Night mode/ reduced flow, good idea?
- Thread starter dan223
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Atomikk
SPS OG
Good observation. Did the polyps come out because its the safest at night to feed? Most likely. But they also respire and take up the available oxygen, just like the sleeping fish. Because there is no oxygen being produced at night (as far as I know), any available will be used up quickly. This is why it is important to give your tank enough gas exchange so that the available air (which you breathe in) will be mixed into your aquarium's water.
Allmost
New member
Makes sense . I too run my sump/fuge light on reverse although no algae but yes the PE is much better at night.
So can't be PH. Now of course more planktonic creatures surface at nights in ocean, so that must be the reason for better PE + less predators awake and lack of intense lighting. All reasons it's better to have full flow at nights as well as days and to feed corals at night.
I have thought of lowering the flow for the fish at the past, but I figured they each have their way of sleeping in high currents, blue tang can't so it sleeps within one of my sps branches, clowns in an anemone and ...
Allmost
New member
Exactly
Acrotrdco
New member
It feels right to you, as a human, but we human shouldn't enforce what we "feel right" to animals from another realm.
For instance, fishes do not have eye lids, they sleep with their eye open, this is probably an experience we could never understand.
Another example, if you've hold a torch at night peaking at the activities happening in your tank, you'll notice it's a different world.
Copepods, snake stars, snails, worms and other stuff (especially if you've sand bed) start coming to live a few hours after the light goes out.
So, why put your pumps in night mode when half your tank's inhabitants are just waking up to their daily activities?
gavij012379
Member
It is true that with no photosynthesis at night, oxygen is not produced and that's why pH goes down at night. And it is true that the flow in our tanks is what adds the new air along with oxygen to our tank water. But if you just shut off one out of 3-4 pumps in ur tank, everyone should still have enough oxygen to survive. Especially since the fish are less active at night (In my opinion these take up the most O2), they should be okay. I think just the return pump should be enough to meet the O2 demand. And we don't need all the flow to bring food to our tank since it is a closed system. Of course I am not saying shut down everything.
I run my Vortech in night mode and leave the other pumps as is during night. I just don't like the idea of 24/7 pounding the coral with constant flow. I wish I could have random flow in my tank.
Acrotrdco
New member
It's funny how, when we've been trying SO hard to mimic the real ocean with sophiscated equipments such as wave makers, LED with dimming abilities, or even computer controlled tidal/lunar cycles, then people put their pumps on night mode because they don't like corals being pounded constantly.
In the ocean, corals ARE being pounded by waves constantly, it doesn't stop at night, in fact, corals depends on these "pounding" to survive in the nature. Fishes were born to that kind of environment, it's in their blood, their instinct on how to sleep under those conditions, it won't bother them.
Some of the staghorns grow really thick in order to withstand the pounding from the waves, that's also one of the reasons why some wild staghorn colonies are MUCH thicker than the ones we kept in our aquarium, because we just couldn't simulate the power of a real wave in our aquariums without fearing whether the glass would be able to sustain that kind of pounding.
The verdict really is, full blast away folks, the water movement from your tiny winny pumps is NOTHING close to the actual wave in the ocean.
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Alex T.
Active member
There's been a lot of banter back and forth regarding whether it's good or not to leave your pumps on at full blast when night mode is an option. If you have the ability to enter night mode, then by all means do it. You are not going to deplete your system of oxygen by reducing flow to the 40% maximum that a pump like the Vortech night mode is programmed for.
Also, for those saying that the ocean doesn't slow down at night, this is absolutely, 100% false. The ocean absolutely, undeniably slows down at night. If it didn't, the entire ocean would have the water movement of a lake. I notice many of you don't even live near the shore, but I can assure you that there is absolute science that proves the ocean slows down at night. It's called the moon, and it is responsible for the tides, and the winds that keep our precious Earth in perfect harmony. As the moon moves over the night sky, its' gravitational pull (which is upwards) has a pulling affect on the sea and the wind/air below. This pull is enough to fight the daytime lateral tendency of moving current and slows it down by pulling the sea and air upward at a given rate, thus giving less lateral turbulence and wave swells.
