and the nitrate level can increase in the tank.
Fish can handle a rise in nitrates but inverts--corals shrimp snails etc etc cannot.
So in a mixed reef tank you need the live rock to keep down both ammonia and nitrates

In a fish only tank without the live rock the problem of increased nitrates still as to be handled but as stated above the fish can handle higher levels.
Fish only tanks need larger and more frequent water changes, effecient protein skimmers, deep sand beds and refugiums to help them with this.

To your original question you can put as much rock as you want in your tank. However it does limit the amount of fish that you can add and make greater and more frequent water changes necessary.
You also have to be carefull how fast you add fish or increase the bioload.
When you increase the bioload the bacteria on the live rock start to increase there numbers or cycle. This is at a pretty set biological rate and not much can be done to increase the speed of cycling bacteria, However if you have more live rock then you have a base of more bacteria so the actual number of bacteria will increase faster then with less live rock.
Some reefers will add a sump to their system and put the live rock in there. This works the same as the whole system is connected. This allows them to have greater swimming area in the display tank but still have the benefits of a sound filtration system

 

[SCReefAqua]

Re: This is a really newbie question

Re: This is a really newbie question

To your original question you can put as much rock as you want in your tank. However it does limit the amount of fish that you can add and make greater and more frequent water changes necessary.
You also have to be carefull how fast you add fish or increase the bioload.
When you increase the bioload the bacteria on the live rock start to increase there numbers or cycle. This is at a pretty set biological rate and not much can be done to increase the speed of cycling bacteria, However if you have more live rock then you have a base of more bacteria so the actual number of bacteria will increase faster then with less live rock.
Some reefers will add a sump to their system and put the live rock in there. This works the same as the whole system is connected. This allows them to have greater swimming area in the display tank but still have the benefits of a sound filtration system

Thank you Capn!

You basically said everything my husband did but he didn't tell me what would happen one way or the other or give me alternatives like you did.

Last night I thought I was just going to go with the RSM 130d and be done with it because I didn't think this was possible anymore. You have given me hope and I am going with the bigger 250 tank. I will use the accessory connections and hook up a sump full of live rock that would have gone into the tank!

~~I AM SO HAPPY!!~~ :dance:

 

[Aquarist007]

Thank you Capn!

You basically said everything my husband did but he didn't tell me what would happen one way or the other or give me alternatives like you did.

Last night I thought I was just going to go with the RSM 130d and be done with it because I didn't think this was possible anymore. You have given me hope and I am going with the bigger 250 tank. I will use the accessory connections and hook up a sump full of live rock that would have gone into the tank!

~~I AM SO HAPPY!!~~ :dance:

r


good luck and please post your progress:thumbsup:

 

[SarahE]

I'd say just use a sump and put the rock in there if you don't want it taking up space in the tank.

 

[USA203]

[HTMLMost filtration systems such as cannister filters, bioballs etc can only support aerobic bacteria.Therefore ammonia is only broken down into nitrates and the nitrate level can increase in the tank.
Fish can handle a rise in nitrates but inverts--corals shrimp snails etc etc cannot.
So in a mixed reef tank you need the live rock to keep down both ammonia and nitrates

][/HTML]

Thanks for asking the question and thanks for the answer! I have all the good stuff (LR, LS) but I was also wondering what the difference really was between the filtration of the LR/LS and all the organic bio stuff I added to my special bio canister bin. It's always better to understand why it really works And it answers a question I currently have--I'm still cycling and have only nitrate left and could not figure out how that was going to "go away" without big water changes--AH HA (light goes on)

 

[craazybelly]

adding some elements?

adding some elements?

Hello, as you might be able to tell, im a newbie :fun2: and i would really like to know what you guys think about adding purple up to your tank also b-ionic calcium buffer system component #1 alkalinity and component #2 calcium. also can these 3 be added together? i have a 92gl bowfront reef tank (few corals and 2 black clowns) i would apreciate the help. thank in advance!!:fun2:

 

[jkfuel]

I'm a newb. Is it worth it to get built in overflows or just pick up a regular tank and buy HOB?

 

[Aquarist007]

Hello, as you might be able to tell, im a newbie :fun2: and i would really like to know what you guys think about adding purple up to your tank also b-ionic calcium buffer system component #1 alkalinity and component #2 calcium. also can these 3 be added together? i have a 92gl bowfront reef tank (few corals and 2 black clowns) i would apreciate the help. thank in advance!!:fun2:

Keep your alkalinity at 11.5 dkh and your calcium above for a while and you will get the same results as purple up with less cash output.
I believe that Purpleup i hgh in alk to bring up the alkalinity as I suggested above. Using it along with b-ionic two part could put the alk level up too high.

 

[Aquarist007]

I'm a newb. Is it worth it to get built in overflows or just pick up a regular tank and buy HOB?

IME you will not regret spending the extra to have your tank drilled. It is a much safer way to go. You will pay more for the external overflow box then you will for having the tank drilled.
In Ontario it costs about 150 bucks for a good overflow and 50 bucks to have the tank drilled.

 

[Aquarist007]

[HTMLMost filtration systems such as cannister filters, bioballs etc can only support aerobic bacteria.Therefore ammonia is only broken down into nitrates and the nitrate level can increase in the tank.
Fish can handle a rise in nitrates but inverts--corals shrimp snails etc etc cannot.
So in a mixed reef tank you need the live rock to keep down both ammonia and nitrates

][/HTML]

Thanks for asking the question and thanks for the answer! I have all the good stuff (LR, LS) but I was also wondering what the difference really was between the filtration of the LR/LS and all the organic bio stuff I added to my special bio canister bin. It's always better to understand why it really works And it answers a question I currently have--I'm still cycling and have only nitrate left and could not figure out how that was going to "go away" without big water changes--AH HA (light goes on)

The live rock can process ammonia to nitrates to nitrogen gas which bubbles out of the system
Most artificial media can only process ammonia to nitrates. After time the nitrates build up and are exported back into your system

 

[Paul B]

and i would really like to know what you guys think about adding purple up to your tank also b-ionic calcium buffer system component #1 alkalinity and component #2 calcium.

No, save your money on the purple up, you don't need it and neither does your corals.
But you do need to add some type of calcium.

You will find multitudes of additives that are supposed to do all sorts of things but basically you need calcium, nothing else.
Just my opinion but that is all I add and my tank is rather old and running nicely.

 

[Gobby]

Hello all,
Its been a while since I have been on the forum. We're in the process of helping some high school students setup some reef tanks. The articles from Waterkeeper are always a big help. Can someone tell me why the article links on the first page of this thread are not working?

Gobby

 

[Sugar Magnolia]

Hello all,
Its been a while since I have been on the forum. We're in the process of helping some high school students setup some reef tanks. The articles from Waterkeeper are always a big help. Can someone tell me why the article links on the first page of this thread are not working?

Gobby

There is a problem with the Reefkeeping magazine right now so the links won't work until that issue is resolved. The admins are working to fix the problem. Sorry for the inconvenience.

 

[Aquatankstud]

tank cycling help!

tank cycling help!

Hey there, ran into a problem today need someones advice! I started a 30 gal tank a lil over 2 weeks ago....i got more live rock today to add in to help it cycle....problem is, one of the rocks i got has a lil tiny baby coral on it....is this going to throw off or mess up my tank cycle? if it dies what will happen to the cycle?? please help anyone thanks

 

[Paul B]

No, it is not going to do anything, don't worry about it.
Paul