I've been surfing for 28 years in 3 oceans and there is not an avid surfer alive that doesn't know this. We use the term "glassy" to describe the incoming morning swell on a good day. What this really means is that the first sets of the morning tide are beginning to come in and they are further apart than they will be by midday when the moon's pull has lost its' affect. As surfers we like this because the waves are "cleaner" and better formed with less wind which can make for a better and longer ride. By noon or maybe even earlier, sets get closer together with more foam in them from added turbulence in the water and wind in the air. This is why many surfers are seen in the water when the sun comes up, and just before it goes down.
Unfortunately, sharks and other predators know this too, and often use this added calmness as their primary feeding hours when they have the advantage of speed with less resistance. If you have the means, you don't need to be watching the ocean to observe this affect. On your next vacation to whatever tropical destination you may be headed for, pay attention to the sound of the ocean from the beach during the day. Then, after dinner take a late night stroll with your significant other and listen again. Aside from a storm rolling in, I guarantee you the sound will be more faint and less frequent as the night ocean laps at the shore in a much different way than 10 hours prior.
So, while it is true that the ocean doesn't stop, it most definitely is less turbulent.
Also, for those saying that the ocean doesn't slow down at night, this is absolutely, 100% false. The ocean absolutely, undeniably slows down at night. If it didn't, the entire ocean would have the water movement of a lake. I notice many of you don't even live near the shore, but I can assure you that there is absolute science that proves the ocean slows down at night. It's called the moon, and it is responsible for the tides, and the winds that keep our precious Earth in perfect harmony. As the moon moves over the night sky, its' gravitational pull (which is upwards) has a pulling affect on the sea and the wind/air below. This pull is enough to fight the daytime lateral tendency of moving current and slows it down by pulling the sea and air upward at a given rate, thus giving less lateral turbulence and wave swells.
I've been surfing for 28 years in 3 oceans and there is not an avid surfer alive that doesn't know this. We use the term "glassy" to describe the incoming morning swell on a good day. What this really means is that the first sets of the morning tide are beginning to come in and they are further apart than they will be by midday when the moon's pull has lost its' affect. As surfers we like this because the waves are "cleaner" and better formed with less wind which can make for a better and longer ride. By noon or maybe even earlier, sets get closer together with more foam in them from added turbulence in the water and wind in the air. This is why many surfers are seen in the water when the sun comes up, and just before it goes down.
Unfortunately, sharks and other predators know this too, and often use this added calmness as their primary feeding hours when they have the advantage of speed with less resistance. If you have the means, you don't need to be watching the ocean to observe this affect. On your next vacation to whatever tropical destination you may be headed for, pay attention to the sound of the ocean from the beach during the day. Then, after dinner take a late night stroll with your significant other and listen again. Aside from a storm rolling in, I guarantee you the sound will be more faint and less frequent as the night ocean laps at the shore in a much different way than 10 hours prior.
So, while it is true that the ocean doesn't stop, it most definitely is less turbulent.
Acrotrdco
New member
There're several things I'd like to point out:
1. What you've noticed, is that the surface of the ocean becomes slower at night, this is because during day time, the land heats up faster than surface of ocean, therefore the wind blows from the ocean to the land, and thus pushing waves toward shores.
At night, the land cools off faster than the surface of the ocean, therefore the wind blows from the land back to the ocean, and there'll be less waves.
The surface of the ocean where you can see is about 10-20m (30-60ft), the actual "Surface Circulation" ocean current means the top 400m of the ocean, is affected by several factors:
* Solar Heating
* Winds
* Gravity
* Coriolis
http://earth.usc.edu/~stott/Catalina/Oceans.html
Just because you noticed there're less waves on the surface of the water, doesn't mean oceanic "surface circulation" slows down.
2. The tidal cycle comes in different times depends on your location. For example:
CA (West Coast) - high tides comes in 2pm PST
http://tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov/data_menu.shtml?stn=9410660 Los Angeles, CA&type=Tide Data
FL (East Cost) - high tides comes in 10am EST, with a second peak at 10pm
http://tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov/data_menu.shtml?stn=8720030 Fernandina Beach, FL&type=Tide Data
Hong Kong (SE Asia) - high tides comes in 0:00am midnight HKT, with a second peak at noon 12:00pm
http://www.weather.gov.hk/tide/eKLWtide.htm
Therefore while it's true that lunar cycle will have a strong impact on ocean current, it doesn't mean "surface circulation" it's always calmer at night.
In fact, the pulling of lunar cycle has such a strong impact on the oceanic current, that when tide comes in and out, the water turbulence under the surface of ocean is very strong.
So for example, in SE Asia Pacific, the "surface circulation" is very strong at night, since the tide comes in during the evening hours, and reach the highest at midnight, then slowly recedes away until the lowest tide around 6am, over the entire night, water comes in and out, so why would it be calmer at night?
p.s. most of the SPS corals come from the SE Asia Pacific, this is even more important since you should be mimic the natural habitat of your corals.
3. The smallest amount of turbulent under sea, is several dozen times (if not stronger) than the water current generated by our pumps, therefore even leaving it at max speed, couldn't even mimic a fraction of the force of nature.
I've saw documentry footage before about what a coastal reef would look like after a mild storm, it's devastating but this is what mother nature does to regulate our climates.
Given the option, folks could always set their pumps at night mode if they feel it's better, but I'm just saying, the oceanic current at night isn't really that calm and marine creatures are designed to live with that, therefore I'd like to give them an environment as close to the natural habitat as possible meaning I'll be leaving my pumps on full blast at night.
aqua80
New member
agree with what you said !
but just to mention that high/low tides hours drift constantly every day because the moon takes 24 hours and 50 minutes to return to the same spot in relation with the earth, so the next high tide time tomorrow will be about 50 minutes later than today's high tides and so on...
so the data you quote is only true for that particular day...
aqua80
New member
so that is too deep for the surface waves (calmer at night and rougher in the day because of the winds) to impact on them no ?
(and for the moon, well the moon doesn't care about day and night, she's just revolving around the earth and will be above us day and night )
Acrotrdco
New member
Why ReefCrest and not EcoSmart??
Either way I run FULL BLAST 24/7! If you have ever been night diving you will know that sometimes the current can be even greater at night!
Dallas
I used Reef Crest with my 2x MP10wES because I've observed (yes observed, I sat there for hours watching the drivers) that when you've two or more pumps on anti sync running TSM the master always run between 50-100% thrust and the slave runs between 20-50% thrust, which means I'm not getting most of the juice from the slave.
Running Reef Crest and I've observed that both alternates between 10-100% which is better IMO.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
LifeAquatic
New member
night mode
night mode
Ive been using nightmode for over a year with the Mp-40's. Honestly, I dont see positive or negative affects form using nightmode. It really only helps to keep the electric bill cheaper.
night mode
Ive been using nightmode for over a year with the Mp-40's. Honestly, I dont see positive or negative affects form using nightmode. It really only helps to keep the electric bill cheaper.
Acrotrdco
New member
MP40 uses 9-28w of power, in night mode (running at 50%) you'll probably save ~10w over a span of 10 hours, or about 3kwh per month. Depends on where you live it'll be roughly about a quarter every month you'd be saving on each MP40 you run.
I'd rather spend that money and make sure my corals are getting as close to the real oceanic habitat.
Have you previously run the MP40s without night mode and compared the difference? Otherwise it'd be hard for you to say there's no positive or negative effects from using it, since I've noticed that my SPS have much better PE at night (see page 1) when I run it on Reef Crest mode compared to prior running TSM on Anti-sync, as I've explained in the previous post, that the slave pump was actually running at half thrust if not less, i.e. less turnover at night.
Alex T.
Active member
Aqua80, actually the waves do impact the corals. If some of the reefs are exposed or even within 15-20 feet deep at low tide, they're definitely impacted by wave surges. Try pouring a pitcher of ro water into your tank for topoff from 12 - 16 inches above the surface and let me know if your sand moves. A waves surge and break is much deeper than the face that we see from the shoreline. I still bare the scars on my right leg where a staghorn coral in Fiji pierced my thigh when I wiped out on a 15 foot wave right into the trough. Large waves are inherently available in reef areas because they present an obstacle to the tidal swell. The wave sucks the water up from the reef that is normally 30-40 feet deep and can gash or kill you if you fall on it at the wrong time when it's only 10 feet below the surface. Pieces of staghorn acroporas are constantly being bombarded and broken in the high surge reef zones throughout the Indo-Pacific. Now that I'm a reefer, I actually seek out the areas around reefs because this always seems to be where a you can catch some of the best swells.
We can argue the science of it all day long. Wave sets are calmer at night. Always have been and always will be. If the ocean reached equilibrium from equal day and night activity then there would be no surges...just one large swoosh around the Earth that was unobstructed. But, alas, it is not. The difference between low and high tide at night is most often a larger time apart. That in itself should tell you something. Currents are not constant my friends. I'm not simply speaking from opinion. Head to your local fishing pier and ask the commercial fisherman why they leave before the sun comes up to get into deeper water. It's not because they're early risers. The idea of water moving without wave surges at the same current as the day is folly. You simply can't move that amount of water at the same rate without wave swells. They're a result of not just wind...but a stronger tide. Whether this truly affects corals in particular I don't know. I've surfed Bali, Fiji, Australia, Hawaii and other remote Pacific and Indian Ocean destinations. I can tell you truly that if you were to swim out past dark in a well lit beach area it's much easier to get through the current. If it were just as strong during the day my surfing buddies and I would have noticed after all these years when it was too good to come in at dusk and then it just died. Don't take my word for it. Go to the beach at night if you live near one and go for a swim. Judge for yourself.
I also remember a time when we were in Tahiti. We were waiting for the morning high tide to come in. The first sets are the best.:thumbsup:Anyhow, this was before I got into reefkeeping. There was a channel through the reef that we used to paddle through. The reef was exposed in some spots and had a very distinct odor. Now I know that the odor I smelled was acropora. We've all smelled our frags out of the water. Imagine an entire reef flat blowing that smell into your face. The locals had warned us to get past the breakers and the reef and sit behind the reef for about 20 minutes after the tide rolled in. Then the sets started peeling beautifully. Now the reef was totally underwater and the risk of injury had declined. If we had taken one of the first waves coming in and fell, there's a strong chance I could have lost a limb or been badly maimed.
We can argue the science of it all day long. Wave sets are calmer at night. Always have been and always will be. If the ocean reached equilibrium from equal day and night activity then there would be no surges...just one large swoosh around the Earth that was unobstructed. But, alas, it is not. The difference between low and high tide at night is most often a larger time apart. That in itself should tell you something. Currents are not constant my friends. I'm not simply speaking from opinion. Head to your local fishing pier and ask the commercial fisherman why they leave before the sun comes up to get into deeper water. It's not because they're early risers. The idea of water moving without wave surges at the same current as the day is folly. You simply can't move that amount of water at the same rate without wave swells. They're a result of not just wind...but a stronger tide. Whether this truly affects corals in particular I don't know. I've surfed Bali, Fiji, Australia, Hawaii and other remote Pacific and Indian Ocean destinations. I can tell you truly that if you were to swim out past dark in a well lit beach area it's much easier to get through the current. If it were just as strong during the day my surfing buddies and I would have noticed after all these years when it was too good to come in at dusk and then it just died. Don't take my word for it. Go to the beach at night if you live near one and go for a swim. Judge for yourself.
I also remember a time when we were in Tahiti. We were waiting for the morning high tide to come in. The first sets are the best.:thumbsup:Anyhow, this was before I got into reefkeeping. There was a channel through the reef that we used to paddle through. The reef was exposed in some spots and had a very distinct odor. Now I know that the odor I smelled was acropora. We've all smelled our frags out of the water. Imagine an entire reef flat blowing that smell into your face. The locals had warned us to get past the breakers and the reef and sit behind the reef for about 20 minutes after the tide rolled in. Then the sets started peeling beautifully. Now the reef was totally underwater and the risk of injury had declined. If we had taken one of the first waves coming in and fell, there's a strong chance I could have lost a limb or been badly maimed.
